AJ SUB 4 ATTEMP TOMORROW @ 9

yeah bane is playing but come on seriously, f***ing OUTBREAK and MLIW!

aj is just a step behind solinsky in terms of shape, since they both win about as often as the other, in terms of their senior year. but i consider aj to be more of a miler while solinsky was much better at the deuce. plus, aj has A WHOLE RACE WITH THE SOLE PURPOSE OF GETTING HIM SUB 4! but still i think it fail will miserably and even if it goes well, he'll run around 401

Mee wrote:

And really, the times being run by Americans are faster than in the 80's.

Another one? wrote:

No, they aren't. Take a look at the all-time top-10 U.S. performer's lists at the men's Olympic distance events (1500m-and-up). Now, subtract the "naturalized" citizens from the list...today's kids don't get credit for Lagat, for example.

You will find that the majority of the runners on those list still pre-date 1990!

Take a look at the high school results.

Sub-9:00 2-milers, 1964 – 2003

1964 * (1)

1965 * (1)

1966 ** (2)

1967 ** (2)

1968 * (1)

1969 ****** (6)

1970 ****** (6)

1971 ******** (8)

1972 *********** (11)

1973 ********** (10)

1974 ************* (13)

1975 ************ (12)

1976 ***************** (17)

1977 ************** (14)

1978 *** (3)

1979 ************ (12)

1980 ******** (8)

1981 *********** (11)

1982 **** (4)

1983 ********* (9)

1984 *** (3)

1985 **** (4)

1986 ******** (8)

1987 ********* (9)

1988 *** (3)

1989 *** (3)

1990 *** (3)

1991 * (1)

1992

1993

1994 ** (2)

1995 *** (3)

1996 * (1)

1997 *** (3)

1998 * (1)

1999 ******* (7)

2000 *********** (11)

2001 ***** (5)

2002 ******* (7)

2003 ********************** (22)

4-year increments

1964 – 1967: 6

1968 – 1971: 21

1972 – 1975: 46

1976 – 1979: 46

1980 – 1983: 32

1984 – 1987: 24

1988 – 1991: 10

1992 – 1995: 5

1996 – 1999: 12

2000 – 2003: 45

There were 62 sub-9:00 performances from 1980 to 1989. Just in the first 4 years of the 2000's there were 45. I'd say runners are certainly faster than the 80's. In fact, the 80's are when things started going downhill, just look at the graph.

too much Dyestat wrote:

good to see you are citing biased sources.

how much more biased could Dyestat.com, the guys who run it, and the AJ minions that go there to worship him be? hell, Acosta comes to this site and kisses his own ass.

Bryce wrote:

Acosta is a great runner and has a fierce competitive edge from what I've seen. For 18 he has a good grip on reality from what I've read.

I am not citing sources you geek, what do think I'm doing writing a term paper? I am trying to show some support to an AMerican kid that wants to run fast. I don't understand why you'd come on this thread just to knock someone? Go somewhere else.

kotter wrote:

yeah bane is playing but come on seriously, f***ing OUTBREAK and MLIW!

I have no idea who you kids are, but I am glad you are listening to straight edge bands. Make sure you check out my friends band Betrayed, they have an incredible new record coming out.

If you haven't already checked them out, here ya go -

dude WHAT THE F***? YOU KNOW BETRAYED? which one of them are you friends with? yes, betrayed is F***ing amazing, for those not in the know. pick up substance out july 11th on equal vision records

My friend is Greg, he played in Carry On.

Add to the above:

2004: 14 sub-9:00 + 3 converted 3200's (sub 8:56.8) = 17 total

2005: 6 sub-9:00

So there were 62 sub-9:00 in the 1980s (10 years) and from 2000-2005 (6 years) there were 68 sub-9:00. At this rate 2000-2009 is going to be the most successful decade yet, even better than the 70s.

Another one? wrote:

Take a look at the all-time top-10 U.S. performer's lists at the men's Olympic distance events (1500m-and-up)...

Mr. Correction Dude wrote:

Take a look at the high school results.

Which part of my original statement was overly difficult for you to comprehend? You can't state that "I'd say runners are certainly faster than the 80's" based upon high school results.

People like Julia Stamps and Jeff Nelson produced some fantastic high school results, but exactly where are they on the all-time U.S. lists as adults? Would you try to quantify the overall quality of the previous U.S. men's Olympic basketball teams based upon what the kids were doing at the local public HS at the time? Of course not, that's ridiculous...and so is your counter-point.

Why don't you go back and re-read my original statement. I realize those "logic" and "facts" principles can be a little confusing, but I'm confident that you can interpret that material correctly without claiming that the 2003 kindergarten runners were superior!

Mr. Correction Dude wrote:

4-year increments

1964 – 1967: 6

1968 – 1971: 21

1972 – 1975: 46

1976 – 1979: 46

1980 – 1983: 32

1984 – 1987: 24

1988 – 1991: 10

1992 – 1995: 5

1996 – 1999: 12

2000 – 2003: 45

The lists you are using only tell part of the story. They tell the number of PERFORMERS not PERFORMANCES. In other words the yearly totals you list are actually lower than the number of performers in each year who ran sub 9:00. The lastest year in every list will be inflated by the number of Juniors and Sophomores who break 9:00 during the year.

The Hoffman list only lists PRs and in which year they were set.

Another one? wrote:

Take a look at the all-time top-10 U.S. performer's lists at the men's Olympic distance events (1500m-and-up). Now, subtract the "naturalized" citizens from the list...today's kids don't get credit for Lagat, for example. You will find that the majority of the runners on those list still pre-date 1990!

It's sad, but true. We ARE catchin up, though!!!

America's professional milers of the early 80s were plainly faster. Just look at the speed of these milers.

Steve Scott - 3:47

Sidney Maree - 3:48

Jim Spivey - 3:49

Tom Byers - 3:50

Todd Harbour - 3:50

John Gregorek - 3:51

Tim Hacker - 3:51

In 1982 3 Americans were ranked in the worlds top ten; making it the best year ever for US milers.

Steve Scott was ranked 2nd in the workd in 82, which was the year he set the American record.

You have a valid point with the list, but comparing their world rankings is meaningless. The world is at a whole new level now.

AH wrote:

You have a valid point with the list, but comparing their world rankings is meaningless. The world is at a whole new level now.

Of course you're right, but comparing how athletes did against their peers from the same era is the only fair way to judge historically.

This same point has been debated on these boards countless times. Would you say that Wejo himself is a better distance runner than Nurmi and Zatopek? He has run faster than they did, hasn't he? However, the medals that the aforementioned legends have won against their peers speak volumes.

That's why the point about the pre-90's U.S. distance runners is so important. Over that same time period, the Kenyan and Ethiopian all-time national top-10 lists have been completely rewritten! In stark contrast, the American lists are still heavily populated with runners from twenty years ago.

In other words, the world's best kept progressing, while American's were primarily stagnant.

As someone else said, sad but true.

Another one? wrote:

That's why the point about the pre-90's U.S. distance runners is so important. Over that same time period, the Kenyan and Ethiopian all-time national top-10 lists have been completely rewritten! In stark contrast, the American lists are still heavily populated with runners from twenty years ago.

In other words, the world's best kept progressing, while American's were primarily stagnant.

As someone else said, sad but true.

it is easier to get away with drug use in africa

he lost his shoes, he's done for

Sallberg ran 3:56 downhill at the State Street Mile last month. If you click the results link at USATF Southern California Section, which will take you to the State Street Mile and results and photos, there's a photo showing him crossing the finish line at 3:53. I was there and timed him at 3:54. The descent of the grade is 100' for the mile. Sallberg is the 4th ranked steeple chaser in the U.S. with a 8:28. I'd say the he and Bolota, a 2004 Olympian, ain't a bad field. It should be an exciting race, wish I could see it.

4:03...too bad

403.9

didnt do it