Withheld wrote:
Davila is has run better than anything Dathan has run in the Marathon. How can you say that these groups have not produced athletes that have run at Dathan's level in the Marathon?
So has Gotcher and Arciniaga
Withheld wrote:
Davila is has run better than anything Dathan has run in the Marathon. How can you say that these groups have not produced athletes that have run at Dathan's level in the Marathon?
So has Gotcher and Arciniaga
I would like to see Ritzenhein finally blitz one and run 2:05/2:06, but realistically speaking, I think he'll end up in the 2:07/2:08 range.
2:07:49
The great thing about our sport is there is no such thing as a fluke. You run a given time because you're prepared for it and in shape for it.
The explanation is simple and logical.
I don't think we will ever see him on the track again.
He had a marathon PR this year but did not approach his track PR's and was not competetive in the Olympic 10,000.
He only ran on the track because he missed making the marathon team and wanted to go back to the Olympics.
Does he need a significant PR to stick with the marathon?
No. He doesn't need a PR at all. If he "only" runs 2:10, that's good enough, as an American, to keep getting good money to run the marathon.
He's not going to get better on the track at this point while others are.
He's not going to be the top American in the 5 or the 10 but he has a shot at being the top American in the marathon.
How he perform in Chicago has no bearing on whether he decides to focus on track as far as I can tell.
He is now a marathoner.
Yeah I 100% agree. Honestly I'm hoping he bombs horribly so he finally realizes he is best fit for the track. Given his history of marathons, I expect him to either bomb or show only very marginal improvement. The previous marathons were good to build his strength, but he's got to realize now that speed is what he needs. If he does run well, I hope he realizes it's in the context of the good speed work he did leading into London.
I read an interview were he was talking about this being the first marathon where he had been healthy for a long time. Anyone remember London 2009? He had been healthy for a while I recall and totally bombed there so I don't see Chicago going much better.
I would love to see Dathan run 2:06 or 2:07 low; however, after making the 10000m squad he stated he would focus on the track SO HE COULD be competitive. Dathan is about to be 30 years old and have 3-5 years in which he can improve on his 5000m/10000m time and I don't know who changed his mind from July to now about refocusing on the marathon AGAIN!
VIPAM wrote:
I don't know who changed his mind from July to now about refocusing on the marathon AGAIN!
Track season is over. What exactly do you think Ritz should be doing this time of year? Consider what worked for him in 2009.
2:08:45 for 8th and then more excuses..
because excuses keep the hype up and the appearance $$$$$ up!!
Because the sustained focus on the marathon has already costed him everything in terms to the 5k
ReallyReally wrote:
ttc
Are you really trying to compare Meb to Dathan. Meb keep getting better the longer the race went as he never was able to run a sub 4 minute mile or sub 13:10. Dathan has much more foot speed then Meb and his best performance is in the shorter distances like 5000m, 10000m, and 1/2 marathon.
Dathan ran 12:56 off limited training and then got injuried. Dathan DEFINITELY should've concentrated on the 10000m for 2013 and maybe planned a 2013 fall marathon. He has never given himself at least a year and half of injury free training and focused on the 5000m/10000m. He is too busy trying to train for a marathon and getting injuried.
It was great that Meb grab a medal back in 2004; however, since then Olympic and World marathons medals aren't typical in the 2:09 category anymore; therefore, Dathan needs to be able to run 2:06-2:07 to be a contender.
Except for this years Worlds none of the Championship medals were 2:09! Bust a 2:07 Dathan or give up the marathon, PLEASE.
Meb won a medal in 2004 & finished 4th in 2012. Meb's 27:13 PR is much better than his marathon one. But like Ritz, he's better suited to world champs @ 26.2. Ritz has 3 Olympics & his marathon is his best placing. He can grind an olympic race & imo would've finished top 6-7 in London '12.
Stronger point than pr's is, can you ever see Ritz close to accelerating like the world's top 5K'ers? Manzano & Meb are 2 of our recent distance medals, showing pr's are not the only criteria.
2009Worlds wrote:
FORGET the marathon. Dathan Ritzenhein ran a personal best of 27:22 during a major championships and since haven't been healthy long enough to improve on his 10000m potential. The guy finished 6th and beat many international runners who are still focusing on the track 10000m. I agree with an earlier poster who said improving his track personal best would improve his appearance fees because unless he runs 2:07 on a flat course then he is just showing up for the appearance fees.
Worlds 2009 10000m Final
1. Kenenisa Bekele (Eth)....26:46.31
2. Zersenay Tadese (Eri)....26:50.12
3. Moses Ndiema Masai (Ken).26:57.39
4. Irmane Merga (Eth).......27:15.94
5. Bernard Kipyego (Ken)....27:18.47
6. DATHAN RITZENHEIN (USA)..27:22.67
7. Micah Kogo (Ken).........27:26.33
8. GALEN RUPP (USA).........27:37.99
9. Kidane Tadasse (Eri).....27:41.50
10.Gebregz Gebremariam (Eth)27:44.01
11.Ahmad Ha Abdullah (Qat)..27:45.03
12.Teklemariam Medhin (Eri).27:58.89
only sub 28 finishers shown out of 20 competitors and note Dathan beat Galen.
I've been arguing for the marathon. But this is a heckuva post.
Re: Ritz finishing with the best in a 5-10k
He did PR for a 400 in practice this year, so it sounded like he was making progress with that. I got the impression he had never worked on his speed in a concerted way. If he can get into 12:50/26:50 shape, closing with a high 5x after a long push could very likely get him a medal.
I honestly feel that Dathan knows his best distance on the track is 10000m and on the road 1/2 marathon and saying what the marathon directors need to hear to get a bigger appearance fee. When he stated he was focusing on the track this year it sound likely he finely realized that the marathon isn't his speciality.
It's gonna be very hard to run 2:06 off 5000m/10000m training with a couple months of marathon training. Nothing wrong with him getting paid while still focusing on the 5000m/10000m!
How many people realized that Dathan beat Galen in the 2009 Worlds Championships 10000m Final? Dathan could very well run 12:48-50 and 26:30-35 if he could stay healthy and focused on the track for the next several years!
VIPAM wrote:
I honestly feel that Dathan knows his best distance on the track is 10000m and on the road 1/2 marathon and saying what the marathon directors need to hear to get a bigger appearance fee. When he stated he was focusing on the track this year it sound likely he finely realized that the marathon isn't his speciality.
It's gonna be very hard to run 2:06 off 5000m/10000m training with a couple months of marathon training. Nothing wrong with him getting paid while still focusing on the 5000m/10000m!
How many people realized that Dathan beat Galen in the 2009 Worlds Championships 10000m Final? Dathan could very well run 12:48-50 and 26:30-35 if he could stay healthy and focused on the track for the next several years!
Given Ritz' attributes, cleaning up his last few marathon miles is much more attainable than getting him to be a medal-quality closer in the 5K/10K.
Racing Meb-quality is more feasible than going stride-for-stride with the fastest in a blazing 5K/10K finish.
If Ritz can take it down to 2:08 low with an out of the blue 2:07, there is a good chance this can crown him top american for awhile considering the rest are on a downward curve. I have to question if he returns to track which is not in its heyday anymore (it isn't the 90's, nobody's running any times except rudisha and the 800 gang, and any distance guy who is any good goes straight to marathon today) and even if he runs sub 13 a few times nobody except enthusiasts will remember past a couple days. But as america's top marathoner that will reach more deeply and widely than any more difficult track achievements can achieve.
Did you not see how Dathan closed during his 12:56 5000m personal best/former American Record? If you saying Dathan can't kick when he is healthy and fully fit then you don't know track and field! There are ways to burn the kick off guys but very few are brave enough to try- heck even the Kenyans give away medals to kicks without trying but a fully fit and healthy Dathan would try in the 10000m. Especially training with guys like Mo and Galen.
I have no idea what the point of this thread is. The man has already said that he is running Chicago and then is going to concentrate on the track for 2013. He's going to be on the exact same schedule as Mo and Galen for the entire year. So he run track all spring and summer and then does 1 marathon in the fall after track season. How could anybody in their right mind argue with that strategy? As for coaching, Mahon and Larson are the only current US coaches that have had "medal" success. Hansons have done well with Davilla. McMillan has done nothing. Schumacher has shown any great brilliance either. Flanagan and Goucher finished 10 and 11, which is about where they would have finished training under anyone. I'd say Salazar is as good a marathon coach as any of them. I strongly believe that by the time Farah, Rupp and Ritz are done, Salazar will look like a pretty good marathon coach.
VIPAM wrote:
Did you not see how Dathan closed during his 12:56 5000m personal best/former American Record? If you saying Dathan can't kick when he is healthy and fully fit then you don't know track and field! There are ways to burn the kick off guys but very few are brave enough to try- heck even the Kenyans give away medals to kicks without trying but a fully fit and healthy Dathan would try in the 10000m. Especially training with guys like Mo and Galen.
Ritz closed in 60 secs & 2:00.
That does not fly in a world final. Like I said, he doesn't close well enough.
ttc
Please open your eyes and refrain from just focusing on the points that fit your opinion, try to be objective. Dathan started his drive in 6th or 7th place, over 5 seconds behind 2nd place, and the drive was from over 1250m out not 800m. His sustained drive enable him to take over 2nd place by the during the last lap in which he was spent but insisted on trying to catch Bekele who was now only 2 seconds ahead.
So don't just spit out his last 800m when his drive was from much further out and it allowed him to beat SEVERAL Kenyans who were much faster then him before the race.
Now if he focused on the 5000m/10000m and was healthy...won't make you think he wouldn't improve on his finishing speed and he is only 29 years 11 months.
Numerous athletes CAN AND DO improve at 5000m/10000m well into their 30's with todays training and coaching!