ray wrote:
Because the women couldn't run more than 800m in competition...
hey ray,
please change "couldn't" to "were not allowed to between 1928 and 1960"
ray wrote:
Because the women couldn't run more than 800m in competition...
hey ray,
please change "couldn't" to "were not allowed to between 1928 and 1960"
Wooo Hoooo wrote:
Lisa Martin-Ondieki
From elite hurdler, to Silver medal in the Marathon.
The Greatest Range in any Elite athlete has to be her.
Then where are her 5k and 10k championship records?
NO discussion of this type can possibly ignore Mary Slaney. She did it all.
gunther weidlinger
Roger Sterling wrote:
Rod Dixon:
3:33
...
2:08:59
awesome mustache
That is some range, boys
That is great range, and yet it is dwarfed by Geb with 3:31 and 2:03:59.
I'll give you the mustache though.
overthetop wrote:
NO discussion of this type can possibly ignore Mary Slaney. She did it all.
EPO, steroids....she def did it all...
Let's try to make this fair for the runners of history. You have to pick a runner at his or her peak. They will compete at five randomly selected distances against the best of the competition at that time, scoring points on their place, but their worst and best finish will be dropped. You don't find out the distances until after you pick the runner.
Who do you pick?
I'm surprised there is a lack of mentioning of Daniel Komen.
3:29.46 1500
3:46.38 Mile
7:20.67 3000
7:58.61 2 Mile
12:39.74 5000
27:38.32 10000
2:18 Mt Kilimanjaro Marathon
1500 pr dead tie with Said Aouita's, faster than Gebs, faster than Webb's.
Mile pr faster than Webb's, Said's, and Geb's
2 mile pr faster than Webb's, Said's, Geb's
3000 pr obviously crushing these 3, same with 2 mile
5000 pr crushing webb and said, just shy of Gebs
10000 pr just shy of Webb's
Marathon pr not terrible, the course record for the Kilimanjaro marathon is 2:16 so not terribly far from that.
Also the 1500, mile, 3000, and 2 mile prs are better than Bekele's, who has good range as well
While I agree with Geb being "The King" in this regard, I disagree with the dismissive tone of "it is dwarfed...". We are talking about two great athletes separated by 20+ years. Dixon had a similar performance curve vis-a-vis the competition of the day, but just a touch removed from WR status. IMO it makes him #2 AT, but just, especially considering his cross-country prowess.
kapal wrote:
That is great range, and yet it is dwarfed by Geb with 3:31 and 2:03:59.
I'll give you the mustache though.
Wooo Hoooo wrote:
Lisa Martin-Ondieki
From elite hurdler, to Silver medal in the Marathon.
The Greatest Range in any Elite athlete has to be her.
I didn't spend the time to find her hurdle and sprint PB's before she became a distance runner...but someone one probably knows them and can post.
http://www.iaaf.org/athletes/biographies/country=aus/athcode=61181/index.html
How about Marla Runyan?
She was a nationally ranked heptathlete where she excelled in the high jump and 800m. She must have had some pretty quick sprint times.
Some PB's
800m: 2:03
1500m: 4:02
5000m: 14:59
Marathon: 2:27:10
The competition has never been tougher than in Geb's era. He had Komen to compete against at 5000m and Tergat and the Moroccans at 10000m. In the last few years, the half marathon and marathon all-times lists have been completely rewritten.
With his 3:31.76i, he's #2 all-time for 1500m(i).
At 7:25.09, he's #4 all-time at 3000m.
His 12:39.36 was a WR and is still the second fastest ever.
His 26:22.75 was another WR and he's still #2 all-time.
His 58:55 is a former WR and makes him #3 all-time.
And he's run three of the five fastest marathons in history, including his 2:03:59 WR.
He's won world titles from 1500m to the half-marathon and all IAAF distances in between, and has won Berlin three times, Dubai twice and Fukuoka, once.
3:31.76i 1999 World Indoor Champion
7:25.09 1997, 1999, 2003 World Indoor Champion
12:39.36 1993 World Championship silver medalist
26:22.75 1996 and 2000 Olympic champion, 4-time world champion
58:55 2001 World Champion
2:03:59 Wins at Berlin (2007-9), Dubai (2008-9), and Fukuoka (2007).
I can't imagine that any other man has approached such times and such a level of competitiveness from one mile to twenty six.
girls club wrote:
ray wrote:Because the women couldn't run more than 800m in competition...
hey ray,
please change "couldn't" to "were not allowed to between 1928 and 1960"
Why? They couldn't. I don't think anybody believes that they were physically unable and then magically in 1960 they evolved the ability to run the mile. Even if it was simply rules, they could not enter a race longer than 800.
Geb won Berlin four times (2006-2009).
I understand the point. And I mentioned Ondieki/Martin/O'Dey
How is is that Rod Dixon's place in this list is being promoted but not Bekele's?
Just wondering.
wellll? wrote:
Ummm... ever heard of Jordan Hasay?
Seriously? Why? Your a f***ing queer.
Steve Ovett anyone?
Ran like 21 something for 200 then a 1:04 something for a half marathon.
200-half marathon
or
1500-marathon for geb
what constitutes better range?
Not quite at the top level, but still impressive for range: Greg Meyer.
Ran sub-4 indoors, steeplechaser at Michigan, 2:09 to win Boston in 1983.
But Geb is probably the best runner all time?
He may not be the greatest track runner of all-time -- Bekele probably ranks above him, and possibly Nuurmi and Aouita as well.
He may not be the greatest road racer/marathoner of all-time, though I would argue that he is -- Rogers's PRs were too slow to be mentioned, and Wanjiru needs to win a few more majors and hold the WR before he clearly surpasses him.
But Geb is one of the top 5 or so track runners AND one of the top 2-3 road racers/marathoners of all time. It's really not a question as to whether he is the best runner of all time.
Ahh someone mentioned what I was going to I know it will get slammed for not being fast enough but I feel Nurmi needs to be mentioned. And feel he is the only one to compare with Geb here 12 Olympic Medals over 3 Olympiads and probably would have been more as he was scheduled to run the 10000 and Marathon in the 32 games.
Gold 1920 Antwerp 10000 m
Gold 1920 Antwerp 8000 m cross country
Gold 1920 Antwerp 8000 m cross country team
Gold 1924 Paris 1500 m
Gold 1924 Paris 5000 m
Gold 1924 Paris 5000 m cross country
Gold 1924 Paris 5000 m cross country team
Gold 1924 Paris 3000 m team
Gold 1928 Amsterdam 10000 m
Silver 1920 Antwerp 5000 m
Silver 1928 Amsterdam 5000 m
Silver 1928 Amsterdam 3000 m steeplechase
just a side note here - can we just get Cross Country back in the Olympics!
World Records from 1500 up to 20K
EVENT RECORD VENUE AND DATE BROKEN BY
1500 m 3.52,6 Helsinki 19 Jun 1924 (Otto Peltzer Germany 1926)
Mile 4.10,4 Stockholm 23 Aug 1923 (Jules Ladoumègue France 1931)
2000 m 5.26,3 Tampere 4 Sep 1922 (Edvin Wide Sweden 1925)
2000 m 5.24,6 Kuopio 18 Jun 1927 (Eino Purje Finland 1927)
3000 m 8.28,6 Turku 27 Aug 1922 (Edvin Wide Sweden 1925)
3000 m 8.25,4 Berlin 24 May 1926 (Paavo Nurmi 1926)
3000 m 8.20,4 Stockholm 13 Jul 1926 (Janusz Kusocinski Poland 1932)
2 miles* 8.59,6 Helsinki 24 Jul 1931 (Donald Lash USA 1936)
3 miles* 14.11,2 Stockholm 24 Aug 1923 (Lauri Lehtinen Finland 1932)
5000 m 14.35,4 Stockholm 12 Sep 1922 (Paavo Nurmi 1924)
5000 m 14.28,2 Helsinki 19 Jun 1924 (Lauri Lehtinen Finland 1932)
4 miles* 19.15,4 Viipuri 1 Oct 1924 (Janusz Kusocinski Poland 1932)
5 miles* 24.06,2 Viipuri 1 Oct 1924 (The last officially approved WR; unoffic. G. Pirie GBR 1953)
6 miles* 29.36,4 London 8 Jun 1930 (Ilmari Salminen Finland 1937)
10 000 m 30.40,2 Stockholm 22 Jun 1921 (Ville Ritola Finland 1924)
10 000 m 30.06,2 Kuopio 31 Aug 1924 (Ilmari Salminen Finland 1937)
15 000 m* 46.49,6 Berlin 7 Oct 1928 (The last officially approved WR; unoffic. V. Iso-Hollo FIN 1936)
10 miles* 50.15,0 Berlin 7 Oct 1928 (Viljo Heino Finland1945)
20 000 m 1.04.38,4 Stockholm 3 Sep 1930 (Juan Zabala Argentina 1936)
One hour race 19 210 m Berlin 7 Oct 1928 (Viljo Heino Finland 1945)
4x1500 m 16.26,2 /TuUL** Stockholm 12 Jul 1926 (TuUL Finland 1926)
4x1500 m 16.11,4 /TuUL** Viipuri 17 Jul 1926 (Great Britain 1931)
In 1925 he ran 55 Races over the course of about 4 months in the US - lost only once and withdrew from one 53 wins...
Well flame away but its some food for thought
Good point and appreciate your appreciation of running history.