Ok then, AC has a brand new swanky website with secure login cababilities, why don't they host a discussion board where AC members can ask question of, have input, and engage the AC staff in useful dialogue.
AC acts as the moderator and the members get their desired interaction with AC.
I strongly disagree with the selection criteria that AC sets, but I think we should at least acknowledge that they have been applied fairly and consistently. Anyone who read the criteria knew perfectly well that Bairu would go, Coolsaet wouldn't, and so on. This is not about politicking.
The underlying point is how the criteria are set -- which few people on this board with the exception of Pete support. I understand the rationale behind all this top-16 business, and it makes perfect sense if you're talking about curling or skeleton or synchronized diving. But if you're talking about distance running, then you at least have to make these decisions with your eyes open.
The world of distance running is dramatically different than it was 20 years ago. The world records are 12:37 and 26:17, and there are a host of other East Africans who can leave the best runners we've EVER produced more than a lap behind. So if you insist that "top 16" is the relevant criterion, you have to understand that you're probably saying that nobody currently competing, and probably nobody alive today, should expect to earn selection to a World Championships or Olympics.
Obviously I'm overstating the case a bit -- we're still hoping to find our Mottram. But the point remains: if you want to treat marginal sports like skeleton the same as globally competitive sports, you have to accept that you're calling for the death of distance running as a elite competitive sport in Canada.
Good Stuff! Completely agree.
"So as I see it the only athlete on the team (relay excepted as I actually see the value in having someone coach the relay) actually coached by one of the team coaches is Achraf Tadilli"
.....he'll be going to see Wynn at the Practice track too....
hold the phone wrote:
I strongly disagree with the selection criteria that AC sets, but I think we should at least acknowledge that they have been applied fairly and consistently. Anyone who read the criteria knew perfectly well that Bairu would go, Coolsaet wouldn't, and so on. This is not about politicking.
The underlying point is how the criteria are set -- which few people on this board with the exception of Pete support. I understand the rationale behind all this top-16 business, and it makes perfect sense if you're talking about curling or skeleton or synchronized diving. But if you're talking about distance running, then you at least have to make these decisions with your eyes open.
The world of distance running is dramatically different than it was 20 years ago. The world records are 12:37 and 26:17, and there are a host of other East Africans who can leave the best runners we've EVER produced more than a lap behind. So if you insist that "top 16" is the relevant criterion, you have to understand that you're probably saying that nobody currently competing, and probably nobody alive today, should expect to earn selection to a World Championships or Olympics.
Obviously I'm overstating the case a bit -- we're still hoping to find our Mottram. But the point remains: if you want to treat marginal sports like skeleton the same as globally competitive sports, you have to accept that you're calling for the death of distance running as a elite competitive sport in Canada.
Well said.
Let's face it, slagging AC is like shooting fish in a barrel
Wow hold the phone that was awesome, you sound hot.
Osaka Conversations wrote:
So as I see it the only athlete on the team (relay excepted as I actually see the value in having someone coach the relay) actually coached by one of the team coaches is Achraf Tadilli (Diane Cummins lives in Montana and is coached by an American). So there'll be a lot of these conversations happening in Osaka:
"Hey Tyler, need me to hold the watch this afternoon"; "Nope I'm good, bought Kevin a plane ticket over here, he's taking care of me and Kunkel"
"Hey Kevin, wanna discuss how you should run this semi-final?"; "No thanks, going to meet Juli in half an hour for a coffee"
"Hey Carmen, you should really drink lots of water after that race so you're ready for the final"; "You think so? 'Cus All these years I've been re-hydrating with Pepsi, thanks though, gotta go call Marcus"
"Hey Gary, need anything?" "Yeah can you tell me what time the next bus leaves for the Practice track, I'm meeting Wynn there at 2 o'clock"... "Uh yeah, I'll ask Scott"
"Hey Perdita I think you should switch your lead leg"; "Gary would you mind telling Les here that nobody listens to him at his damn meetings he has to justify his job and I sure as hell ain't gonna listen to him now"
Who the hell are you to speak for any of these athletes. I highly doubt that ANY of these people would be so rude. I don't personally know Les (or any of the coaches on board with the team) but whether their mandates fit your narrow criteria is, frankly, arrogance on your part.
Any of the personal coaches know that the process of being selected as a National Team coach - to the benefits of the athletes if needed (even if not necessarily required by all)- is to be a part of the system gaining proper accreditation (Lv4 etc) and applying to be a coach. It's not complicated but does require some commitment beyond just showing up to practices with your athletes. The scenario you otherwise paint is having a "free-for-all" of all of the personal coaches wanting to be designated as "official" coaches. We have (in the past) been down that road - and it's chaos!! The coaches of whom you have inferred more than likely have more respect for these other coaches - who are often selected in a rotation format (as not everyone can, nor should, be an official coach at all of these meets)- and can mediate with them, and should or they are not "team" people either.
Perhaps I give more credence to these people's opinions than do you. I certainly hope that you are not a coach, as your attitude is a poor example to your athletes, and to other coaches in general. If we don't like the system, then we will get involved with the administrative process to make changes, and not just throw stones at glass houses.
Littlebigman...call 911...your sense of humour has gone missing.
Funny Guy wrote:
Littlebigman...call 911...your sense of humour has gone missing.
No it's not funny - it's sad and insulting to the athletes that he has presumed to think that they might say those things to a coach, especially not their own. I know Sully, and he would neither treat anyone that way, nor would he sanction such an attitude in the name of humour. These are people's reputations afterall.
Sounds to me like you're just another punk who thinks this kind of thing is funny. Remember this whole thread is about how Athletics Canada and it's official coaches are screwing the athletes out of their earned right to go to Osaka, like it's a big conspiracy or something.
Oh. You are AC.
AC has no business setting its own standards based on this top-16 bullshit unless Canada is willing to financially support a world-class track and field program. until then, just stick with the IAAF standards.
littlebigman wrote:
Funny Guy wrote:Littlebigman...call 911...your sense of humour has gone missing.
No it's not funny - it's sad and insulting to the athletes that he has presumed to think that they might say those things to a coach, especially not their own. I know Sully, and he would neither treat anyone that way, nor would he sanction such an attitude in the name of humour. These are people's reputations afterall.
Sounds to me like you're just another punk who thinks this kind of thing is funny. Remember this whole thread is about how Athletics Canada and it's official coaches are screwing the athletes out of their earned right to go to Osaka, like it's a big conspiracy or something.
I thought that one-liner was pretty funny, actually.
And for some reason, I keep picturing littlebigman as this red-faced, blustery-hand-wavey-guy with spittle flying out of his mouth.
THAT'S funny.
Athletics Canada SUCKS and intentionally screws over their own athletes!
Thing is, I keep looking at The Bigger Picture here. Oh I know, bystander will probably come in and take more cheap shots, but, something is SERIOUSLY WRONG when the team we send to an Olympics or Worlds is a team in tatters...a little team... Canada won't partake. We won't get into the game. We are not worthy. Now, some will say that the strict standards will help us to Riiiise Up to the occasion. I disagree, in light of the many hurdles (in terms of support) which must be negotiated for any top Canadian track and field athlete. I don't think all the 13:20s were a result of AC standards. The 13;20s got done IN SPITE OF AC. I can't imagine our top athletes resting on their laurels at 13:30 if 13;30 was the standard. I poke fun of the 16/28 ratio not because 16 is so ridiculous, but because 28 is. This is NOT THE ANSWER - sending a little team once again. Of course, lowering the standards and sending a big team isn't the only answer either. Chicken / egg. We've got to get into the game, not abandon it. We've got to tell our 3:38 and 13:20 guys "hey, you are doing great...go to these Games..." Tell me how the sport is being Righted in this country. Tell me how support and leadership have been enhanced in the last few months / years. I missed that, somehow. Tell me how sending a small team is going to be better for us. Tell me how sending all of those 13:20 guys to the 5000m would be a bad thing instead of a really great thing. Tell me that NO WAY could any of those guys make the final, or if they didn't, tell me how that would be a disaster instead of something to experience / build on / bring back home to solve. Go ahead. I'm the luckiest 31min 10k guy in the world. Because I'm in the Canadian Forces, and as one of the top runners in the CF (gasp!) I got to go to 11 World Military XC Championships. I went to Tunisia and Netherlands and Nigeria and Germany and Algeria and Turkey and...Damn, I am greatful for all of the wonderful trips. I was dead last on my first one. It was the most humbling experience ever. I trained my ass off and got much faster, and, later on, I got to midway in the field on later ones. I know that these events weren't the Olympics or the "real" Worlds, but the effect this had on me, and the trickle down effect that it caused in terms of passing down my experiences and lessons learned were imho IMMENSE. Laugh if you will, but sending a full team to these Big Games will help us immensely, not hinder us. We have got it wrong. And we shall suffer for it. There are many many things that need to be done in order to get ourselves out of the doldrums with respect to our sport in this country. One of those things MUST BE, imho, to stop this idiocy that we are seeing once again, and sending 28, and stopping people like Reid from going. I believe a full team would be 130? So we are about 22% of a full team? It's BS! Go! Let's do an experiment. What is the 3rd place performance in Canada right now in all events. Let's see how incredibly weak and undeserving these performances are. List 'em! I'm not saying that we are a powerhouse. But dammit - lets start being something other than inferiority complexed outcasts.
have you all forgotten about michael mason here? Won nats.. .was a world junior champion... still no selection
Bloody goddamn conservative attitude on part of the Canadian T & F...never forget how Peter Butler was left off the team for the LA Olys., 1984.
200400 wrote:
have you all forgotten about michael mason here? Won nats.. .was a world junior champion... still no selection