Heps Track 2010

Sanjay Loopta wrote:

To be clear, my point is that no one within the athletic administration at most of the Ivies care enough to do anything about the mediocre or poor finishes. Too many coaches hang their hat on the "student-athlete" experience, not realizing that losing (and not getting any better) greatly affects that experience. If this were any other major Div 1 conference, many coaches here would be feeling the heat.

It's not just the mediocre or poor finishes. A month ago, the Harvard athletic director sacked the women's squash coach, despite the fact he coached the team THAT YEAR to a national championships. Even prominant alumni have voiced their disapproval over this firing, as it was probably done for internal politcal reasons.

Unless people REALLY complain about the coaching methods (i.e Craig Lake), nothing is done unless you piss off someone within the athletic administration department.

Hollimon certainly wanted to run the 200, he had his sweats off and was doing starts out of blocks in his lane. The official walked over and guided him off the track. My guess is he didn't realize that scratching from one event means you're done for the meet.

C/M Runner wrote:

I remember seeing him with the official at the 200m start. I thought he was just telling the official that he was not going to run... I don't know what Hollimon was thinking, but for all I know, he could have been trying to test out his leg to see if it would work for the 200m, figured out it wouldn't, and then told the officials he was not running. I'm not sure if medical scratching would have allowed him to run later in the day.

Rule 3-21 Article 2 "Should the decision be made to withdraw the athlete from the current event, the athlete shall be scratched from any subsequent event(s) in the meet, unless otherwise approved to continue participation by the medical doctor/certified trainer."

So clearly it would have been possible for him to have run if he'd got medical staff approval.

This is a great point. It's amazing to me what ADs will tolerate (bad programs), and what they will not. I am unfamiliar with the squash situation at Harvard, but the administrations at places like Yale, Harvard and Dartmouth should realize that if they want to engage their alums, they need to put a winning product out there. This is trickier at certain programs when that would mean sacking alums or long-standing coaches who are spinning their wheels. Yet it seems that in this vacuum the programs at Cornell and Princeton just get richer and deeper. Outside of the recent dismissal of Craig Lake, I cannot recall a head coach in the league losing their job because of performance (maybe Groghan at Columbia [though I think he may have just resigned - really resigned - prior to Willy Wood taking over]).

And of course, don't forget that Cornell is a much larger institution and has much lower admissions standards (especially for athletes) than any other school in the league, allowing them to get more recruits, even those whose academic credentials don't cut it at other schools.

TK1451 wrote:

That was actually Princeton's sprint coach. Apparently what happened was with all the training-room stuff he had to go through between the 4x1 and 400 he didn't have enough time to properly warm up before the 400 and would have been running it cold: a recipe for disaster if you just pulled a muscle. The coaching staff advised him to scratch but apparently nobody told him that they meant from the entire meet, not just from the 400.

That makes sense. Thanks for the explanation. The injury definitely sucks for him and the princeton team. Would have been a much closer meet with him in the 400, 200, and 4x4.

biggredcornell wrote:

And of course, don't forget that Cornell is a much larger institution and has much lower admissions standards (especially for athletes) than any other school in the league, allowing them to get more recruits, even those whose academic credentials don't cut it at other schools.

And it doesn't stop there. Even among Harvard/Yale/Princeton, Princeton has more supported positions and seems to be able to get people admitted that can't make it through in Cambridge and New Haven.

It really is apples and oranges when you compare the different schools in the Heps, with Cornell at one end and probably Yale, in terms of standards and numbers of supported admissions, at the other.

But none of these schools are Florida State - it's tough at all eight Ivies, but it's not tough in the same way.

This makes the number of Heps athletes advancing to the NCAA regional this year really commendable.

Let me see if this works, but I have a table that shows the top 60 in the East Region with just Ivy results on it (includes this past weekend). It's just the men right now. If this works, I'll post the women's table later today. I'm posting this through GoogleDocs...

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AuRC7cSkmaKkdHRyWWdjb1N4WE1CZDJkOHg3MTRDakE&hl=en

Without really counting the numbers, I'd say the men's distances > 3K are the strong suit of the Ivies this year in the region. Then again, aren't we known for our distance crews anyways?

Tigerfan wrote:

Rule 3-21 Article 2 "Should the decision be made to withdraw the athlete from the current event, the athlete shall be scratched from any subsequent event(s) in the meet, unless otherwise approved to continue participation by the medical doctor/certified trainer."

So clearly it would have been possible for him to have run if he'd got medical staff approval.

Thanks TigerFan. I thought there was such a rule, I just couldn't find it.

Also, it's legitimate for a person to scratch from a multi-event and then go out to do a single event later in the day, which is what Duane Hynes did with the dec/HJ. I remember someone telling me that at the meet.

C/M Runner wrote:

Let me see if this works, but I have a table that shows the top 60 in the East Region with just Ivy results on it (includes this past weekend). It's just the men right now. If this works, I'll post the women's table later today. I'm posting this through GoogleDocs...

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AuRC7cSkmaKkdHRyWWdjb1N4WE1CZDJkOHg3MTRDakE&hl=en

Without really counting the numbers, I'd say the men's distances > 3K are the strong suit of the Ivies this year in the region. Then again, aren't we known for our distance crews anyways?

It takes about 2 seconds on TFRRS, I wouldn't bother with trying to upload stuff via google docs.

Yeah, but if you put in "Penn", it also looks up "Penn State" results. A little annoying, but oh well.

C/M Runner wrote:

Let me see if this works, but I have a table that shows the top 60 in the East Region with just Ivy results on it (includes this past weekend). It's just the men right now. If this works, I'll post the women's table later today. I'm posting this through GoogleDocs...

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AuRC7cSkmaKkdHRyWWdjb1N4WE1CZDJkOHg3MTRDakE&hl=en

Without really counting the numbers, I'd say the men's distances > 3K are the strong suit of the Ivies this year in the region. Then again, aren't we known for our distance crews anyways?

Needs some work in the Relays because only top 24 accepted but the table shows multiple entries from schools like Florida so you have to filter the list to one entry per school.

So who all qualified? Can't find a comprehensive list anywhere, too busy packing to research it myself.

What was Craig Lake fired for? Or, should I say, why did she "resign" halfway through the season? I haven't been able to find any decent article explaining it but I presume their some knowledgeable chatter out there. Thx!

Hi-

Is there any update on this? I haven't heard what the outcome of her midseason "resignation" was but I have to believe she was ousted somehow. I'm curious if you heard anything more concrete. Thanks

RunNGun wrote:

Hi-

Is there any update on this? I haven't heard what the outcome of her midseason "resignation" was but I have to believe she was ousted somehow. I'm curious if you heard anything more concrete. Thanks

This is second hand from a friend of mine who is a recent Brown grad...

Apparently Ms. Lake was a polarizing figure. Some people really liked her, others, not so much. Like many leaders/coaches, she had something of a domineering/controlling personality. One of the ways this manifested itself was in prescribing a restrictive 1200-1500 calorie, high protein diet for members of the women's distance team. One such member did not like what my friend called "institutionalized anorexia," and refused to toe the line. Ms. Lake wasn't thrilled and sent her an email to remind her about the importance of being lean and keeping to the diet. The athlete forwarded this email to her mom and dad and that is when all hell broke loose. Again, Ms. Lake already had her detractors and that was all they needed.

In her defense, Ms. Lake is not alone in trying to manipulate her athletes. Lots of coaches try to pull this crap. What did her in was that unlike her peers, she put it in writing. She provided the administration with the smoking gun.

The rest was a mess. Some felt Ms. Lake was done wrong. Others felt that they could finally breathe. She wasn't allowed to attend practice for weeks, and obviously there was little official communication to the team why. The rumors were swirling and most people knew what was going on. Ultimately, she was allowed to resign. Given Brown's performance at outdoor Heps, where the team over-performed, it looks like they are heading in the right direction.

The lesson kids? You can be a prick, get away with it and even prosper for a long time, but don't put it in writing.