Coffee does make me irritable sometimes, at which point I take god's name in vain and direct it at my family and they tell me my dreams are bullshhitt. So yes, Vince is correct.
Coffee does make me irritable sometimes, at which point I take god's name in vain and direct it at my family and they tell me my dreams are bullshhitt. So yes, Vince is correct.
rekrunner wrote:
Here's something to think about. Although coffee contains caffeine, coffee is, as a matter of fact, not caffeine.
Caffeine provides a well-known ergogenic benefit. This has been well studied by scientists, and it's dosage is limited by organizations such as the NCAA and the IAAF.
However, slightly less well known to the ignorant masses, despite the fact that coffee contains caffeine, coffee does not provide the well known benefits that caffeine does. Any perceived benefit is merely a placebo effect.
So if the question is simply one of morality, there is nothing morally wrong with drinking a beverage that does not in physical fact provide any known ergogenic benefit, even if the drinker does it for the wrong reasons.
NCAA has limits, but WADA/IAAF does not. WADA monitors caffeine, but it is not on the prohibited list. You can look for yourself at the WADA website.
yo gabba gabba wrote:
I'm a college cross country and track runner. Sometimes when I haven't slept well, I'll drink coffee before a workout or race, or maybe even if I have slept well, in order to get the benefits. I notice a clear improvement when I have had coffee 1-3 hours before. I'm wondering about the morality/cheating aspect of this. Primarily due to these effects:
-caffeine is a stimulant
-caffeine makes you burn more fats earlier so that you save glycogen for later in the race
-caffeine dilates your blood vessels
I know that the level the NCAA considers cheating is about 10 cups of coffee, and I'm only talking about 1 cup, but sometimes I feel like I'm cheating myself when I drink coffee, because running for me has always been about getting PRs and improving internally. What do you guys think?
How far are your college races that you have to worry about point 2 above?
This is a totally legit concern to bring up. Mark my words it's only a matter of time before this is a big issue. It's a drug - pure & simple. Joanie B.Samuelson was recently asked what's the #1 thing that's working for her lately that's allowing her to compete at such a high level & she honestly admitted it was her 'discovery' of caffeine. Mine too.
I don't drink hot liquids of any kind. That's the Devil's temperature!
yo gabba gabba wrote:
sometimes I feel like I'm cheating myself when I drink coffee, because running for me has always been about getting PRs and improving internally. What do you guys think?
The morality is the same as taking EPO, no more no less.
J.R. wrote:
The morality is the same as taking EPO, no more no less.
I don't agree with this whatsoever. Caffeine is an ergogenic aid with no proven negative effects, and when used in moderation, is not in violation of our sport's rules.
yo gabba gabba wrote:
Not all issues are so clear cut, and sometimes it can actually be valuable to think for 2 seconds and examine things before spouting off. Letsrun really sucks.
But some issues ARE so clear cut. Get your panties out of a wad.
Frank Shorter drank de-fizzed Coke during his Olympic marathons.
Pull the medals ?
rekrunner wrote:
Here's something to think about. Although coffee contains caffeine, coffee is, as a matter of fact, not caffeine.
Caffeine provides a well-known ergogenic benefit. This has been well studied by scientists, and it's dosage is limited by organizations such as the NCAA and the IAAF.
However, slightly less well known to the ignorant masses, despite the fact that coffee contains caffeine, coffee does not provide the well known benefits that caffeine does. Any perceived benefit is merely a placebo effect.
So if the question is simply one of morality, there is nothing morally wrong with drinking a beverage that does not in physical fact provide any known ergogenic benefit, even if the drinker does it for the wrong reasons.
Not true. Some studies have used coffee and observed the same effect. Here is one:
http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/26/2/116.abstractI posted some thoughts on this topic here:
http://runningwritings.blogspot.com/2011/08/caffeine-and-running-effectiveness.htmlBut the jist of it is that: a) coffee is no more or less natural than caffeine b) it is fairly easy to get an ergogenic dosage and stay well under the NCAA's limit if you so desire and c) the decision whether to use caffeine is ultimately an individual one; banning a virtually harmless substance ingested by the vast majority of the world is ridiculous.
end thread.
Northern Star wrote:
rekrunner wrote:Here's something to think about. Although coffee contains caffeine, coffee is, as a matter of fact, not caffeine.
Caffeine provides a well-known ergogenic benefit. This has been well studied by scientists, and it's dosage is limited by organizations such as the NCAA and the IAAF.
However, slightly less well known to the ignorant masses, despite the fact that coffee contains caffeine, coffee does not provide the well known benefits that caffeine does. Any perceived benefit is merely a placebo effect.
So if the question is simply one of morality, there is nothing morally wrong with drinking a beverage that does not in physical fact provide any known ergogenic benefit, even if the drinker does it for the wrong reasons.
Not true. Some studies have used coffee and observed the same effect. Here is one:
http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/26/2/116.abstractI posted some thoughts on this topic here:
http://runningwritings.blogspot.com/2011/08/caffeine-and-running-effectiveness.htmlBut the jist of it is that: a) coffee is no more or less natural than caffeine b) it is fairly easy to get an ergogenic dosage and stay well under the NCAA's limit if you so desire and c) the decision whether to use caffeine is ultimately an individual one; banning a virtually harmless substance ingested by the vast majority of the world is ridiculous.
Kenyans drink tea and they run faster
Does anybody know- is it black tea??
Jeez, Caffeine will not produce monster results, so what is the problem with an improvement of some seconds? And the man you maybe beat based on that could have drank a cup of coffee (he likely did) as well!
The one they made me was black tea no milk but with sugar in
Training a lot also makes you faster. Stop training so much if you feel guilty about the fitness advantage you have over other runners.
yo gabba gabba wrote:
If you had actually read my post you would have seen that I know one cup of coffee is way less than what is banned. I was talking about PRs, improvement, and whether I'm cheating against myself. Also you spelled caffeine wrong.
I think you are cheating by being up on your high horse. That gives a huge advantage in a race.
I'm glad this is here, good discussion.
I use coffee to help with races/workouts sometimes and I've wondered the ethicacy of it, because it seems to make a big difference on my performances.
Good to know that most people don't think it matters. Sometimes its just night and day on my running though.
I've also sometimes wondered about the morality of it. I don't like knowing that I've had an "aid" helping me to new PBs.
That being said, I still do it, because I figure that I might as well take all legal opportunities - it boosts my confidence.
The size of the ergogenic benefit of caffeine seems to depend on a few things, like distance of the effort and individual's caffeine tolerance. I have seen some studies which have shown improvements of up to 3% in distance races, which is very significant