Russian hackers expose global warming fraud

Sir Lance-alot wrote:

"The documents will undoubtedly raise questions about the quality of research on some specific questions and the actions of some scientists. But the evidence pointing to a growing human contribution to global warming is so widely accepted that the hacked material is unlikely to erode the overall argument "

D'oh!!!!

Fixed. Widely accepted, that means brainwashed.

fat bottom girls wrote:

Sir Isaac Just Joking wrote:

New evidence shows that the theory of gravity...

your post (if you're being serious with your sarcasm)

Haha, I agree with you, but that's an oxymoron.

korviev wrote:

Let me get this straight. Somebody breaks into someone's computer, steals a bunch of stuff, leaks what they choose to leak and victims of this theft are the ones with the black eyes?

Who the hell stole this stuff and why? Wouldn't you like to see the private emails of the folks on the other side of this supposed debate?

Here's one:

Memo

From: Victor vD. ExxonMobil

To: Russian Hack Squad

Please hack into computers of British scientists and put it on a web site somewhere. We'll pay you $xxx for it.

Yeah, but that's all just speculation on your part that you don't know is true. We have their actual words. All you have to do is read them. Besides, why would it be news if everything the scientists were saying was honest?

There have been many links posted about this, but skeptics simply dismiss any sources that tell them something they dislike.

Here's an interesting one:

Newscorp (Fox) goes Carbon Neutral:

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/murdoch-im-proud-to-be-green-448652.html

Here are a few more:

http://www.skepticalscience.com/climate-models.htm

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16732-sea-level-rise-could-bust-ipcc-estimate.html

Here's little note about how the oil industry is behaving in the face of this problem:

Exxon spends more on lobbying than entire Clean Energy Industry Combined:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601130&sid=aPuYDoceYMe0

I am sure you will dismiss all of these articles, but you can't wish away the problem. All I can say is when the sh*t hits the fan and you are living on a boat, don't float my way for help.

korviev wrote:

There have been many links posted about this, but skeptics simply dismiss any sources that tell them something they dislike.

Here's an interesting one:

Newscorp (Fox) goes Carbon Neutral:

http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/murdoch-im-proud-to-be-green-448652.html

Here are a few more:

http://www.skepticalscience.com/climate-models.htmhttp://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16732-sea-level-rise-could-bust-ipcc-estimate.html

Here's little note about how the oil industry is behaving in the face of this problem:

Exxon spends more on lobbying than entire Clean Energy Industry Combined:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601130&sid=aPuYDoceYMe0

I am sure you will dismiss all of these articles, but you can't wish away the problem. All I can say is when the sh*t hits the fan and you are living on a boat, don't float my way for help.

You're just as adamently avoiding the dirty truth of those e-mails. The good thing about "when the shit hits the fan" is that in 40 years or so, everything will be fine and global warming will die, and people will laugh in your face.

If we don't even try to do anything about global warming and it ends up not being true we'll still be screwed-we'll be stuck with polluted oceans and out of oil. There will not be enough oil in 40 years.

this global warming brainwashing stuff has really got out of hand...

And now the truth:

http://biocab.org/Global_Warmings_and_Coolings_Since_Medieval_Age.jpg

Temperature and ppmv [co2] show no correlation.

Hell, even in ~950 the temperature was higher than it is now.

haah wrote:

Haha, I agree with you, but that's an oxymoron.

i know, but it was the best way to describe the situation!

expose wrote:

And now the truth:

http://biocab.org/Global_Warmings_and_Coolings_Since_Medieval_Age.jpg

Temperature and ppmv [co2] show no correlation.

Hell, even in ~950 the temperature was higher than it is now.

yes, but "global warming" prophets now claim that what they actually meant was "global climate change," so it makes no difference whether it gets warmer or cooler, whether weather patterns are calm or more extreme, etc...

if it's not like san diego everywhere everyday, there is CHANGE going on and we must ACT NOW.

"Now, smoking cigarettes is certainly bad for you physically overall, but the threat of diseases such as lung cancer or emphysema are made out to be worse than they actually are. For lung cancer specifically, as long as you quit smoking before your cells turn cancerous, then you are basically in no danger."

The fight against Big Tobacco is just another plot by socialist scientists to bring down the tobacco industry. Cigarettes don't kill people, cancer kills people and any linkages between cigarettes and disease have been formulated by scientists using faulty statistics to deceive the public. Scientists cannot be trusted!!!

What were we talking about again?

bush is god wrote:

The fight against Big Tobacco is just another plot by socialist scientists to bring down the tobacco industry.

another simplistic response to serious debate.

most who don't fall in line with your sheepish belief that the sky is falling do not debate that things humans do can effect the environment.

the point is that we do not have a large enough time frame of observations to make conclusions about ***the extent to which those actions will affect the environment***. We know for a fact that the climate naturally fluctuated much more drastically in the past than it is right at this moment...long before all of these man-made causes.

so your smug belief in man-made climate "change" does nothing for anyone here. What we need to do is figure out whether we should be dumping billions of dollars into something that will have very little long term impact on weather patterns that we might not be able to control, or on education, feeding people, paying down the national debt, etc...

fat bottom girls wrote:yes, but "global warming" prophets now claim that what they actually meant was "global climate change," so it makes no difference whether it gets warmer or cooler, whether weather patterns are calm or more extreme, etc...

if it's not like san diego everywhere everyday, there is CHANGE going on and we must ACT NOW.

Actually, it does make a difference. You're misrepresenting the general argument: that on a whole temperatures have increased, but due to the complexity of the Earth's weather shifts will occur at a local level. This "religion" argument singles out a select few. Those who've taken the climate change data and jumped to a conclusion.

Regardless, the doomsdayers are only slightly more common than the skeptics. Most scientists accept that we are impacting the environment and that we don't know what consequences this will bring in full. In that sense, the skeptics are as bad as the doomsdayers.

As opposed to the more than a trillion dollars that the last government spent on invading Iraq to secure its energy interests in oil?

As for this being a serious debate... don't make me laugh! There have been dozens of similar threads on Letsrun and many of them contain links to scientific articles that explain why the theory is supported almost unanimously by those in the field of climate study. I have responded to some of them but I get the feeling that it's a waste of time and that none of the deniers are going to change their mind, no matter what the evidence. I also suspect that may of the people who are starting these threads are trolling. If you are not, there are many better places than letsrun for you to seek information on climate change. I would suggest realclimate.org for one.

fat bottom girls wrote:the point is that we do not have a large enough time frame of observations to make conclusions about ***the extent to which those actions will affect the environment***. We know for a fact that the climate naturally fluctuated much more drastically in the past than it is right at this moment...long before all of these man-made causes.

While there's some merit to this argument it has problems too. The ice sheet data is reliable; that much is agreed upon... although samples can be tainted. Other biological records from the soil, tree rings, etc... provide a long term records as well.

Essentially, if you are going to argue that, "we know for a fact that the climate naturally fluctuated" in the past you have to accept data gleaned from the sources I mentioned earlier. But, it's the comparison of data we have from the present (i.e. modern records) *plus* the past (ice sheet information, etc...) that gave rise to theories regarding man made climate change. Not just current records.

Most skeptics don't account for this.

You can blast out small data sample size of our new recording methodologies, but ultimately if you do that you still have to explain why it still fits with the composite record as a whole - WITHOUT allowing for human factors.

The bottom line is, no single factor is as powerful as the human impact hypothesis right now. The others, generally, have proven less likely.

There are some people who still think we are not experiencing global warming?

I thought that even the most dedicated opponents of the phenomena accepted that it was real and only argued it was not from man made sources?

Ziggy Starlust wrote:

If we don't even try to do anything about global warming and it ends up not being true we'll still be screwed-we'll be stuck with polluted oceans and out of oil. There will not be enough oil in 40 years.

When did I ever say we shouldn't stop polluting?

Anyone with sense knows Global Warming is a hoax designed to try and derail Western, especially American, advancement and manufacturing. Only the truly brainwashed, like PC American college students and the mouthbreathers who believe CNN, FOX, ABC etc have swallowed this line of crap. It was started by the Red Diaper Babies. The children and grandchildren of the people who destroyed Russia and much of Eastern Europe. And they know, as self-deceptive and treacherous as they are.

Sense dictates disbelief wrote:

Anyone with sense knows Global Warming is a hoax designed to try and derail Western, especially American, advancement and manufacturing. Only the truly brainwashed, like PC American college students and the mouthbreathers who believe CNN, FOX, ABC etc have swallowed this line of crap. It was started by the Red Diaper Babies. The children and grandchildren of the people who destroyed Russia and much of Eastern Europe. And they know, as self-deceptive and treacherous as they are.

the only part of that statement which is true is that global warming is a hoax....i guess that's all that really mattes though..