lagat 3:32.56 in Morocco

Did you forget that he ran 3:37.7 in Nairobi back in 1996?Then he ran 3:34 in the summer after his junior year, and 3:30 in the summer after his senior year in 1999. In 2000 he ran 3:28 before getting the bronze in Sydney and the next year. One year later he ran 3:26.3, in perfect weather with great pacing from Graham Hood, following El Guerrouj all the way to the line. Ask him about it and he'll tell you it was one of those rare times that everything came together and he had no idea they were on that pace.

the short red line wrote:

A couple thoughts I had, and by no way does this mean anything, but:

Why did Lagat spend 5 years in the NCAA and never look like a 3:26 1500 guy? I mean he looked like a 3:33-3:34 guy, but that is a HUGE difference.

Why did he have to go to Morrocco for a fast 1500? That seems like going out of his way and making training less convenient when he was already in Europe and could have gotten in any 1500 he wanted, including a low key one if he was looking to avoid the top dogs.

Morrocco is a strange place to go race for a lot of reasons.

the short red line wrote:

Why did he have to go to Morrocco for a fast 1500? That seems like going out of his way and making training less convenient when he was already in Europe and could have gotten in any 1500 he wanted, including a low key one if he was looking to avoid the top dogs.

Morrocco is a strange place to go race for a lot of reasons.

I believe it was Hicham El Guerrouj's meet. Lagat is friends with El Guerrouj. Nice to support your friends events.

the short red line wrote:

A couple thoughts I had, and by no way does this mean anything, but:

Why did Lagat spend 5 years in the NCAA and never look like a 3:26 1500 guy? I mean he looked like a 3:33-3:34 guy, but that is a HUGE difference.

Why did he have to go to Morrocco for a fast 1500? That seems like going out of his way and making training less convenient when he was already in Europe and could have gotten in any 1500 he wanted, including a low key one if he was looking to avoid the top dogs.

Morrocco is a strange place to go race for a lot of reasons.

This has to be one of the all-time great douchebag posts in Letsrun history.

First, he didn't spend 5 years in the NCAA. He came in 1997, and was already a world class athlete - he had finished 4th at the Kenyan Olympic Trials in 1996, running 3:37+ at altitude. He was a 2 time All-American in XC, and got 9 AA certificated in track. He turned pro in the summer of 1999, after his junior year of eligibility, after he had thoroughly dominated the NCAA that year. The summer of 1999 he ran 3:30+, and was second at the Grand Prix Final.

Second, he didn't run 3:26 until 2001, two full years after he stopped competing on the NCAA level. In 2000, he ran 3:28 and won the silver at the OG. I don't think this should be that much of a shock to anyone...he went 3:30 in 1999, 3:28 in 2000, 3:26 in 2001.

Third, why Morocco? Because it fit the schedule, was convinient, and was organized by his friend El G. Tangier, Morocco a strange place to go? For people living in Europe? Yeah, so out of the way:

Shaheen was there. As was Robles. And Chris Brown. Bunch of nobodies. Makes you wonder why Nick Symmonds wasn't there.

Anyone trying to find a nefarious motive in Lagat's having gone to Morocco to race is a 100 percent unadulterated idiot and douchebag, and that's putting it mildly.

I suppose he NEVER does any meets in Europe, right? Uh huh. Sure.

And yes, this was El G's meet...and that's why he went.

Get a brain. Get a soul.

Very informative response. Thanks.

So Lagat was at WSU competing from 1997-1999, and 1999 was a great year for him with his 2 NCAA titles. What did he do in his first 2 years there? Especially coming into college with a 3:37 at altitude and 4th at the Kenyan trials, it's hard to imagine him not dominating the collegiates during that particularly weak moment in us collegiate running. AA honors don't really seem that much of an accolade for a guy who challenged El G and Noah Ngeny in their primes and still continues to race at the top of the world.

Thanks for the info.

Since Lagat ran 3.26 clean, imagine how fast he could have run if he had the assistance of EPO. 3.21? 3.22? that would have been incredible.

It's been fun, but there is just too much negative energy here and too many new assholes who post bullshit and lots of great people who used to post all the time who have left or gone underground. I'm out. Life is too short. I'll be in kona. Hope to see some of you there. Paulo knows how to find me.

KUFI wrote:

Here's a better question, which athletes do you think are clean and why do you think they're clean?

Right. Hey truuue answer the question dickhead. Nevermind, you're probably some 15:00 min guy whose never broken 15 in a 5k and is just pissed off because you're pathetic running career never took off. This board is filled with losers like you with monumental egos. If webb would have ran this time, you guys would be all over his dick. F**k off.

soooo the questions get hard, and the defenders take their leave? I don't think that is going to stop people asking questions.

wowzers wrote:

WOW, that's a great time. Does anyone know if he's racing in an upcoming Golden League meet?

it's not a "great" time for a guy who has run 3'26

it's a time "expected" of a 1500 champ rounding into shape to defend his title

it shoud be noted bernie doesn't chase the clock that much anymore - he is a racer, he runs to win & clocking is incidental

Other 2007 world champs that didn't medal at the Olympics due to being flat/injured/whatever include Reese Hoffa, Tyson Gay, Dayron Robles, Liu Xiang, Donald Thomas, Brad Walker, Roman Sebrle, Maryam Jamal, Michelle Perry... there's tons beside Lagat. It's a highly competitive sport, failing to medal doesn't prove anything...

ummmm...Robles won the Gold Medal last year.

Lagat seems like a great guy, someone you would want as a neighbor....but the way that he progressed after college and the times that he ran, in the era that he ran them automatically put him in the suspect category. I believe that he is clean now and has been for several years. I just think the 3:26 is suspicious....people who say "well he ran 3:37 at altitude" blah blah blah. Do you have any clue what a 3:26 is? Every second under 3:30 is a monumental improvement.

Those samples need to get re-tested with today's standards, assuming they are frozen (which they probably aren't).

It's amaing reading some of this stuff.

Why are human beings so cynical?

TRUUU,

someone (KUFI) asked you a question and you still haven't answered it; ".......which athletes do you think are clean and why do you think they're clean?"

I'd really love to know.

Thanks Typical 1800-94 for your response.

The second answer in this interview says a whole damn lot about Lagat. Gotta respect the guy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2b1D5w82yU

aaargh, I got rick-rolled.

does short red line indicate your IQ? do you have any idea how short of a hop it is to Casablanca or Rabat or....from europe? a couple of two hour flights, thats less than it takes from tucson to NYC. how about the vacation aspect, ever consider that one??? some people actually like to explore this world we live in, especially when you can be paid well to do so.....dude-

the short red line wrote:........Why did he have to go to Morrocco for a fast 1500? That seems like going out of his way and making training less convenient when he was already in Europe and could have gotten in any 1500 he wanted, including a low key one if he was looking to avoid the top dogs.......Morrocco is a strange place to go race for a lot of reasons.

Willis yes, silva possibly, kiprop unknown. That's just 1500 runners that stayed and played at the olympics last year. We could go through every runner in every event, but the dreamers will keep dreaming and believing intheir false heroes.

I'm bberrying it, so let's see if I can hit the posts from others:

-yes easily sub-15 many times but I wasn't comparing dicks or complaining about failed "careers"

-why morocco? Well, testing stds are more lax there and el g was doped to the gils so he's obviously gonna protect his "friend"

-the list of injured athletes was nice and I do agree that an olympic year and more stressful time obviously makes ppl more susceptible to injury/illness (I'm no fool there) yet the olympics is where previously-untouchable druggos can sometimes be touched...why would lagat risk it?!

-im sure he's a great guy!!! Try this glove on though...we all know druggies, thieves, and liars and some of them (we'd say) are great people! All the murderers, rapists, serial killers in the news always have neigbors stating how great such-and-such was. Great guy or not, druggie.

-world champ?! Great for him in a watered down testing program where tipsters are present and the good ol boys rule is in high effect. Why is it that morceli,komen, el g, GEB (maybe someday) and BEKELE (maybe someday) don't or prob won't get busted?! Dollars and cents! They performing well are good for the sport! Protected from their countries and the P.O.S's in t/f. Plenty of WCs OCs have gotten by, what does that prove?!

-why run well here and there? Money! He gets paid to show up and paid for performances. He'll get paid for being at the WCs and if he thinks he won't "piss hot" then he'll get paid for whatever medal he can cheat whoever's clean out of

We could go round and round, but santa will still exist for you all and I won't buy into the commercialism. While being a punk for pushing negativity, I'm no punk kid as I've been on the us circuit and have plenty of elite friends on the intl circuit...runners that turned down $ for pacing drug cheats like el g to WR times. But enjoy your "nice/naughty" list ya'll...

* here's a parting thought: letsrun recently had a link to cycling claims that they still doped to the gills 24/7 to keep their levels high all the time, that way there "should" never be variations or fluctuations in testing samples. I suppose only cyclists are devious enough to play such pirate games...

I'm always confused when the Lagat threads rapidly turn into who's drugging v who's getting caught drugged, while the Willis, Baddeley, Teg, Solinsky, and the new Australian kid threads all point to how great they are and are simply running according to there indicative training. Let's just be honest, Teg's camp has practically admitted to frequently using blood storage/reusage methods similar to the blood doping methods that are banned. That thread go deleted and I'm sure my post will soon be deleted as well, but if we're gonna have an honest conversation let it be inclusive. Sure, they called it something else to legally "operationalize" what they were doing after Teg mistakenly let the cat out of the bag during an interview.

And its not just the Schumacher folks, but also Salazar's. AlSal's entire crew have had these absolutely amazing "breakthroughs" recently with noone seriously questioning its validity. How do so many solid NCAA college runners who were on the brink of losing contracts, all of a sudden begin approaching American records in every even they enter. Ya'll really think Goucher is in the same league as Dibaba or Defar??? Yes, with a little help. Without the juice, Goucher is a 33-low 10k runner and she knows it. I don't see any threads about Yoder-Begley doping either. Have we forgotten that it was only a couple of years ago that Yoder (who I think is over 30 years old now) was struggling to break 34 minutes for the 10k and now she's national champ BEATING AN OLYMPIC MEDALISTS!! Did you not realize how all of Sal's athletes absolutely dominated the rest; trust me, he's not THAT much more knowledgeable than the rest of these coaches and the facilities only help a bit more. Do we really think Ritz has gone to Salazar because Sal is that much of a superior coach than Hudson? Of course not. Ritz (and all the rest of Al's blind followers) has said fcku it, I'm throwing in the gauntlet and am willing to do whatever needs to be done at this point. You can only put in so many 120 mile weeks/years of training and getting dominated before you either A. Quit B. Resort to running local road races and unofficially retiring or C. Join the rest and get the latest, greatest, undetectable synthetic drug. When you're in the later stages of your career (which is 95% of Al's guys minus Rupp) and you've done everything in your power to compete drug-free with the best (again, 95% of his crew), while getting lapped by those getting the free pass as they perpetually use drugs and get huge appearance fees/gold medals (99% of his crew), you will do whatever it takes to compete on-par with the African's. AlSal knows his kids can't compete with the Africans without some extra synthetic help. You know he knows that all too well from his Rono/WSU ass-whooping days. As folks even like Dederian has pointed out (who btw, used to train with Al): he'll do "whatever" it takes to win.

Again, all I'm saying is let's not beat Lagat like a run away slave with all these lashes while turning out heads to what's currently going on all over the US (ask Maggie Vessey). Who is Vessey?? Right...Keep you heads in the sand LRC.

TRUUUUU wrote:

Willis yes, silva possibly, kiprop unknown.

The fact that you're "so sure against" Bernard and list Silva as "possibly" clean shows your ignorance. Lagat is and always has been absolutely clean. Talk To James Li, talk to Templeton and you'll see.