"I also understand that Oregon should be getting Ryan Waite back next year possibly, who has apparently been away on a mission. He ran 1:50 800 in HS his senior year. So for the 800 they'd have Wheating 1:45, Greer 1:47, Mac Fleet 1:49, Travis Thompson 1:49, and Ryan Waite 1:50."
Which might make them a challenger to Penn State's 7:11.17 4 X 800 record AT THE PENN RELAYS. Man up Ducks, make the effort. There's really nothing like the Penn Relays.
Wouldn't the simplest solution be for Penn to change the event to the 4xMile?
Would anybody care?
Maybe I am old school but I still feel like the first thing I do when someone tells me their 1500 time is to convert it in my head to their mile time.
There is something appealing to me about the 4xMile. I love distance relays period but would love to see Penn move to the 4xMile.
Penn runs 4xmile in some years and 4x1500 in others. This year the women ran 1500s and the men ran miles.
Any other phantom reasons for the Ducks to skip Penn?
does anyone know the rules on how many participants you need in a race? I think to count as intercollegiate competition there need to be a certain number of entries and they have to be from different schools/affiliations. I'm sure the rules are different for relays. They do this so you can't set up a home meet with only your own team and count those times for qualifying or record keeping purposes. I don't think that Oregon did anything wrong. I am just wondering about the rule.
they already do wrote:
Penn runs 4xmile in some years and 4x1500 in others. This year the women ran 1500s and the men ran miles.
Any other phantom reasons for the Ducks to skip Penn?
the mens race has been 4xmile and the womens race 4x15 for the last several years. it's not like the peen meet directors are deciding this on race day.
Rupp had the fastest time and he isn't even a miler.
Rupp = clutch runner
Michigan would have definitely dusted them. Take a look at this.
Centrowitz 3:56 mile - Willis 3:55 mile (with ease)
Kiptoo 4:00 mile (doubtful) - Ellerton 3:58 mile
Wheating 3:56 mile (doubtful) - Brannen -3:55(with ease)
Rupp 3:56 mile (doubtful) - Woods - 3:57
Michigan easily wins. I even gave major assumptions that the Oregon guys could run faster than their pr's.
Mrr82 wrote:
Oregon Rules... wrote:The 78 Ducks could have run this fast as well...
Time to make this a yearly event!
The michigan team would have left them in the dust however. Probably would have run with them for 3 legs, and then either Willis or Brannen would have dusted Rupp. No knock on Oregon, but it wouldn't have been much of a race come the last lap. Damn shame those two teams couldnt' match up.
Wall should have run Oregons other leg...hindsight sucks...
Willis and Brannen are both washed up, and were never in league with Rupp, Wheating, and Centro Jr.... they need to send back those paychecks they cashed... at least Webb ran one of the fastest times ever... Willis and Brannen are just a pair crappy athletes who have been riding the hype for a decade... congrats to Willis on a silver* (* race doesnt even count since Ramzi was in it... if it had been a clean race not a chance in hell Willis gets a medal)
See my post 2 spots above for why you are WRONG. Willis and Brannen are on a far superior league when it comes to the mile than Rupp. Rupp may be better overall (but he actually isn't since Willis was Olympic Silver medallist and Rupp will probably never win anything) but not in the mile.
What??? wrote:
Mrr82 wrote:The michigan team would have left them in the dust however. Probably would have run with them for 3 legs, and then either Willis or Brannen would have dusted Rupp. No knock on Oregon, but it wouldn't have been much of a race come the last lap. Damn shame those two teams couldnt' match up.
Wall should have run Oregons other leg...hindsight sucks...
Willis and Brannen are both washed up, and were never in league with Rupp, Wheating, and Centro Jr.... they need to send back those paychecks they cashed... at least Webb ran one of the fastest times ever... Willis and Brannen are just a pair crappy athletes who have been riding the hype for a decade... congrats to Willis on a silver* (* race doesnt even count since Ramzi was in it... if it had been a clean race not a chance in hell Willis gets a medal)
redshirt
Oregon fully loaded vs. Michigan fully loaded would not be a bad race. My guess of an order in a match race would be:
Brannen vs. Centrowitz - even maybe Brannen piffs Centro-
Acosta vs. Ellerton - dead even
Rupp vs. Woods - I say Rupp outkicks Woods, giving Oregon a bit of a lead, Woods was inconsistent
Wheating vs. Willis - Wheating lets Willis back in to the lead, can he stay with him enough to outkick him?
Certainly a great run, but also, far more of a time-trial. How many guys can actually run sub-4 miles with no pacing and no competition?
I'd like to see some real competition for these guys - OTC ran a 16:25 or so - didn't really even pace the Ducks.
Next year they have potential to go under 16 minutes - no question.
Middle East Observer wrote:
Wheating vs. Willis - Wheating lets Willis back in to the lead, can he stay with him enough to outkick him?
You seriously think a guy who didn't advance out of the heats in the 800 (his event) could beat the 1500m silver medalist in a mile? Your analysis of the earlier legs suggests that you don't think he'd get more than 4-5 meters of a head start. If they raced 100 times Willis would win 99.
Also, Maag's 4:00 was from indoors a few years back so if they decide to train him for the mile instead of the 5K (he's run 13:41) he could probably throw down somewhere in the 3:55-3:56 range in a race, so give him 3:58-4:00 for a relay situation like this.
I vote next year at Penn Relays they have a USA vs The World vs Oregon 4xMile. Of course, loading the USA team would eliminate the chance of Oregon getting the american record and they already have the collegiate record so maybe they should just run the normal college 4xMile
it would be a good race between the old michigan team and current oregon team
wheating has to be on anchor, no one else would have a chance against willis in a kick and the other 3 legs are even enough that unless someone blows up it would come down to a one on one matchup...
I dont think wheating is quite on the level willis was at in the 1500 quite yet (didnt he run 3:32 while in college?)and willis has comparable 800 speed so even if it was slow hed hed have a chance, i may pick wheating by a hair then though (theyd have to split over 4:00 for that to happen though)
all just conjecture and means nothing however but interesting to think about
Congrats to Oregon, and I would not foucs what they could have done w/o Biwott's 4:05 becasue every 4xmile relay alway has a guy run about the same time or slower. The law of averages say you are never going get 4 guys on top of their game at the same time.
Btw, I see no reason why Oregon could not have done this at Penn. And for the people who say they ran way better than the Penn teams, keep in mind, that at the Penn those athletes are doubling and tripling. Not taking any thing away from Oregon's CR, but Villanova, Arkansas w/o a doubt under the same circumstances had teams in the late 70s to mid-80s that could have run faster. I could probably throw in the Michgan and Stanford teams of the late 90s as well.
Keep in mind that Penn is two weeks earlier in the sesaon and at Penn, the 4xmile (4x1500/1600) was alway run for victory and the 4x8 and DMR had more emphasis on time. Btw, the Penn Relays is like Boston Marathon, it is really about winning. Franklin Field is not the best place for time, the track is weird and not partically fast, the stadium has swirling winds and the weather is unpredictable.
Those Villanova and Arkansas teams had lots of 4 minute milers and one or two world class milers. Guys like Don Paige, Mark Belger, Eamonn Coghlan, Sydney Maree, Joe Falcon, Reuben Reina, Joe Falcon would have walked Rupp down even with a 20 meter lead.
With that said, I think Oregon is capable of running faster as well and Oregon did it with with only 1 or 2 true milers. Oregon ran a great time especially under the circumstances, but they needed to get under 16 to end the debate and shut up guys like me.
Middle East Observer wrote:
Oregon fully loaded vs. Michigan fully loaded would not be a bad race. My guess of an order in a match race would be:
Brannen vs. Centrowitz - even maybe Brannen piffs Centro-
Acosta vs. Ellerton - dead even
Rupp vs. Woods - I say Rupp outkicks Woods, giving Oregon a bit of a lead, Woods was inconsistent
Wheating vs. Willis - Wheating lets Willis back in to the lead, can he stay with him enough to outkick him?
This is a complete waste of time.
OREGON has the record !
Oregon is Faster ! (with a 4:05 leg next years team will be even faster with Acosta and Greer or Fleet or Maag)
Oregon won cross ! Oregon distance won Indoor ! and Oregon will win outdoor ! Michigan can't compete with that at all !
I would like to point out that 95 % of the topics discussed on this message board is a waste of time. Therefore, go ahead everyone, throw out your wildest scenarios.
For the record. Michigan would win hands down. That wamo guy post illustrates why quite well.
Ellerton 3:58 1:46
Willis 3:55 1:45
Woods 3:58 1:48
Brannen 3:55 1:46
Woods, Brennan and Willis could all run faster than what I just stated.
Centrowitz 3:56 1:47
Wheating 3:59 1:45
Kiptoo 3:58 1:47
Rupp 3:57 (what is Rupp's fastest mile ???) 1:50 (that was all he was able to run 1 week ago, I maybe give him a 1:48 at best, not an 800 guy, no muscles whatsoever)
What? I'm not comparing 2009 Willis to 2009 Wheating. Don't be dense. I'm comparing the CR teams when Willis was a great college runner. Willis still has the edge, but given a lead and Wheating's kicking ability it's closer has the edge.
blink wrote:
I would like to point out that 95 % of the topics discussed on this message board is a waste of time. Therefore, go ahead everyone, throw out your wildest scenarios.
For the record. Michigan would win hands down. That wamo guy post illustrates why quite well.
Ellerton 3:58 1:46
Willis 3:55 1:45
Woods 3:58 1:48
Brannen 3:55 1:46
Woods, Brennan and Willis could all run faster than what I just stated.
Centrowitz 3:56 1:47
Wheating 3:59 1:45
Kiptoo 3:58 1:47
Rupp 3:57 (what is Rupp's fastest mile ???) 1:50 (that was all he was able to run 1 week ago, I maybe give him a 1:48 at best, not an 800 guy, no muscles whatsoever)
All speculation but you and all the Penn fans can say what you want !
The record belongs to the 2009 Oregon Ducks !
It wouldn't even be close. In 2005 Willis ran a 3:32.38 1500 (eqv 3:50 mile). In 2005 Brannen ran a 3:35.7 (eqv 3:53 mile). These guys were head and shoulders above Wheating and Centrowitz and especially Rupp regarding the mile.