i could be wrong, but didn't goucher get close to 13:30 as a freshman?
i could be wrong, but didn't goucher get close to 13:30 as a freshman?
nevermind, it was 13:33 as a true soph.
Sagarin wrote:
Not to mention, Derrick attends Stanford, where the intellectual prowess of one's peer group only exacerbates the pressure cooker.
Do you really think the fact the Derrick is surrounded by smart people ups the pressure on him to run faster and perform better? I don't see it. Care to explain?
Sagarin- Though I agree with your point in general, it's worth pointing out that there were far less (any?) time-trial-type races back when Goucher and Davis were freshman.
Sagarin wrote:
While I don't doubt that Fernandez wasn't in peak form due to his lost training, I don't understand the bitter dispute as to who is better. Who cares? Both of these guys, along with other notables, herald the future of American distance running. We should be celebrating what Derrick accomplished -- an AJR on his home track no less. And I believe he's only the second American born runner ever to break 13:30 as a 19-year old (though I could be wrong here). I can still remember when Olympians Adam Goucher and Marc Davis ran something like 13:45 as freshman and just how ridiculous and untouchable those times seemed back then. Not to mention, Derrick attends Stanford, where the intellectual prowess of one's peer group only exacerbates the pressure cooker. This fall's NCAA XC championship should be a barn burner.
Derrick is 18 right now, he doesn't turn 19 until the fall. He's only about a month older than German.
Which one should is better, the runnerspace video or the flotrack one?
deacon wrote:
Everything's always that black and white, huh J.R.? Haha. Letsrun at it's finest!
Derrick won the race; and Derrick has the record.
Sagarin wrote:
While I don't doubt that Fernandez wasn't in peak form due to his lost training, I don't understand the bitter dispute as to who is better. Who cares? Both of these guys, along with other notables, herald the future of American distance running. We should be celebrating what Derrick accomplished -- an AJR on his home track no less. And I believe he's only the second American born runner ever to break 13:30 as a 19-year old (though I could be wrong here). I can still remember when Olympians Adam Goucher and Marc Davis ran something like 13:45 as freshman and just how ridiculous and untouchable those times seemed back then. Not to mention, Derrick attends Stanford, where the intellectual prowess of one's peer group only exacerbates the pressure cooker. This fall's NCAA XC championship should be a barn burner.
FYI, Derrick and Fernandez are both 18.
J.R.- Is "the [American Junior 5K] record" the biggest thing these two kids want in life? Oh, and there's still a lot of time left if GF runs a 5K or two over the summer...
cah87 wrote:
Derrick is 18 right now, he doesn't turn 19 until the fall. He's only about a month older than German.
Good call. Makes it even more impressive.
Not An Expert wrote:
Do you really think the fact the Derrick is surrounded by smart people ups the pressure on him to run faster and perform better? I don't see it. Care to explain?
That wasn't the point. The pressure to succeed academically is great at a school like Stanford and exacerbates the overall stress of the environment, which could potentially detract from training. When I was in college, I transferred from a state school where it was quite easy to achieve straight A's merely cramming the night before exams (in a pre-med curriculum no less) to a top 10 academic school in the west where one could do nothing but study all the time and barely manage a 3.0 average. The pressure cooker was immense, and it severely diminished the training environment because of all the perpetual stress.
Watch the interview with Lauren Centrowitz on Flotrack - she talks about this and how she manages to balance studying/running (GREAT time for her yesterday!).
mouse wrote:
Sagarin- Though I agree with your point in general, it's worth pointing out that there were far less (any?) time-trial-type races back when Goucher and Davis were freshman.
Yeah, that's a good point, but meets like Mt. Sac were still in existence, with deep, fast competition. By the way, I don't think it was Davis who ran 13:45, but someone else managed that time as a freshman back then. Can't remember who it was it was.
Now the bar has been raised. Sub 13:30 is the new standard.
Lean Wolf 21 wrote:
Congrat's to Derrick, that's a super time for a Junior.
No, it's actually the super-est time for a U.S. Junior.
That is part of running. Derrick lost time last spring and summer because he had MONO. Fernandez lost time after cross and then then during indoor. Part of running is staying injury free, and providing that does not happen, trying to make that injury have as little effect on training as possible. If Derrick won because he was in better fitness after Fernandez's injury, then so be it, his coaches obviously know what they are doing to keep him injury free. If that allows him to beat Fernandez who has been injured twice during his first year in college then that is part of running. In the end the best man on the day won.
Sagarin wrote:
While I don't doubt that Fernandez wasn't in peak form due to his lost training, I don't understand the bitter dispute as to who is better. Who cares? Both of these guys, along with other notables, herald the future of American distance running. We should be celebrating what Derrick accomplished -- an AJR on his home track no less. And I believe he's only the second American born runner ever to break 13:30 as a 19-year old (though I could be wrong here). I can still remember when Olympians Adam Goucher and Marc Davis ran something like 13:45 as freshman and just how ridiculous and untouchable those times seemed back then. Not to mention, Derrick attends Stanford, where the intellectual prowess of one's peer group only exacerbates the pressure cooker. This fall's NCAA XC championship should be a barn burner.
Dathan Ritzenhein ran 13:27 as a 19-year-old but he was born 2 days too early to get the AJR ... born 12/30/1982.
darkness wrote:
Dathan Ritzenhein ran 13:27 as a 19-year-old but he was born 2 days too early to get the AJR ... born 12/30/1982.
I was just going to say that
same old story wrote:
German > Chris...enough said
I'm going to mark your words since I heard it here first.
That's all well and good for Ritz. And my hat's off to him for all his successes over the years.
But remember, Derrick and Fernandez are only 18 years old right now. They also have birthdays late in the year. If you want to think of Ritz as somehow unofficially owning the junior record then you should compare his mark to what Fernandez and Derrick do next year when they will also be 19 yrs old (turning 20 late in the year). I would suggest that next year both of these phenoms will be well under 13:27.
same old story wrote:
German > Chris...enough said
Footlocker (2nd vs. distant 3rd), NCAA XC (7th vs. DNF), NCAA Indoor (4th/5th vs. DNS), and the 5k victory in an AJR all speak differently. I guess German can win in junior XC races that nobody other than him consider to as important as NCAAs.