NY Times (or Ritz) spreads lies in Boulder elite running article

I enjoyed the article a lot and thought it was great that it made the front page of the NY Times, even if it was below the fold. It's number 3 on their most emailed as well. Obviously this coverage is only because of the marathon coming up on Sun so it's nice to see stories promoting the sport.

As far as I know Mark Plaatjes is still a US citizen so although he's from South Africa, I think the article was a little misleading there.

The no americans take drugs was laughable and asking a coach if his athletes take drugs was a little pointless.

OED wrote:

[quote]swoosher wrote:

We have no problem thinking that our sprinters are often drugged, but we have a hard time believing that any of our distance runners would be using EPO? Money and fame can cause many people to do things that they wouldn't normally consider, regardless of nationality.

[quote]

This applies to our home-grown, white-skinned, distance runners as well. Drugs are a problem in all parts of the elite level even among the "slow" elites. By "problem" I'm not insuating that any one athlete is using PEDs. What I mean is that the pressure to use, and availablity of PEDs, is there for any athlete who cashes a check from a sponsor. And, as we all know, you don't have to be a gold medalist to be sponsored.

I agree 100%. I was trying to make the same point, but didn't articulate very well!

One thing that struck me as funny from the article was the reference to the good old times of the late 80s in Boulder. I was there back in those days and all of the old timers then complained about how much Boulder had changed for the worse. Although I still like Boulder very much, I did think it was very odd as well. There were some really gracious people that would welcome you into their homes and training groups, but also too many clickish, not-so-friendly folks. Too many people thought too highly of themselves. Very much a generalization and I apologize in advance to the good people of Boulder.

Pamela Chepchumba was with Dr Rosa when she tested positive.

blahblahblah wrote:

Pamela Chepchumba was with Dr Rosa when she tested positive.

nope, nope, nope. Fredrico Rosa THE MANAGER and Dr Rosa, THE COACH are different people.

Rosa had certainly had athletes test positive - at least one kenyan lady .

Father coaches athlete who is represented by the son --- duh if they are not connected.

The most obvious explanation for why a greater % of visible sprinters test positive for PEDs is that the drugs they are more likely to take (nandro, etc) are - for whatever reason - easier to detect. Everyone knows how unreliable EPO tests are and how the stuff clears within 24-48 hours based on the current testing standards. The anabolics and narco-based drugs that sprinters use show up more frequently because they take longer to clear the system.

US distance runners surely dope, and it is impossible to say they do so less than elite runners at large. The only thing they have going for them in their defense is that they are generally very slow.

No, you're closer to right than not. Even the old hobbyjoggers are mostly cliqueish and snobby. I think it's both funny and sad how so many people just intentionally limit themselves like that with their clannish attitudes. It's a human tendency, but a really primitive (read: outdated) one, especially for a city full of so many supposedly enlightened and educated people. You'd think with so much yoga/meditation and cannabis flowing freely through the 303 that they'd be able to lighten up some and not take themselves so very seriously.

Rosa was thrown out of cycling but welcomed into running by mutts like Mork...

Barry Bonds, El G....ain't a dimes worth of differance.

wasnt Kimbia's uta pipig a drug cheat?

Mork wrote:

"Dr Rosa has never had an athlete test positive. Not one of Rosa's athletes has ever been suspected."

You are either totally ignorant or a blood relative. He pretends not to speak English when questioned about illegal drug use. Ask Michael Sandrock. And look up all of his dirty cyclists.

Mork wrote:

"Hermans has never had an athlete test positive. There is no credible evidence that any of his athletes were dirty"

Hermans was the scientist behind the East German doping machine and was also involved with the Chinese swimmers. In Ethiopia, as soon as he is given a heads up that IAAF and WADA want to test his athletes, he loads them in a bus and drives them far out of reach in the back country until they leave after a day or two.

Mork wrote:

"Uta was cleared. Dieter has never had an athlete test positive."

Then why did golden girl Uta Pippig serve a two year suspension and never come back to where she was? This would have been major news if she had been cleared, not hearsay from Mork.

Mork wrote:

"Don't believe what you read on bathroom stalls."

The Spanish distance runners who fared a little too well in 1999-2002 worked with the same specialist who doped up their cross country skier in Park City who got popped at the Olympic Games. They were on the same doping regimen.

The documents about Cierpinski´s doping is public reading, not just something Shorter saw.

steffo wrote:The documents about Cierpinski´s doping is public reading, not just something Shorter saw.

I've followed the discussion about that topic as it's brought up on here from time to time, and I've read similar comments in other threads, yet nobody (in what I remember seeing) has actually provided some sort of proof. Lot's of firm opinions, for sure, but no proof.

As I said, I don't deny that he was dirty, I just don't believe it (for the time being). I realize the difference may be too subtle for some people, but it's not for me.

Can you provide a credible reference to back up your statement? Not some other poster chiming in, but a link to a peer-reviewed document, or similar source. What is this "public reading" to which you refer? I'm pretty sure others have asked similar questions when this has come up before, and nobody has offered anything tangible, which is why I continue to hold this particular issue in a state of blissful indifference.

I'll be honest with you - and I'm sure this'll get some people worked up - I feel similarly about the Chinese ladies. I don't deny they were dirty, and will never tell anyone they weren't, but neither will I say they were dirty (until convinced otherwise, and frankly I don't see that happening - to me fast times are not proof of a doping offence). Hearing people say it over and over and over again doesn't make it true.

Thanks for that analysis. Wanting clear proof doesn't mean one's head is in the sand. It means caring enough about the sport and the people in it to be optimistic, not pessimistic.

I hold to the belief that runners can be great without drugs, and that many of our heroes were in fact clean.

P. Hilton wrote: grassy knolls, grassy knolls

Your response speaks for itself.

FieldofDreams wrote:

I don't understand what Robbins was hoping to get out of her article.

She wasn't trying to "get" anything out of her article -- she was simply reporting on a phenomenon that has been widely discussed in running circles. The fact that there are so many elites around Boulder but they don't tend to work together has come up frequently on these boards in the past few years. When Wetmore decided to close the CU track to the public, that was a very hot topic on these boards.

A lot of the best journalism consists of finding subjects that are hot topics within specialized communities, and explaining them to the outside world. To the members of that specialized community, the result almost always looks oversimplified. But to the general public, it's a fascinating window into a world they know nothing about. That's why this article has stayed on the Times most-emailed list. There's no ulterior motive on the part of the author -- she's just saying, "Here's how things work in this strange little world, and here's what they're talking about."

Good! So what? You are acquainted with American distance runners, are you with the Kenyans? Then why do you have a doubt in Kenyan runners??? Germany and Kenya and Ethiopians are three different places in the world to compare, especially their running talent. First how many Kenyans per tear test positive???? How many America professional runners test positive???, not even to mention NO test in your high schools, where I have no doubt that they are unclean. 99.1% of all the road running, and track are and have been won by Kenyans, NOT because we are drug cheats, but because we have a passion, desire and the hunger to train and become good. We are not looking for fame either, like Ritz who want to embarrass himself this weekend by his ass being kicked, we just love the sports like the way Americans love football, and basketball. I think you are one of the most illiterate person as far as Kenyan runners is concerned, and you will never learn anything until you train and live with Kenyans. Hey, how about this, go to Kenya, or be reading chasingkimbia.com, may be you will be imparted some knowledge.

Mork is Ric Rojas