WEBB 3:46 (1500m)

Well, it's gonna take a lot more speed than 3:46 to 'run a really good 5000'. Hopefully this will bust a whole lotta rust off his wheels, but it's hard to imagine him getting back down to 3:32 this year.

malmo wrote:

Mel wrote:

Actually, I don't get why he's racing if he can't break 3:46. That's 14 seconds off his p.r.! He should be able to do that with one hand tied behind is back. If he's that rusty he needs to be training, not racing. Malmo, you're an expert,do your really think he should be racing if his form is this off?

YES. The purpose of training isn't to train, it's to race.

Actually, I thought the purpose of training was to get in SHAPE to race, shape he doesn't seem to have right now. When he's doing workouts that indicate sub-3:40 shape at least, THEN race, otherwise what's the point? Getting you're butt kicked by second-stringers?

Give it a week or two and you will see that he's in better shape than 3:46. There's no way he's going all the way to Europe and showing up for those big meets to run 3:45/13:30.

Mel wrote:

Actually, I thought the purpose of training was to get in SHAPE to race, shape he doesn't seem to have right now. When he's doing workouts that indicate sub-3:40 shape at least, THEN race, otherwise what's the point? Getting you're butt kicked by second-stringers?

You should be taking notes not teaching class.

I hope you're right. But man, how does he go from 3:46 to sub-3:35 in a month or so? Can anybody think of a top guy who improved that much in the space of a few weeks?

Since Malmo was posting on this thread, did you ever drop 25-30 seconds off your steeple time in 4-6 weeks? To me, that's racing yourself into shape, which I think is not the best way to go.

YES. The purpose of training isn't to train, it's to race.[/quote]

Right on man.

Mel wrote:

Since Malmo was posting on this thread, did you ever drop 25-30 seconds off your steeple time in 4-6 weeks? To me, that's racing yourself into shape, which I think is not the best way to go.

Yes. Similar situation, coming off injury. 8:48.8 to 8:22.5, two weeks.

Mel wrote:

I hope you're right. But man, how does he go from 3:46 to sub-3:35 in a month or so? Can anybody think of a top guy who improved that much in the space of a few weeks?

Sorry I didn't answer both parts of the question.

The benefits of training are accumulated from overlapping periods of time. In a broader perspective the years add up. In a more general perspective, the aggragation of the current year's training adds up. Webb has had an outstanding current year training. Little bumps in the road like injuries are just bumps in the road - they don't set a highly trained runner back all that much. The current results are not a reflecton of long term fitness. It doesn't take long for things to get clicking again.

Most of you read WAY to much into results. If Webb is over his hamstring problem, look for things to turn quickly.

If you guys look at the results, you'll see the race was won in 3:41. This probably means the pace was slow early. If it had been fast, Webb might have ran 3:40, which wouldn't be all that bad. He's in a slump right now but it's not like he hasn't been there before. He'll be back, even if it takes till next year.

Webb is coached by Slow-twitch Raczko. His time should be viewed with this fact is mind.

malmo i'm sorry but anyone who sees anything good in this result is deluding themselves. read all of flynn's statements so far since 27:34, carefully. the webb team blew it and the proof continues into early july. if webb is very lucky things will turn around. but please don't talk like this result is good or part of a big scheme.

if i were webb i would rather run a 3:46 in practice than in front of people.

Webb usually needs a string of good races to do really well for the main part of the season. This is not a WC or OLY year, so I wouldn't put too much emphasis on his form. It's not unusual for some elites to vanish from the international scene on non WC/OLY years only to amazingly come back into form when it counts.

If you think about it, relatively speaking, Eliud Kipchoge is having a shitty year as well. He went from beating to 2 of the greatest in an epic 5000m race in 2003 to almost getting beaten by Goucher at PRE! Not to mention he has gone from #1 Kenyan to maybe #4 now after his performance at Dubai and PRE.

Hell, even the king of the 5000m is having a shitty year, he LOST a race to a kenyan!!! and he looked sluggish in that race too.

Need more? How about Gebre Gebramariam...where the hell did this guy go?? He was a sub 27 10k guy(?) and a sub 13 guy not too long ago and looked like the #2/#3 man in the world.

2006 has no motivation.

malmo wrote:

Are any of you 12 year olds runners? Nothing's "weird" about this. He tweaked his hamstring over a month ago and this is his first race back since then. If his hammy is feeling OK after this one, the result is encouraging. Things will fall back into place quickly.

12 seconds over his PR for 12th place is definitely concerning.

It was strange about that outstanding 10K performance. For someone who trains as lightly as Webb is alleged to do, I wonder if that race, which was an absolute killer in terms of effort, didn't do something to his body. Which led to his training getting messed up. As talented as he is, maybe that Cardinal 10K was something he was not prepared to do, despite the excellent result?

I wouldn't say Webb trains lightly, though I know what you mean. His mileage is low for a 10K runner, however his plyos, weights and other work is pretty intense. Seems from the outside he wasn't ready for the 10K like you say.

starmiler wrote:

It was strange about that outstanding 10K performance. For someone who trains as lightly as Webb is alleged to do, I wonder if that race, which was an absolute killer in terms of effort, didn't do something to his body. Which led to his training getting messed up. As talented as he is, maybe that Cardinal 10K was something he was not prepared to do, despite the excellent result?

Here is how the race went in Belgium last night. Brutal rabbit who went through 800m in 2:01 and was supposed to go 1:55-6 which lead to a very tight pack and a rough race. Times were not only slow but not alot of guys were able to get out of the jumble.

I think everyone agrees that 10k was a mistake. In future he will probably stick with the 1500. He is a miler pure and simple.

I don't understand why he would skip USATF and even line up in a race one week later.

Nothing came out of that race other than damaging his confidence and confirming there is no rhythm in his cadence.

He could normally jog two laps, touch his toes, go out in 2:02 and run 3:46 any time of the year in any conditions.

This isn't even a workout.

He skipped USATF because he wasn't ready and probably should have stayed away from any races for now. I'm sure he'll be fine but has to learn how to listen to his body. I hope he got some money out of this.