Like I said there is an alternative universe out there where she goes full Lance Armstrong and is running 14:05. But seems way too well adjusted for it to happen in this one.
It's not even debatable that men's NCAA running is deeper than the women's. Women's running may be increasing in depth, but so is men's running.
But comparing the two historically, women may (or may not) actually be increasing in depth more so than the men. Trying to make the case either way by looking at the race result of just one woman runner is ridiculous.
Are you new to running? If the top woman in the NCAA is further behind the world class women than what the 20th guy in the NCAA is behind world class men, it doesn't get better for NCAA women bybworking away from the top woman.
Are you new to running? If the top woman in the NCAA is further behind the world class women than what the 20th guy in the NCAA is behind world class men, it doesn't get better for NCAA women bybworking away from the top woman.
But the numbers are what they are when it comes to NCAA men's depth vs. women's. Its worth thinking about why that is. I certainly don't know for sure what causes that. It could be one or more of the following:
1. A gap in the developmental opportunities for pre-collegiate women, in the U.S. and/or abroad.
2. The men's 5000 meter world record could be soft.
3. The women's 5000 meter world record could be doped.
4. There could be hormonal and/or other biological differences between college age men and women that mean women's development curves are different.
5. NCAA women's performances could improve if there were changes in the volume and intensity of their training.
6. Any host of other reasons I can't think of as an active but not professional observer of the sport.
Ok. If you want to discuss why the men's college times are closer to the world record than the women's that is one thing, but the original post and title come across as yet another thread dunking on Tuohy and its getting old.
Of the options you laid out for why men in college are closer to WR #3 & #4 are most plausible, probably both.
When men hit puberty the increased testosterone gives them a more linear improvement trajectory that doesn't really slow down, whereas for women in adolescence their bodies get hit with estrogen and continue to change for several years in ways that slow them down. Many stall and plateau in late HS and then (hopefully) pick up their progression in college once they work through the changes and adjust. It is not as linear as for men.
Re doping. All I can say is that the current American 5k record holder is Shelby Houlihan, and she is pretty far off the world record too at 14:23. If it takes a doper to even get close, well.... people can draw their own conclusions.
He was just giving a reality check to the crazed fans. Semihaze has made it clear that he is new to running and no idea about history or world class runners. Facts are facts. Seems like Tuohy fans hate facts and that gives Tuohy a bad reputation amongst overall track fans.
There are multiple points trying to be debated and extrapolated by looking at just one female runner. The case for whether there is a relative increase in depth between the women and men has not been made with just that single data point.
Her American record is the American record. Trying to discount it as doped is false and will get you banned.
All I am pointing out is that the American women's 5k record, which is very far off the WR as it is, is held by someone who is currently banned right now for doping. Those are all facts.
You can spend less time looking than writing and you will have your answer. Men's fields were deeper and have gotten deeper. And they are much closer to elites. Women's running in the NCAA has a long way to go.
Her American record is the American record. Trying to discount it as doped is false and will get you banned.
All I am pointing out is that the American women's 5k record, which is very far off the WR as it is, is held by someone who is currently banned right now for doping. Those are all facts.
Tuohy is a very good collegiate runner. She is not elite. She seems like a very nice person.
Danielson murdered his wife. Does his time still count?
I don't know. Did he test positive for nandrolone within 6 months of setting the American record also? Because Houlihan did. Set the record July 10 2020, Dec 15 2020 test date.
Look, the OP raised doped records as a possible reason for the gap between men and women in NCAA and thecworld record. I think that is plausible, but certainly not the only reason for the gap between men's and women's times.
That means the world class women are pulling firther away from college women. There is your answer. The gap between 1-50 for men in the 5000 outdoor 2022 was 1/2 what it was for women.