Road Racing and Training Thread Week Ending 12/30/2018

Western Iowa has some loess hills that formed. Somewhat rare compared to the regular garden variety moraine or drumlin.

OR -- Thanks. Yeah, it's disappointing and frustrating, but I enjoyed a couple good years. Despite months of down-time, I set a few age-graded PRs and had a lot of fun racing and being back "on the scene." There's a lot of non-running goals I need to focus on now. Meanwhile, I will be following your training and racing. Boston!

Pappy -- Those Loess Hills formations are incredible. I've never seen them in person. Except for a wedding reception in Michigan years ago, I've only flown over the Midwest. Maybe worth another road trip, eh?

At the start of this year I thought that loess was just a nonparametric regression technique and that drumlin was simply a 2002 film starring Nick Cannon, yet both are hills.

Allen - Crank on that bike! I find it very enjoyable .. not as much as running but close. I think its gonna treat me good for spring racin

runrincerepeat wrote:

Crank on that bike!

What's another name for over-50 cyclists with bad knees? "Former runners."

You're for sure building some serious strength and resilience with all those single-speed miles. Are you clipped onto the pedals? Pulling on the upstroke I think offers some strength-balancing for the anterior muscles. Interestingly, however, I have read that the upstroke of elite cyclists contributes very little to their total power output.

In 2017 I viewed my cycling as a necessary evil, as I managed through knee problems. But in hindsight, it's probably a good strategy even when healthy. Like, 50 miles of running plus 50 miles of biking is "better" then 65 miles per week of running only, for injury-prone runners. Especially in old age.

My road bike is now set up on the magnetic trainer, and I've been spinning for 20 minutes most mornings. At this point, I'm mainly breaking-in my butt after a year without riding. I need to be ready to roll as soon as spring weather arrives (double-century planned for end of June).

RRR - Re: bicycling, I would add that, barring mechanical breakdowns and BSD weather. I actually enjoy cycling more than running. Well, casual riding, anyway. I would rather compete in a running race, though. mainly because I am so poor at bike racing. I'm way too uncoordinated to safely compete in a tight group on the bike, and pathetically weak, as well. In time trials and triathlons, I've barely broken 20 mph, even as a youth. At 56, I only managed about 20.3 mph for the 30K bike portion of a kayak-bike-run triathlon.

dunno what BSD stands for, but I meant "bad weather."

Allen: Very sorry to hear the knees are still not behaving. Having dealt with chondromalacia myself on several occasions, I know how frustrating it can be. Sometime in the spring of my senior year in high school, I took a tumble and gave myself a pop on the kneecap, just as you did a while back now. Didn't seem like that big of a deal when I did it, but the next day it hurt to run, and for a while, no matter what I did, it seemed to get worse rather than better. Couldn't run at all for a while, not even a few steps, and if I let it get or stay in the wrong position it would lock up and I would be unable to bend it without serious discomfort.

It did ease up somewhat after I had stopped running for a few weeks, and I was able to walk and bike ok, but I did virtually no running all summer. Then, having no idea what I was getting myself into, I showed up for my first college cross-country practice, ran eight miles without pain, and went on to run about fifty miles a week (much higher than I had ever done before) without any problems other than being embarrassingly slow. (I suspect that changing shoes - no more Nikes! - may have been helpful.) After that I really had no problems with the knee until several years after college when, yes, I fell and gave it a pop again. Didn't take as long to recover that time, as I recall (taping helped!), but long enough to be plenty frustrating. And then it was gone again.

So, while I know that these things are different for everybody, and that they're definitely different when you're in your teens or twenties, my experience is that this kind of knee problem can be one of those things that seems like it's never going to get better until it just does, and then you can be back to whatever normal is for you. With that in mind, I would encourage you to get/stay as fit as you can doing whatever you can do without too much/the wrong kind of pain, try to stay on track with that through the winter, and then see where you're at. Whether it gets better or not, it may be worth the optimism of a Pascal's wager, anyway.

Allen - No clips .. just BMX style platform pedals and I wear some Energy Boosy shoes which are fairly rigid and the continental rubber grips well... Yeah I prob wont race much on bike besides that Duathlon in April and its no drafting anyways which I like. Yeah the SS in the hills will bring strength ,, i run a 46/16 gear so 75 gear inches which is pretty hefty when its not perfect flat. Was crap weather all week and it was a transition to elliptical work week anyways so didnt get a ton of bike miles.. but today was 63 and sunny so got 60 mile in.. Was amazing weather for Jan here.

runrincerepeat wrote:

I run a 46/16 gear so 75 gear inches which is pretty hefty when its not perfect flat. ... today was 63 and sunny so got 60 mile in.. Was amazing weather for Jan here.

How in heck do you muscle your machine up those Arkansas hills, pushing a 75-inch gear?! My lowest gear is 49.3 inches (42/23), and I've almost stalled on steep climbs. Fortunately, no hills like that when riding from home. Wow, amazing ride for you today!

It was 36 degrees here, with almost no wind ... was tempting to take the bike out. But I went for a jog instead ... suffered through 11-minute miles. Last week, I fell three times shuffling along at that pace. With no knee lift, I guess even a pebble is a tripping hazard. I'm sure it didn't help to fall on my knee yet again. At least it was onto the relatively soft shoulder.

GFMAH -- Thanks for that encouragement. I won't give up completely, although I really do need to focus on other things for a while. And the knee pain is a good excuse.

OR -- Tonight's beverage is the Big Ditch (Buffalo, NY) IPA, "Hayburner." Served with a simple comfort food entre (shepard's pie). Have a good evening!

Allen - Sorry to see that your knees are still a problem. Enjoy the time you have with your brother. The double century should be a good time for the both of you. I hope you have a good route planned in terms of scenery, fueling and hydration logistics, and some amount of elevation change. FWIW my first century was a double over two days. Out and back along Skyline Drive here in VA. If I lived where OR does, I would have an annual National Park pass and hit up Skyline Drive a few times a year.

Speaking of OR - I've been meaning to mention that I am happy to see that you are working with Stone to add a new stimulus to your training. I really hope it works out because would like to see you do well at Boston and hopefully have an AG podium finish. I think you still have some room to improve, but I think your performance at Richmond indicated that you were nearing a plateau with way you had been training.

RRR - I was reluctant to go clipless, but I ended up doing it and now I really like it. One of the main things is that your foot is always where it is supposed to be. No shifting around even when your feet are wet etc. Yes you can pull up on the pedal, but that is not my main reason for sticking with clipless. I use mountain bike style clipless (Shimano SPD) on my commuter and road style clipless (Shimano SPD-SL) on my 'weekend bike'. Mountain bike clipless is a lot easier to clip in vs. the road pedals which to me is a bit of an issue when you are mixed in with traffic and want to get rolling quickly. I'm thinking of switching my weekend bike over to Speedplay from the SPD-SL just so that I can clip in more quickly. Going clipless is kind of intimidating in a similar way to strapping on a snowboard, but it becomes a non-issue once you get used to it. If you ever decide to take the plunge, let me know and I will give you some tips like you will fall at least once clipped it and it is not that bad and that you should go into grassy area and fall at least once just so you can see that it is not that bad and learn not worry about breaking the fall. Helmet required though.

I have been thinking recently that maybe I should invest in a helmet. Backwards cap doesn’t provide a ton of protection! If I decide to go clipless will let you know but it’s doubtful at this point. I also like dancing on the pedals a tad

Allen - yeah when I first got it that gear kicked my a$$ all last summer. But I do believe rolling hills on it and grinding it out Gave me more top end speed that showed at 5k. According to Garmin at 5k pace my stride was lengthened and stronger than before I got that bike.

Still Improving wrote:

I hope you have a good route planned in terms of scenery, fueling and hydration logistics, and some amount of elevation change.

The approximate route, with elevation profile. The final version is 201 miles.

Never mind. That didn't load properly.

Allen - Sorry I am chiming in late...but better late than never, eh? Got home kind of late from work (had a very interesting conversation with the boss, a former pro runner), and then I had to run in the dark after I got home. I was not feeling well this morning, and with the rain (again), I did not run. And so I made up the miles tonight, feeling a bit better, but still congested. It is amazing, though, how good I feel when running late in the day—even though I am fighting off a cold. I ran 8.5 at 7:03 overall pace and it felt like absolutely nothing...like a jog/walk. I tried as hard as I could to hold back, knowing that I am under the weather and that I have a quality long run lined up for tomorrow.

I had a meatball sub tonight and a protein/recovery drink. My kids also gave me some organic Doritos (yummy).

Please keep chiming in on Fri. and/or Sat, as I enjoy it very much.

Best of the best to you, my friend.

OR -- You're a dedicated runner. Do you wear a headlamp? Fortunately, my work schedule for the past few decades has mostly allowed for daylight runs. And many years ago when it didn't, I lived in a city with street lights and sidewalks. Which, of course, presented its own challenges.

Great run. Hope you're feeling better.

Thanks, Allen. Yes, I wear a headlamp. The headlamp, combined with some street lights here and there in town, makes night runs doable, but I still have to be careful.

I took a hot shower, and it helped clear me out. I also downed some cold medicine, as I really need a good night’s sleep tonight.