Can we talk about that Scott Fauble Citius Mag Podcast (December 19, 2018)

Aborted -the Podcast

Never Got Pass The Strava Ad wrote:

Aborted -the Podcast

You don't like Strava?!

This is why I can't listen to or take seriously the fanboy media much. Chavez knew Fauble wanted to tee off on the entirely justified criticism of US men in the marathon over the past few years that has amplified this fall with the results from Chicago, NYC, and CIM. So he set him up to rant with mental contortions galore and zero thoughtful critical questioning to check him. It's gutless and fawning. And entirely transparent.

I like Scott Fauble. But does he realize the top American at NYC was six minutes behind the winner? SIX MINUTES. The only competitive American marathoner is Rupp.

Does he also realize that Keitany, a woman, ran her second half faster than every American man? I don't care if she walked the first 13.1, this should never, ever happen. The USA men's marathon program is an embarrassment and a joke on the world stage.

OP, I 100% agree with you. His defense of American marathoners made no sense. We all know that if you took the top 5, 7, 10, 25, 50, etc. from every country and scored it like XC. The US would not be even close to Ethiopia and Kenya.

Fauble did have a good point about Jared Ward placing 6th in Rio. So fast times don't necessarily translate to great finishes, but at the same time they are closely related!

We don't actually have a USA marathon program. We have people who run marathons and there are groups. But there is no overall program. That said, USA marathon running might be an embarrassment and joke on the world stage compared to Kenya's and Ethiopia's. But so is everyone else's aside from Japan. We certainly are competitive with, and probably better than, any other country Someone here said that Rupp is our only marathon runner who is competitive. Well, at least we've got one. Of this year's top 50 times there are three non Kenyans or Ethiopians. One is from Bahrain so that's really another Kenyan, one is Rupp, two are from Japan.

Whether by commission or by omission, the USA absolutely does have a marathon development system. The only real question is how effective it is or could be. Entities of influence and power certainly could partner to form an improved system. That's why I don't have time for old timers who gripe about how talent in the US (or UK or wherever) isn't identified and developing like it did in their day. That was a different day and the sport existed in a different context. People like the Hansons, Rosario, even the much maligned AlSal committed themselves and stuck to their vision to make a difference. The trolls like to lob bombs of hot hair at them, but they are in the arena doing the work with faces covered in proverbial dust. Plenty of other names of great stature with opinions flat out are not.

red glare wrote:

bombs of hot hair

Just have to lol at my own typo

I have a better idea

27:30 AMERICANS like Chris Derrick stick to the track instead of cashing in to get blown away by SEVEN MINUTES in a marathon.

Coffee Monster wrote:

OP, I 100% agree with you. His defense of American marathoners made no sense. We all know that if you took the top 5, 7, 10, 25, 50, etc. from every country and scored it like XC. The US would not be even close to Ethiopia and Kenya.

Fauble did have a good point about Jared Ward placing 6th in Rio. So fast times don't necessarily translate to great finishes, but at the same time they are closely related!

Absolutely Ward (or is it Word now?) is a guy flying under the radar, but it's hard to say "we aren't losing in the marathon, look at these results _____" and then cite to 2 races were (in my opinion), USA didn't prove much. I'm hoping Nike/NOP (legitimate or not) can pull tougher some performances from Rupp and.... Puskedra? Or whoever else they have up there. Something to give US marathoning a little spark (the way Shalane and co. have done on the women's side!).

Let's split the difference and call it a semi system. There is no nationwide, coordinated, plan to improve marathon performances but there are a number of piecemeal efforts that have some impact, all of which, in my opinion, should be appreciated. As an old timer myself, I'd say that there is more done today to develop talent than there ever was in my day. Back then the "system" was "if you want to run marathons go ahead and do it."

What’s a guy like Fauble supposed to say? “Yeah, we suck”??

I listened to the podcast and agree that his XC scoring analogy for NYC is flawed but you gotta like his confidence. He’s only run 2 marathons and will only get better. If Ward can place 6 in Rio, Fauble can run well on a difficult Tokyo course.

These guys are all we got, they are working hard, and they have my support

All the marathons this fall proved that American men continue to train for 5 minute miles, while the rest of the world is training for 3 minute kilometers. There’s no difference in talent. We’ll continue to be stuck at a bunch of American men at 2:12-16, while the rest of the non-African world is batting 2:06-10.

Scubacane wrote:

What’s a guy like Fauble supposed to say? “Yeah, we suck”??

I listened to the podcast and agree that his XC scoring analogy for NYC is flawed but you gotta like his confidence. He’s only run 2 marathons and will only get better. If Ward can place 6 in Rio, Fauble can run well on a difficult Tokyo course.

These guys are all we got, they are working hard, and they have my support

Nice! Great! Excellent! I REALLY LOVE how you decided to just jump 100% the other way your rhetorical. You argue like my wife; SUPER EFFECTIVE!

No, child. Fauble just needs to be honest and realistic. Yes, we all support them and we all want USA Men to succeed. Sure there's a lot of BS flying on LRC and the unregistered nature allows a lot more latitude for expressed opinions, but I think most everyone here has these guys' backs.

Maybe don't say much at all either way; just be realistic that USA Mens Marathoning is still building its depth, but has a strong 15 years of results from it's leader of the pack (Meb, Hall, Ritz, Rupp).

miles vs kilometers wrote:

All the marathons this fall proved that American men continue to train for 5 minute miles, while the rest of the world is training for 3 minute kilometers. There’s no difference in talent. We’ll continue to be stuck at a bunch of American men at 2:12-16, while the rest of the non-African world is batting 2:06-10.

Here are the top 50 times for 2018. Where are the non Africans batting 2:06-2:10 aside from two Japanese? Are they all really batting 2:08-2:10? Do you have a list that goes beyond the top 50?

MARATHON

2:01:39 Eliud Kipchoge (Ken) 09/16 Berlin

2:04:00 Mosinet Geremew (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:02 Leul Gebrselassie (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:06 Lawrence Cherono (Ken) 10/21 Amsterdam

Asefa Mengistu (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

Tamirat Tola (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:08 Sisay Lemma (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:15 Berhanu Legesse (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:17 ———Kipchoge 04/22 London

2:04:31 ———Gebrselassie 12/02 Valencia

**10 performances by 8 performers**

2:04:37 Mule Wasihun (Eth) 10/21 Amsterdam

2:04:40 Solomon Deksisa (Eth) 10/21 Amsterdam

(10)

2:04:43 El Hassan El Abbassi (Bhr) 12/02 Valencia

2:04:44 Abdiwak Tura (Eth) 01/26 Dubai

2:04:49 Tola Shura (Eth) 04/22 London

2:04:53 Mathew Kisorio (Ken) 12/02 Valencia

2:05:11 Mo Farah (GB) 10/07 Chicago

2:05:21 Tsegaye Kebede (Eth) 12/02 Valencia

Emmanuel Saina (Ken) 09/23 Buenos Aires

2:05:22 Nobert Kigen (Ken) 12/02 Valencia

2:05:26 El Mahjoub Dazza (Mor) 12/02 Valencia

2:05:30 Dickson Chumba (Ken) 02/25 Tokyo

(20)

2:05:44 Kenneth Kipkemoi (Ken) 04/08 Rotterdam

2:05:50 Abera Kuma (Eth) 04/08 Rotterdam

Suguru Osako (Jpn) 10/07 Chicago

2:05:56 Kelkile Gezahegn (Eth) 04/08 Rotterdam

2:05:58 Laban Korir (Ken) 04/08 Rotterdam

2:05:59 Lelisa Desisa (Eth) 11/04 New York

2:06:07 *Galen Rupp (Nike Ore. Proj.) 05/06 Prague

2:06:11 Yuta Shitara (Jpn) 02/25 Tokyo

2:06:15 Gideon Kipketer (Ken) 10/21 Amsterdam

2:06:21 Sammy Kitwara (Ken) 12/02 Valencia

(30)

2:06:23 Amos Kipruto (Ken) 09/16 Berlin

2:06:24 Kaan Kigen Özbilen (Tur) 10/21 Amsterdam

Solomon Yego (Ken) 12/02 Valencia

2:06:25 Paul Lonyangata (Ken) 04/08 Paris

2:06:26 Geoffrey Kamworor (Ken) 11/04 New York

2:06:29 Abraham Kiptum (Ken) 04/01 Daegu

2:06:35 Evans Korir (Ken) 04/01 Daegu

2:06:41 Martin Kosgey (Ken) 10/28 Frankfurt

Ernest Ngeno (Ken) 04/08 Paris

2:06:45 Geoffrey Kirui (Ken) 10/07 Chicago

(40)

2:06:47 Tadu Abate (Eth) 10/21 Amsterdam

2:06:48 Wilson Kipsang (Ken) 09/16 Berlin

2:06:49 Peter Some (Ken) 04/01 Daegu

2:06:51 Jonathan Korir (Ken) 10/21 Amsterdam

2:06:54 Hirohito Inoue (Jpn) 02/25 Tokyo

2:06:57 Wilson Loyanai (Ken) 03/18 Seoul

2:07:00 Yitayal Atnafu (Eth) 04/08 Paris

2:07:03 Mark Korir (Ken) 03/18 Seoul

2:07:07 Abel Kirui (Ken) 04/22 London

2:07:09 Alex Kibet (Ken)

To belabor the point a bit further, expanding this year's list to around 100 and you get a handful more Japanese, a Brit I didn't see originally, a Ugandan, a Turk, who may well have started off as a Kenyan, someone from Burundi. So if the rest of the world is batting in that 2:06-2:10 range it's doing it in the slowest seection.

Eliud Kipchoge (KEN), 2:01:39, Berlin, 16 SEP 2018

2:01:39 Eliud KIPCHOGE KEN 1 Berlin 16 SEP

2:04:00 Mosinet GEREMEW ETH 1 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:02 Leul GEBRESILASE ETH 2 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:06 Tamirat TOLA ETH 3 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:06 Lawrence CHERONO KEN 1 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:04:06 Asefa MENGSTU ETH 4 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:08 Sisay LEMMA ETH 5 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:15 Birhanu LEGESE ETH 6 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:17 Eliud KIPCHOGE KEN 1 London 22 APR

2:04:30 Leul GEBRSELASSIE ETH 1 Valencia 02 DEC

2:04:37 Mule WASIHUN ETH 2 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:04:40 Solomon DEKSISA ETH 3 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:04:43 El Hassan El ABBASAI BRN 2 Valencia 02 DEC

2:04:44 Seifu TURA ETH 7 Dubai 26 JAN

2:04:47 Tola SHURA ETH 2 London 22 APR

2:04:53 Matthew KISORIO KEN 3 Valencia 02 DEC

2:05:11 Mo FARAH GBR 1 Chicago 07 OCT

2:05:14 Mosinet GEREMEW ETH 2 Chicago 07 OCT

2:05:20 Tsegaye KEBEDE ETH 4 Valencia 02 DEC

2:05:21 Emmanuel SAINA KEN 1 Buenos Aires 23 SEP

2:05:21 Norbert KIGEN KEN 5 Valencia 02 DEC

2:05:26 El Mahjoub DAZZA MAR 6 Valencia 02 DEC

2:05:30 Dickson CHUMBA KEN 1 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:05:44 Kenneth KIPKEMOI KEN 1 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:05:50 Abera KUMA ETH 2 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:05:50 Suguru OSAKA JPN 3 Chicago 07 OCT

2:05:56 Kelkile GEZAHEGNE ETH 3 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:05:57 Kenneth KIPKEMOI KEN 4 Chicago 07 OCT

2:05:58 Laban KORIR KEN 4 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:05:59 Lelisa DESISA ETH 1 New York 04 NOV

2:06:01 Shura KITATA ETH 2 New York 04 NOV

2:06:07 Galen RUPP USA 1 Prague 06 MAY

2:06:11 Yuta SHITARA JPN 2 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:06:15 Gideon KIPKETER KEN 4 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:06:20 Sammy KITWARA KEN 7 Valencia 02 DEC#

2:06:21 FARAH GBR 3 London 22 APR

2:06:21 Galen RUPP USA 5 Chicago 07 OCT

2:06:23 Amos KIPRUTO KEN 2 Berlin 16 SEP

2:06:24 Kaan ÖZBILEN TUR 5 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:06:24 Solomon Kirwa YEGO KEN 8 Valencia 02 DEC

2:06:25 Paul LONYANGATA KEN 1 Paris 08 APR

2:06:26 Geoffrey KWAMWOROR KEN 3 New York 04 NOV

2:06:29 Abraham KIPTUM KEN 1 Daegu 01 APR

2:06:33 Amos KIPRUTO KEN 3 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:06:33 Laban KORIR KEN 6 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:06:34 DEKSISA ETH 1 Hamburg 29 APR

2:06:35 Evans Kipkoech KORIR KEN 2 Daegu 01 APR

2:06:36 Mathew KISORIO KEN 2 Paris 08 APR

2:06:37 Kelkile WOLDAREGAY ETH 1 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:06:41 Ernest NGENO KEN 3 Paris 08 APR

2:06:41 Martin Kiprugut KOSGEY KEN 2 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:06:45 Geoffrey KIRUI KEN 6 Chicago 07 OCT

2:06:47 Gideon KIPKETER KEN 4 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:06:47 Tadu ABATE ETH 7 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:06:48 Wilson KIPSANG KEN 3 Berlin 16 SEP

2:06:49 Peter Kimeli SOME KEN 3 Daegu 01 APR

2:06:51 Jonathan KORIR KEN 8 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:06:54 Hiroto INOUE JPN 5 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:06:54 Tadu ABATE ETH 2 Hamburg 29 APR

2:06:57 Wilson Loyanae ERUPE KEN 1 Seoul 18 MAR

2:07:00 Yitayal ATNAFU ETH 4 Paris 08 APR

2:07:03 Mark KORIR KEN 2 Seoul 18 MAR

2:07:03 Sisay LEMMA ETH 2 Prague 06 MAY

2:07:07 Abel KIRUI KEN 4 London 22 APR

2:07:09 Alex KIBET KEN 3 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:07:11 Benson KIPRUTO KEN 3 Seoul 18 MAR

2:07:19 Ayele ABSHERO ETH 3 Hamburg 29 APR

2:07:20 Hillary KIPSAMBU KEN 9 Amsterdam 21 OCT

2:07:22 Marius KIPSEREM KEN 5 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:07:24 Benson KIPRUTO KEN 1 Toronto 21 OCT

2:07:25 Abrha MILAW ASEFA ETH 1 Cannes 04 NOV

2:07:27 Yuma HATTORI JPN 1 Fukuoka 02 DEC

2:07:28 Amos Kiplimo MITEI KEN 4 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:07:30 Feyisa LILESE ETH 6 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:07:32 Elisha KIPCHIRCHIR KEN 1 Eindhoven 14 OCT

2:07:33 Deribe ROBI ETH 9 Valencia 02 DEC

2:07:34 Limenih GETACHEW ETH 1 Lisboa 14 OCT

2:07:34 Kenneth KETER KEN 5 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:07:37 Solomon YEGO KEN 4 Hamburg 29 APR

2:07:37 Benson SEUREI BRN 10 Valencia 02 DEC

2:07:38 Laban MUTAI KEN 2 Eindhoven 14 OCT

2:07:45 Marius KIMUTAI KEN 4 Seoul 18 MAR

2:07:46 Augustino Paulo SULLE TAN 2 Toronto 21 OCT

2:07:50 Elisha ROTICH KEN 4 Daegu 01 APR

2:07:50 Mark KIPTOO KEN 6 Frankfurt 28 OCT

2:07:50 Vincent RONO KEN 3 Eindhoven 14 OCT

2:07:51 Samuel NDUNGU KEN 2 Lisboa 14 OCT

2:07:52 Abel KIRUI KEN 7 Chicago 07 OCT

2:07:53 Macharia NDIRANGU KEN 1 Otsu 04 MAR

2:07:57 Felix KIPROTICH KEN 5 Seoul 18 MAR

2:07:57 Stephen KIPROTICH UGA 5 Hamburg 29 APR

2:07:57 Taku FUJIMOTO JPN 8 Chicago 07 OCT

2:07:58 Justus KIPKOSGEI KEN 3 Lisboa 14 OCT

2:07:59 Bedan KAROKI KEN 9 Chicago 07 OCT

2:08:03 Jarius BIRECH KEN 1 Roma 08 APR

2:08:08 Ryo KINEME JPN 7 Tokyo 25 FEB

2:08:08 Anthony MARITIM KEN 1 Barcelona 11 MAR

2:08:11 Raymond CHOGE KEN 1 Kosice 07 OCT

2:08:13 Mule WASIHUN ETH 6 Rotterdam 08 APR

2:08:15 Aychew DESSIE ETH 2 Kosice 07 OCT

2:08:16 Shogo NAKAMURA JPN 4 Berlin 16 SEP

don't kenyans run by kilometers?

Did he mention Jim Walmsley going to Boston next year to run with them?