Breaking: Adam Goucher says he thinks a resolution to the Salazar/NOP doping investigation is "coming very, very soon"

L Carnitine is NOT a banned substance.

The way I predict that the NOP fall apart is if members of the NOP have a big falling out and relationship issues and literally let the cat out of the bag. Take Kelejcha and Hassan. Saladbar's new star pupils. I predict a big relationship between these will blossom. It will go sour but not sure the exact reason. Maybe Kelejcha will cheat with Klosterhalfen Konstance. They will fight and someone is going to literally spill beans because I'm sure they will be well aware of eachother's exact doping regime.

+1

timing is everything wrote:

Depends on the timing. Bans, and annulling of results, start with the offense. See Ramzi vs. Kiprop, or of course Armstrong.

The injection stuff was documented to have been early 2012; depending on the punishment, that could cost Rupp his silver.

Early 2016, he was caught as likely doper by the IAAF (blood doping). If USADA found evidence (doubtful), that would surely cost him his bronze medal.

Come on, IOC doesn't care. wrote:

I'm not saying they are guilty or not. I don't know. No idea.

But taking away medals for convicted dopers? Kiprop still has his and Kornelia Ender still has her medals too.

No one seems to understand the IAAF ‘likely doping’ thing. Ignorance. ?

L-Carnitine is not and never has been banned, regardless of amount. Using prescription drugs off label is not a doping violation. WADA has never had a "no needles" rule, although cycling does.

Portland Hobby Jogger wrote:

The investigation will find minor violations of the "no needles" rule on the L-Carn drips and suspicions that prescription drugs may have been used in an off-label manner. As another poster stated, six month "wrist slaps" handed out or no punishment if current NOP athletes confess. Salazar accepts his six month "ban", admits no wrong doing (L-Carn is NOT doping and I trusted the various doctors who should have known better!) and announces his retirement (was coming soon anyway) in the same press release.

.

there's more to it wrote:

Portland Hobby Jogger wrote:

Meanwhile, micro dosing of EPO , CERA, and stuff we don't know about yet continues around the world unabated.

Yes, but...

a team, that does not shy away from risking multiple four year bans for l-carnitine, is likely to use EPO and testo as well.

Both Rupp and Farah have been labeled likely (EPO) dopers by the IAAF, worse than Kiprop, not as suspicious as Jager.

So what did Evan Jager do? Get dehydrated enough for his hemoconcentration to rise 20% or whatever? And that gets him on the suspicious list does it?

Banana Bread wrote:

The way I predict that the NOP fall apart is if members of the NOP have a big falling out and relationship issues and literally let the cat out of the bag. Take Kelejcha and Hassan. Saladbar's new star pupils. I predict a big relationship between these will blossom. It will go sour but not sure the exact reason. Maybe Kelejcha will cheat with Klosterhalfen Konstance. They will fight and someone is going to literally spill beans because I'm sure they will be well aware of eachother's exact doping regime.

+1

LetsRun.com wrote:

We published our full Q&A with Goucher this morning. In it, he says he thinks a resolution to the USADA doping investigation of Alberto Salazar and the NOP is coming soon.

Goucher said:

It’s just one of those things. It’s frustrating that you’re fighting for so long and there’s still no resolution — or at least not 100% resolution at this point. I think it’s coming very, very soon, but until there is that ultimate resolution, you’re just kind of waiting. And that in itself is a drain. It’s a drag, it’s frustrating.

Full interview here:

http://www.letsrun.com/news/2018/11/qa-adam-goucher-talks-running-buffaloes-greatest-running-memories-stress-becoming-whistleblower-alberto-salazar-nop/

I think he's delusional, has taken on his wife's "holier than thou" and "poor me, I'm being persecuted" characteristics it would appear. I have no idea what went on between Saladbar and the Gouchers, but it seems like they have an ax to grind. Regardless of the outcome, if there is in fact any (one has to wonder after 4 years), they will likely not be satisfied with it.

Jager didn't just land on the suspicious list, he landed on the likely doping list, marked as the most likely doper, plus the most follow-up tests, which he seems to have all passed. Considering that you don't get marked if Hct raises by less than 15%, he as the worst offender was probably above +20%.

transparency about what exactly? wrote:

So what did Evan Jager do? Get dehydrated enough for his hemoconcentration to rise 20% or whatever? And that gets him on the suspicious list does it?

Somebody from SMTC downplaying doping...who would ever have thought it?

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

I think he's delusional, has taken on his wife's "holier than thou" and "poor me, I'm being persecuted" characteristics it would appear. I have no idea what went on between Saladbar and the Gouchers, but it seems like they have an ax to grind. Regardless of the outcome, if there is in fact any (one has to wonder after 4 years), they will likely not be satisfied with it.

hilarious 5 star rating wrote:

Jager didn't just land on the suspicious list, he landed on the likely doping list, marked as the most likely doper, plus the most follow-up tests, which he seems to have all passed.

Considering that you don't get marked if Hct raises by less than 15%, he as the worst offender was probably above +20%.

transparency about what exactly? wrote:

So what did Evan Jager do? Get dehydrated enough for his hemoconcentration to rise 20% or whatever? And that gets him on the suspicious list does it?

So are you saying that hemoconcentration and dehydration are not connected?

You do know that hematocrit and hemoconcentration are essentially the same thing don't you and that dehydration increases those measurements?

Just want to clarify here because the IAAF seem pretty clueless about this.

Salazar absolutely shared and/or told others to share prescription drugs with people for whom the drugs were not prescribed. That is wrong to do. There is no gray area there. A coach is not supposed to do that.

Whether he can be legally prosecuted for it or not is a gray area, because you get into the nitty gritty of whether he actually made the exchanges himself (if so, when and how and with what proof) or just recommended the exchanges that were then made among the athletes themselves. It's still a coaching violation, though, as he is at a minimum asking athletes to do something illegal.

With L-Carnitine you are going to have a hard time proving anything, though we know somebody is obviously lying. Dr. Brown's papers and Ritz's papers don't match. Somebody forged something. The reasonable conclusion is that Salazar/Brown were responsible for an illegally high dosage. You're going to have a hard time proving it, though.

Then with testosterone we might know Salazar had it in his possession and also asked subordinates to research the fine line between what triggers a positive, but you would have a difficult time proving anything illegal.

People like to get bogged down in the nitty gritty difficult to prove a legal case with these last few bullets. They forget that we plainly know he was having people share prescriptions. That's wrong. You cannot make the claim that he might have been staying within the rules. We know he was not. We just have a hard time proving how deep he dove into breaking the rules.

That is beside the point, because:

a) You don't get dehydrated by 20% as a 3000 m runner in training.

b) You don't get tested while dehydrated (since 2009).

and

c) Jager blamed altitude, not dehydration, but altitude is considered in the ABP.

what's the secret they are keeping? wrote:

OLD SMTC SOB wrote:

I have no idea what went on between Saladbar and the Gouchers, but it seems like they have an ax to grind.

Something happened that they aren't telling us. Did Alberto and Kara have an affair?

this has been my idea ever since the leaked emails al sal dropped right when kara said she was about to spill beans.

he released super cut and paste sections of their emails to each other, and they all sounded like affair style.

kara told him how much she loved him and thankful for him etc...

after al sal dropped those parts of their emails kara was silent for months, and when she did talk again she always cried.

but every time i mention this angle, it gets DELETED.

if LRers and the brojos would actually look at it is if its some sort of crime show on tv it all looks plausible.

-al sal running a doping program

-al sal does guinea pig PEDs on his own son, and adam goucher, he also makes adam a guinea pig for workouts...better test them first before making ruppy poop do them

-al sal ends up having an affair with kara, maybe colt is or isnt adams....adam gets suspicious and demands their time together comes to an end

-al sal tells adam to go f*ck off, if kara leaves they are both kicked from NOP and Nike, kara is pissed. drama continues

-al sal cuts ties to his now level 5 clinger, kara is heartbroken

-everyone at NOP was doping but signed agreements to stay mum about it or else...kara wants to fight back

-al sal says he will spill beans on the affair and ruin her reputation

-kara knows the only way to expose al sal is to admit she doped too, and that al sal will burn her down as well with releasing of juicing emails, maybe pics etc

-adam knows the only way to expose al sal is also to admit he was doping, but kara tells him he cant or else al sal will expose dirt on them, i dont think adam truly knows the extent of the affair...

truth is always way more intricate and f*cked up than it seems. wait till colt is older and then see if he looks like al sal...

I was literally thinking of emailing Tarantino to see if he would do a movie about the NOP and all the nasty stuff in it. It would be amazing. Other movie ideas I have would be a thriller about Samuel Wanjiru's death and the coverup behind it.

hilarious 5 star rating wrote:

That is beside the point, because:

a) You don't get dehydrated by 20% as a 3000 m runner in training.

b) You don't get tested while dehydrated (since 2009).

and

c) Jager blamed altitude, not dehydration, but altitude is considered in the ABP.

a) You have no idea what you are talking about. Hematocrit can be 40 during mid week and rise during taper because of less volume of training. Rising more after a race because you sweat after the race, especially if c) you are racing at altitude where hematocrit rises dramatically because of the low humidity.

The IAAF don't seem to know any of these things and neither do you.

This may be morally or ethically wrong. It might (possibly) be a violation of U.S. law, although one that it is difficult to find anybody ever being prosecuted for. However, it is 100% not a violation of the anti-doping rules.

Shoebacca wrote:

Salazar absolutely shared and/or told others to share prescription drugs with people for whom the drugs were not prescribed. That is wrong to do. There is no gray area there. A coach is not supposed to do that.

People like to get bogged down in the nitty gritty difficult to prove a legal case with these last few bullets. They forget that we plainly know he was having people share prescriptions. That's wrong. You cannot make the claim that he might have been staying within the rules. We know he was not. We just have a hard time proving how deep he dove into breaking the rules.

The sport of Track & Field has never had an investigation that interviewed the number of people as in athletes, doctors, trainers , massage therapists , lab techs, shoe company staff, athlete managers etc. etc.

Four years plus of investigations, carefully timed leaks to get positive public sentiment, public appeal for more information.

Over even figures plus spent.

Not a single athlete has tested positive for illegal drug use, no coach has been tied to prosecutable evidence of administering illegal drugs. 4 years of investigation.

Athletes , writers , web sites, bloggers use the investigation as a platform to rant, accuse, blame and make baseless noise without a shred of backup evidence outside of creative assumption, hearsay, and speculation. 4 years of investigation, zero evidence of wrong doing.

I challenge all to provide credible prosecutable evidence if you have it so we may really close the investigation and move on.

"You’ve now got the body to take the pounding better than ever before and your engine is bigger than ever!"

yeah it's all in this quote.