It's actually affirmative action for tall people. Someone should run those numbers.
It's actually affirmative action for tall people. Someone should run those numbers.
Not a mathematician wrote:
John Utah wrote:
Let me get this straight. 61% of the athletes are white in the Ivy.
General population of the USA is in the ballpark of 72% white.
I'm not a mathematician, so what am I missing?
People who apply to college are not distributed evenly across the age groups. So looking at the "general population" as a benchmark does not make sense. You need to look at 18-20 (or whatever) age group, which is significantly less white.
Ok, then show me the rough numbers that somehow indicate that whites are over-represented in this regard.
TrackFan19 wrote:
John Utah wrote:
Let me get this straight. 61% of the athletes are white in the Ivy.
General population of the USA is in the ballpark of 72% white.
I'm not a mathematician, so what am I missing?
(This is to say nothing about D1 basketball and football.)
Non-Hispanic whites are about 64% of the U.S. population and getting smaller every day.
So are you saying that whites are under-represented in ivy athletics (61%) vs. your adjusted general pop figure of 64%?
I would say that all athletes (blacks and whites together) get some level of "special treatment" in admissions (by design....one can argue good or bad). The numbers in ivy seem to correlate with gen pop demographics. I still don't understand the "disproportionate" claim / conclusion. If 61% of ivy athletics are white and 74% or 64% (depending on white definition) of gen pop is white then how his this disproportionate?
And yes, I'm in favor of limiting college athletics. It's totally out of control in the major sports. Tail wagging the dog. My solution would be to, coincidentally, take the ivy league approach or D3 approach with no scholarships and even no special admissions. Student athletes, period. Alabama football (and many others) is an absolute joke (even though I love watching college football). A school attached to a professional football team / subsidized minor league feeder system training & vetting program for the NFL
Xerox'ed wrote:
The following 10 college rodeo teams are the biggest and best in the sport and represent the top choices for many cowboys and cowgirls each year.
1. Walla Walla Community College Walla Walla, WA
2. Tarleton State University Stephenville, TX
3. University of Nevada-Las Vegas Las Vegas, NV
4. California Polytechnic State University san Luis Obispo, CA
5. Central Wyoming College Riverton, WY
6. New Mexico State University Las Cruces, NM
7. Weber State University Ogden, UT
8 Sam Houston State University Huntsville, TX
9 Mesalands Community College Tucumcari, NM
10 College of Southern Idaho Twin Falls, ID
Anyway, bass fishing is a better scholarship IMO.
There’s a good amount of community colleges in Texas that have rodeo too. But that’s more fun to watch than sailing.
John Utah wrote:
Not a mathematician wrote:
People who apply to college are not distributed evenly across the age groups. So looking at the "general population" as a benchmark does not make sense. You need to look at 18-20 (or whatever) age group, which is significantly less white.
Ok, then show me the rough numbers that somehow indicate that whites are over-represented in this regard.
About 54% of 18 yr olds in the US are white. And this ratio goes down further as you move down the age.
That's interesting, according to census it's more like 2/3. Unless by some statistical anomaly 18 year olds are completely out of line with these 5 year age groupings.
10-14 / 66%
15-19 / 66%
20-24 / 67%
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_United_States
the430miler wrote:
Well here in the republic of texxxas we have rodeo as a college sport. No other place in the west has that
You gomers down south also got intercollegiate bass fishin', cheerleading and bar-bee-cuein'.
Youins should add rattle snake huntin.
Less than 50% of Ivy students are white. They get a bit of an admissions boost in athletics. There are no athletic scholarships at the ivies so none of this really matters.
Because the Ivy population is not representative of general population. East and South Asians are present in much higher percentages at Ivies because they are smarter and work harder. If you eliminated legacies, fake sports and affirmative action, Asians would make at least 50% of the students at Ivies. More whites are only there due to athletics than Asians.
However I guess You could that also argue the Asians have an advantage because they’re genetically gifted and come from supportive families that demand academic perfection. Unlike their white counterparts with ‘Hockey dads’ and divorced parents.
Not a mathematician wrote:
John Utah wrote:
Ok, then show me the rough numbers that somehow indicate that whites are over-represented in this regard.
About 54% of 18 yr olds in the US are white. And this ratio goes down further as you move down the age.
I'll just assume you're done with the conversation now that your narrative has been dismantled. Go back to looking for other ways whitey is holding back all people of color.
Wolf's Bane wrote:
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2018/10/college-sports-benefits-white-students/573688/?utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=the-atlantic-fb-test-500-3-&utm_content=edit-promo&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR39Ovb4UM-p5s8Lt2zFB24XwKeieNp7_5Cj_HWkw3S_TMyJyIzyH0ibT_IIt points to lacrosse, sailing, hockey. In some conferences, athletes are as high as 79% white.
This is probably the dumbest thing I'll see today. They are predominantly white because, A. That's the majority of our population. B. The people who grow up with the opportunity to play those sports are white. And C. Most people of color follow in the footsteps of other people like them, and opt for sports such as running and basketball.
So yeah. It's a nonsensical argument that falls apart very quickly.
The other way to look at it is this makes it almost impossible for a non athlete, white male to get into these schools. All of the white male slots are taken up by athletes.
+1
I think most are missing the point of this article.
The student body at Ivies is not representative of the general population. There are many more Asians because they are high-achievers (would be even more if admissions were fair). There are also less whites than the general population due to affirmative action for 'underrepresented minorities' (non-Asians) and spots taken by Asians.
Sports such as rowing, sailing, golf, etc and legacies are essentially affirmative action for white males. Is that fair? No less fair than a wealthy African American/Latino getting into Harvard because of their ethnicity.
The students getting shafted here are non-athlete high-achieving Asians and Whites. If you are an Asian or white male with a perfect SAT score, all-state orchestra, valedictorian, blah blah, you're a dime a dozen in Harvard's application pool and will be rated lower on your 'personality' when you are interviewed. Unless you are going to play a sport or have something truly unique about you, good luck and have fun at Swarthmore/StateU/etc
It's debatable how desirable it is to go to Harvard or Yale. So all of this may be a moot point.
Also, since so many are saying that the demographics of the student body at ivy schools are not representative of the gen pop, then it appears whites are under-represented at ivy schools relative to the gen pop and therefore should receive some form of affirmative action.
The flip side wrote:
The other way to look at it is this makes it almost impossible for a non athlete, white male to get into these schools. All of the white male slots are taken up by athletes.
wahhhh wahhhh
I agree with your first statement. In my opinion state school or a cheaper small school is a much better investment for most students.
Whites are underrepresented primarily because of the Asians of similar demographics out-achieving them.
In fact, there would be even more Asians and less Whites (and all other groups) at Ivies if admissions were 'fair'
So, in effect Whites are already receiving affirmative action at Ivies relative to Asians.
If you take students of different ethnic groups with the same academic credentials, here is how Harvard will see them:
Native Americans>'underrepresented minorities' (Black, maybe some Hispanic)>White>Asian
Here's proof:
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/10/19/acceptance-rates-by-race/
Not saying this is unfair or should be changed, it's just the way it is.
the430miler wrote:
Well here in the republic of texxxas we have rodeo as a college sport. No other place in the west has that
I believe you are correct and that nowhere in the West has rodeo as a college sport. I live in the west and don't know of any.
It's interesting that in the south it is a sport, I didn't know that.
the430miler wrote:
Well here in the republic of texxxas we have rodeo as a college sport. No other place in the west has that
Except Oklahoma.