Mo and Galen train at 5:30 pace. That is the red line. If you can run faster than at in a marathon, you're a runner. Elite not so much but anything slower than that, we're all just joggers of sorts.
Mo and Galen train at 5:30 pace. That is the red line. If you can run faster than at in a marathon, you're a runner. Elite not so much but anything slower than that, we're all just joggers of sorts.
T-MAC100 wrote:
Chaffee County wrote:
Marathon Tiers:
A. Eliud Kipchoge: Undisputed marathon GOAT
B. 2:03-2:06:xx. World class thoroughbreds. Can win major marathons Kipchoge does not enter. Those who do not obnoxiously or carelessly dope can vie for Olympic hardware.
C. 2:07-2:10. World class workhorses. Can snag podium spots and even wins in major races if things get weird for some reason. See Yuki Kawuchi and Meb Keflezeghi.
D. 2:10- 2:15- National elites (outside of east Africa) good enough to make a living off just running. Podium potential at mid major events.
Can finish well but probably not podium in world events on the right day. See Jared Ward.
E. 2:15-2:20 Semi-pro. Can win small races, and maybe, maybe snag a national kit in an off event/ year. See US oly marathon trial qualifying list.
F. 2:20-2:30- Twilight zone runners. Have some talent, almost certainly run a lot of miles but don't get paid much and have virtually no chance of competing at the world or even national level. See your high volume, moderately talented college xc teammate.
G. 2:30- 2:45- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. These runners do it right, do it consistently, and do it in the quiet comfort between the lead pack and the bumbling hordes. See Frank, the quiet guy from Accounting.
H. 2:45- 3:00- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier II. Still respectable, but not quite as dependable as dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. Prone to crooked splits and But hey, they qualified for Boston so there- See
I. 3:00- 3:15- Twilight zone II- They trained (some), they didn't walk (much), and they finished (eventually) but they still didn't qualify for Boston, start in the A corral or beat the top masters woman. See your college xc teammate who didn't train at all.
J. 3:15-4:00 - Bucket listers. At 9 minutes a mile, they ran a marathon. See your Facebook need feed.
K. 4:00 and up. Finishers. Good for them. I mean it. See people walking down the street.
Group A and Group G are genuinely happy to be where they are. Groups E, F, and I are chronically unsatisfied, UNLESS they jump up a level. Groups B, C, D,and J focus on their social media accounts. Group H has chronic identity issues.
Thanks for this. I've been thinking about this lately and feel like you pretty much nailed it.
These descriptions seem pretty accurate to me, but it seems the letsrun definition of elite is anything faster than Rupp or Farah run
Sub 2:30 is elite talent.
Everyone else is TRYING. I'm laughing at all the 2:40-2:59 guys here getting all butt hurt because they are not in the same class as the sponsored athletes, meanwhile insulting the runners in the 3:00-3:30 range. LR can be so lame.
Didn't Nick Symmonds run something like 3:03 untrained? I'm sure a lot of the 2:50 guys would have a great time trying to keep up with him in the half mile.
I've learned that "elite" is completely subjective. "Professional" is not.
ohia wrote:
Mens:
3hr + - hobby jogger
2:50-3:00 - runner
2:40-2:50 - serious runner
2:30-2:40 - sub elite
2:00-2:30 - elite
Your 2:29:59 Marathon has you equal to 4:35 mile. Not yet elite.
Chaffee County wrote:
Louis CK wrote:
Nike is full of crap. Here's the harsh reality: If you were not in the American Development/Elite Corral in the Chicago Marathon (Sub 2:31 for men) then you are just a person who runs and with or for varying degrees of personal successful.
Guys running under 2:10 will not see the difference between you (a 2:59 marathon runner) and a 3:30 runner.
It's like the guy who wins a local 5K in 16 minutes. Do you think he really cares about Denise who ran 28:30 or Tammy who ran 30:23 that day? There is virtually no difference between non-elite competitors.
Marathon Tiers:
A. Eliud Kipchoge: Undisputed marathon GOAT
B. 2:03-2:06:xx. World class thoroughbreds. Can win major marathons Kipchoge does not enter. Those who do not obnoxiously or carelessly dope can vie for Olympic hardware.
C. 2:07-2:10. World class workhorses. Can snag podium spots and even wins in major races if things get weird for some reason. See Yuki Kawuchi and Meb Keflezeghi.
D. 2:10- 2:15- National elites (outside of east Africa) good enough to make a living off just running. Podium potential at mid major events.
Can finish well but probably not podium in world events on the right day. See Jared Ward.
E. 2:15-2:20 Semi-pro. Can win small races, and maybe, maybe snag a national kit in an off event/ year. See US oly marathon trial qualifying list.
F. 2:20-2:30- Twilight zone runners. Have some talent, almost certainly run a lot of miles but don't get paid much and have virtually no chance of competing at the world or even national level. See your high volume, moderately talented college xc teammate.
G. 2:30- 2:45- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. These runners do it right, do it consistently, and do it in the quiet comfort between the lead pack and the bumbling hordes. See Frank, the quiet guy from Accounting.
H. 2:45- 3:00- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier II. Still respectable, but not quite as dependable as dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. Prone to crooked splits and But hey, they qualified for Boston so there- See
I. 3:00- 3:15- Twilight zone II- They trained (some), they didn't walk (much), and they finished (eventually) but they still didn't qualify for Boston, start in the A corral or beat the top masters woman. See your college xc teammate who didn't train at all.
J. 3:15-4:00 - Bucket listers. At 9 minutes a mile, they ran a marathon. See your Facebook need feed.
K. 4:00 and up. Finishers. Good for them. I mean it. See people walking down the street.
Group A and Group G are genuinely happy to be where they are. Groups E, F, and I are chronically unsatisfied, UNLESS they jump up a level. Groups B, C, D,and J focus on their social media accounts. Group H has chronic identity issues.
This is the most accurate running related post I've seen in years on here. Have a well-deserved +1.
Haha nooooooooo
Chaffee County wrote:
Louis CK wrote:
Nike is full of crap. Here's the harsh reality: If you were not in the American Development/Elite Corral in the Chicago Marathon (Sub 2:31 for men) then you are just a person who runs and with or for varying degrees of personal successful.
Guys running under 2:10 will not see the difference between you (a 2:59 marathon runner) and a 3:30 runner.
It's like the guy who wins a local 5K in 16 minutes. Do you think he really cares about Denise who ran 28:30 or Tammy who ran 30:23 that day? There is virtually no difference between non-elite competitors.
Marathon Tiers:
A. Eliud Kipchoge: Undisputed marathon GOAT
B. 2:03-2:06:xx. World class thoroughbreds. Can win major marathons Kipchoge does not enter. Those who do not obnoxiously or carelessly dope can vie for Olympic hardware.
C. 2:07-2:10. World class workhorses. Can snag podium spots and even wins in major races if things get weird for some reason. See Yuki Kawuchi and Meb Keflezeghi.
D. 2:10- 2:15- National elites (outside of east Africa) good enough to make a living off just running. Podium potential at mid major events.
Can finish well but probably not podium in world events on the right day. See Jared Ward.
E. 2:15-2:20 Semi-pro. Can win small races, and maybe, maybe snag a national kit in an off event/ year. See US oly marathon trial qualifying list.
F. 2:20-2:30- Twilight zone runners. Have some talent, almost certainly run a lot of miles but don't get paid much and have virtually no chance of competing at the world or even national level. See your high volume, moderately talented college xc teammate.
G. 2:30- 2:45- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. These runners do it right, do it consistently, and do it in the quiet comfort between the lead pack and the bumbling hordes. See Frank, the quiet guy from Accounting.
H. 2:45- 3:00- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier II. Still respectable, but not quite as dependable as dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. Prone to crooked splits and But hey, they qualified for Boston so there- See
I. 3:00- 3:15- Twilight zone II- They trained (some), they didn't walk (much), and they finished (eventually) but they still didn't qualify for Boston, start in the A corral or beat the top masters woman. See your college xc teammate who didn't train at all.
J. 3:15-4:00 - Bucket listers. At 9 minutes a mile, they ran a marathon. See your Facebook need feed.
K. 4:00 and up. Finishers. Good for them. I mean it. See people walking down the street.
Group A and Group G are genuinely happy to be where they are. Groups E, F, and I are chronically unsatisfied, UNLESS they jump up a level. Groups B, C, D,and J focus on their social media accounts. Group H has chronic identity issues.
+1. What are the female time equivalents to the above categories?
I assume most or nearly all of you are posting in US. Our view is skewed by our latitude and longitude. Many on this thread are basing their definition of elite by skewed percentages. Even those stating sub-2:20 Marathon are too generous with the word elite. A 2:19:59 Marathon is equal to about a 49.5 400 metres. As many or some of you know, historically US men have been the best 400m/440yd sprinters in the world going back decades and even further back. 49.5 400m may earn a young man a partial grant at a NCAA D2 university. Elite must be a word which implies elite worldwide. Elite Marathon, sub-2:12:30. Nike wants many to believe they're elite so many buy elite-type running gear.
txRUNNERgirl wrote:
I've learned that "elite" is completely subjective. "Professional" is not.
Just like Jumbo Shrimp, Elite has no legal definition in the USA. One pundants/salesmans Elite and Jumbo is anothers Sub-Elite and Large .
Junksies wrote:
Nike says a sub3hr marathon is a “sign of an elite runner..” in their Nike 4% article. Do you agree? I think it’s a sign of a serious runner or a runner with a good training history who knows the sport but not an elite. I’ve run in the 240s myself but I get my butt kicked by subelite girls all the time as well as tons of people just more talented than me so I can’t be elite
The marathon for non professionals is a human journey to hide from all your personal life problems. The problem is , when you finish your run , all your problem are there waiting for you.
Nike tries to appeal to the masses. In terms of the average person that goes to the gym a few times a week and run 3 miles at a time, a sub 3 hour marathoner is an athlete runner. Even if there are many runners better than them, if you are running 6 minute miles in some random park, you will undoubtedly be faster than everyone around you 99% of the time.
Take Zwift races for example. The races are broken up into different categories based on abilities. The highest category in cycling races include VERY strong riders and even professionals at times. Though running on Zwift is newer to the platform, the fastest category on Zwift running is considered someone who runs 6:40 pace or faster lol. All the group runs on there have people running 9 min miles for the most part. Lets face it, the average person runs slow.
Here is the definition of elite It dies not say superior to list but superior to the rest. Sub 3 dies not qualify when hundreds ore beating you in a race.
It's actually overacted when someone running outside 6 minute miles for 5 km can do it.
It is however a respectable time and usually shows a level if hard training and commitment.
A runner outside a club went from a bit if jogging to doing 80mpw to go sub 3. He actually manage it on back to back weekends
Nope wrote:
Sub 2:30 is elite talent.
Everyone else is TRYING. I'm laughing at all the 2:40-2:59 guys here getting all butt hurt because they are not in the same class as the sponsored athletes, meanwhile insulting the runners in the 3:00-3:30 range. LR can be so lame.
Didn't Nick Symmonds run something like 3:03 untrained? I'm sure a lot of the 2:50 guys would have a great time trying to keep up with him in the half mile.
Spot the guy who ran 2:29!
Sub 2:20 is elite
Louis CK wrote:
Marathon Tiers:
A. Eliud Kipchoge: Undisputed marathon GOAT
B. 2:03-2:06:xx. World class thoroughbreds. Can win major marathons Kipchoge does not enter. Those who do not obnoxiously or carelessly dope can vie for Olympic hardware.
C. 2:07-2:10. World class workhorses. Can snag podium spots and even wins in major races if things get weird for some reason. See Yuki Kawuchi and Meb Keflezeghi.
D. 2:10- 2:15- National elites (outside of east Africa) good enough to make a living off just running. Podium potential at mid major events.
Can finish well but probably not podium in world events on the right day. See Jared Ward.
E. 2:15-2:20 Semi-pro. Can win small races, and maybe, maybe snag a national kit in an off event/ year. See US oly marathon trial qualifying list.
F. 2:20-2:30- Twilight zone runners. Have some talent, almost certainly run a lot of miles but don't get paid much and have virtually no chance of competing at the world or even national level. See your high volume, moderately talented college xc teammate.
G. 2:30- 2:45- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. These runners do it right, do it consistently, and do it in the quiet comfort between the lead pack and the bumbling hordes. See Frank, the quiet guy from Accounting.
H. 2:45- 3:00- Dedicated enthusiasts Tier II. Still respectable, but not quite as dependable as dedicated enthusiasts Tier I. Prone to crooked splits and But hey, they qualified for Boston so there- See
I. 3:00- 3:15- Twilight zone II- They trained (some), they didn't walk (much), and they finished (eventually) but they still didn't qualify for Boston, start in the A corral or beat the top masters woman. See your college xc teammate who didn't train at all.
J. 3:15-4:00 - Bucket listers. At 9 minutes a mile, they ran a marathon. See your Facebook need feed.
K. 4:00 and up. Finishers. Good for them. I mean it. See people walking down the street.
Group A and Group G are genuinely happy to be where they are. Groups E, F, and I are chronically unsatisfied, UNLESS they jump up a level. Groups B, C, D,and J focus on their social media accounts. Group H has chronic identity issues.
Only one problem you didn't mention which group was elite.
Plus s guy running 2:50 could be doing everything right but just not have the talent of a 2:30 guy.
To me elite it spends which country you and the runner you are judging come from.
A UK or American runner doing sub 2:10 is elite. Are you really impressed by a Kenyan doing the same.
My HS coach ran sub 3 hours when he was 14 years old. My Mom ran sub 3 hours while working full time and raising 3 of us kids. The joggers society has moved the bar on what is considered good.
It would be great if you could make a 5000m/10000m edition of this.
Btw, where's Dennis Kimetto standing at?
Jakob Ingebrigtsen has a 1989 Ferrari 348 GTB and he's just put in paperwork to upgrade it
Strava thinks the London Marathon times improved 12 minutes last year thanks to supershoes
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
NAU women have no excuse - they should win it all at 2024 NCAA XC
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?