Road Racing and Training Thread (Chicago Edition) - Week Ending 10/7/18

Male 50 5'8" 133lbs

PRs

Marathon 3:02:58 May 2018

10mi. 1:06:45 March 2018

5k 19:00 June 2018

Goal Sub 3 Marathon, CIM Dec. 2

Mon. AM Bike commute 12.7mi, PM Bike commute 15mi.

Tues. 4mi. Easy Treadmill, False start. Soleus not feeling good. Back to cycling

Wed. AM Bike commute 12.7mi, PM Bike commute 15mi.

Thurs. AM Bike commute 12.7mi, PM Bike commute 15mi.

Fri. ~7.7mi Easy + 1mi tempo on treadmill

Sat. 16mi. Easy w/ 2mi Tempo @ mi 11&12

Sun. 5mi. Recovery No core work today got busy early and lazy later.

Total 30.9mi running + 83mi. Bike

Last weeks injury carried over into this week but the week did end on a positive note. The positive part is that I knocked out a long run with a 2mi tempo added in for good measure and things held together. Actually my soleus felt better than it has in months during this run. I maintained a good aerobic load through cycling during the time that I could not run. I think this may have helped with the recovery due to increased blood flow without stressing my soleus. On the other hand my quads are feeling a bit rough at the moment between the cycling and the long run.

I’ll post my week for fun. May not do it every week but Smoove inspired me to come back.

Stone- Hope you’ve been doing well! It’s been awhile.

First quality week of the cycle. Just been doing mileage prior. CIM is the goal.

M- AM 12 miles at 6:55 / PM 4 miles at 7:10.

T- AM 12 miles at 6:51 / PM 4 miles at 7:05.

W- AM 14 miles. 8 x 800m at 2:30 avg. 400m rest. Coach wouldn’t let us go faster. I was itching to go faster / PM 4 miles at 6:58.

T- AM 19 miles at 7:05 pace. Got lost on the run. Still learning the area. Supposed to be 12/4 double.

F- AM 12 miles at 6:55.

S- AM 13 miles at 6:52 / PM 4 miles at 6:59.

S- AM 22 mile long run at 5:43 avg. Dropped it down into the 5:30s and just held steady. Felt great.

Total- 120 miles

Can’t wait until workouts start picking up. Mileage will increase a touch but it’s all about quality sessions from here.

RF - Wow, what a week, and welcome back. Nice to meet you.

Hi All,

Great stuff by the Chicago guys, Smoove especially for that courageous run. Performances like that are more inspirational to me than anything the elites do!

An all right week for me. Two solid workouts in warm conditions, but fairly low on the volume side. I'm feeling decent about my next race, another 8k XC club meet on 10/20. That will be held on a fast course, which should result in some improvement from the 27:38 slightly short 8k I ran last week by virtue of the course alone (and hopefully cooler conditions). I'm secretly hoping to approach 27 minutes, but we'll see what I have on the day.

M: 0

T: 7.5: including 6x1000 on grass field. Averaged 5:23/mile pace with 90 second jogging rest. Didn't strain too much at any point.

W: 7.5 @ 7:05

R: 6

F: 8: including my club's take on the famous" Michigan" workout. 1600, 1200, 800, 400, 400 with 1k "tempo" rest in between intervals. In reality there was a minute or two jog before the tempos, which weren't truly threshold running. Total average of 6:04 pace including those slow jogs. The 1600 was around 5:20, and I would estimate that I was around that pace for the 1200 and 800 as well, going faster on the 400s.

S: 6, slow

Su: 8, mountainous. Accidentally took a wrong turn and ended up on a far more technical trail than I intended. Was fun, but I had to take a few breathers from climbing, and cut what I hoped would be a 10-12 miler short. Averaged 7:35 in all, with the climbing portions well above 8:00 pace.

Total: 43 miles

M38 6-6 186 lbs. Chicago. Goal: sub 2:40 or bust. Result: 2:40:32

Report:

Weather was fair. ~60F with dewpoint around 55F. Rain off and on. 10 mph winds from the North. A little slick at times. Not perfect conditions for a big guy like me but a lot better than my summer at redneck altitude.

The race: Went out in 6:20 and 6:10 for first two miles as planned then locked on 6:05 thru halfway. Had some good guys to work with and fight the wind as we headed north. Hit the halfway mark in 1:19:57. Me and the guy next to me congratulated one another on a beautiful split. Split the dang uprights.

After the celebration it was time to go to work. Next several miles were all around 6:00. At some point around mile 15 while I’m cranking a sub 6 a spectator yells “Good job. Slow and steady.” 6 min pace is slow? WTF. I guess the giraffe makes it look easy. I’ll take it as a compliment.

Around mile 20 or so the inevitable fade began and 6:00s gave way to 6:05s and 6:10s and 6:15s. Legs heavy. Right calf tweaking. Simple math difficult. Welcome to the Pain zone. Rolling up Alexi Pappas around mile 22 was a highlight. I kept fighting because I knew 2:39:xx would be close and a PR was in the bag. I needed 6:00 flat pace for the last 2 miles to break 2:40 but my tank was on empty. A stiff headwind didn’t help. Sub 2:40 just wasn’t meant to be today.

Final time was 2:40:32. 1+ minute PR. No regrets going after it. I did make it to the finish line without stopping so in that regard operation #stopsmoove was a major success.

Thanks again to everyone for their well wishes and input on my buildup. For someone who is self coached this thread has been a great resource. Hopefully I’ll have some time this week to give a recap of my buildup and offer my cents worth of lessons learned.

Stone - To answer your questions...Right now, my plan is mostly play it by ear. No workout plans, but I do have some general concepts about volume. Have a 3 + 2 scenario left: three weeks of training and two weeks of taper. For the three weeks, I will look to keep the mileage to 60+. Will look to get another solid 20-miler (or two?) in there. The taper, as with my last two marathons, will be fairly steep. Will drop that mileage and take some days off. Rest is key for me.

All the best to you...

Big kudos to the Chicago runners. Watching the results roll in this morning was awesome. Everyone doing well on the same day is something special.

16 weeks to Houston

Goal: sub-2:25

S - Off

M - 12 treadmill (7:08) -- good for 3 episodes of the Twilight Zone

T - AM: 14 w/ 8 @ 5:40 avg; PM: 4 recovery

W - 12 easy

Th - AM: 12 w/ 8 x 30s sprints; PM: 6 easy

F - 12 (7:13)

S - AM: Track workout (16 miles); PM: 6 recovery

Total: 94 miles

I cracked my knee on a piece of wood furniture Sunday and opted to play things safe and ice it down to normal.

Tuesday tempo: I wanted to start at 5:35-5:40 and progress down to sub-5:30 but it was full humidity that morning. 80/77 at 4:30 am. Not nice. Holding 5:40 turned into a chore, but it's all money in the bank.

Saturday workout: 1000-1200-1600-1200-1000 (rests: 2:50, 3:10, 4:20, 3:10) + 4 x 200m. Came in at 3:05, 3:41, 4:58, 3:44, 3:05. 200s in 34.2, 33.1, 32.5, 32.0 I'm ready to drop pace but humidity was again an issue. The heat monkey jumped on my back during the 1600 and held me down. 80-82 + 77 through the run.

The 10-day forecast shows a low of 65F on Thursday dropping all the way to 60F by next Tuesday. I am beyond ready to kiss summer goodbye.

First off, let my add to the congratulations to Andy, Smoove, AJ and Gordon T. Really inspiring to see all the work pay off on marathon day. Enjoy your success, gentlemen.

Pappy wrote:

Allen, how can you already be making 2019 plans? Or are you just putting down some rough drafts? I think some of OR's playbook could be good for you. Try to figure out how to get some strides in though.

Pappy - Yeah, at this point I am looking at options, but why would it be too early to be making concrete plans? Agreed about the strides; they were part of my plan this year, but I neglected them because of the achilles issues.

Stone Cutter - Yes, mourn the loss, but be inspired by the memory. Thanks for noticing my long run this week. I was happy with the effort, too; with the hamstring issue, I couldn't run any workouts, so I planned to go long, with as much quality as my injury would allow.

TDL - 3:45 a.m. wake-up for daily runs?! You are a better man than I ever was or will be.

Coach Jeff - Congratulations on the 10K win. Somehow, though, your description reminds me of one those recurring racing dreams I have. Does every runner have these -- forget my shoes, miss the start, don't know the course, somehow forget I am in a race halfway through, or the course goes THROUGH a building, and I don't know which doorways to take?!

RGM - I wouldn't worry too much about that HM. Tired legs at this point in the training cycle doesn't sound unusual. Two-week taper, and that sub-3 can be there. Gordon T has paved the way!

RRR - That Friday alternations workout is particularly strong. Big mileage for the week, too. I am watching and learning!

th3bt - Congratulations on the HM podium finish. And, wow, those are some impressive masters PRs.

pewow - So, was that trail 12K enjoyable? I've only run one race even close to that - grabbing trees to climb the ascents, crossing a knee-deep stream. It was painful but a lot of fun; I went down hard on a steep wooded descent. I would be afraid to take those risks today, of course!

Bdubs - Hope you can sort out the injury issues. A couple years ago I had recurring sharp foot pain. It was so bad the day before my marathon, I couldn't put any weight on the foot at all. It was a little better the next day, and I got through the race ... took a week or two off, and it never came back. ????

RunnerSam - Super 3x3 workout. And impressive 20-miler ... I agree with your assessment: Plus 6 miles, minus 20 seconds is doable! Five weeks to go. And, hey, that's cool about your dad getting into running in his 50s.

angryjohnny - Congrats again on that new PR! Identical to my PR, by the way. So close to that sub-2:40, and you did a great job of going for it. Darn right, no regrets! I saw a height/weight-graded calculator recently and plugged your stats into it (from memory so not quite right), and it churned out something like 2:28 equivalent. I have said it before, but it just astounds me how you can motor along at that pace!

Smoove - Awesome performance. You are so mentally tough. And those screenshots of you on the final stretch really show great form, despite the fatigue and cramping.

Gordon T - 6:45-pace, man! You nailed it! Your strategy worked perfectly for that sub-3. Count me as another guy with a soft spot for the 2:5x chasers.

OR - Fantastic week after that 20-mile race. Good to see that rest days. I am a great fan of rest days, you know!

pedro - Will be interesting to follow another Masters runner here.

slo - "*f- 24 miles steady @6:07 pace" Awesome.

going faster mph - Interesting week. Can you describe the sledding hill repeats? How easy is easy?

still improving - Looks like injuries are in the rear-view mirror, then? Nothing wrong with sore quads ...

RunnersFix - Wow. I wasn't around back when you were posting before -- how old are you, and have you been running that sort of volume consistently?

krishna - That Michigan Workout would be fun to try.

Have a great week. Sorry if I overlooked anyone!

Hell of day for the Chicago racers!

Gordon – Congrats on joining the sub-3 club!!! 2:57? Your training was consistent, and it clearly paid off with room to spare.

Smoove – congrats on the PR and the Masters win! All those B+ weeks culminated in an A race day.

AJ – Congrats on the PR! Sub 2:40 will come. Remarkable splits! Sorry my slow and steady cheer.

Andy – congrats on the PR!

How did you all celebrate? Any thoughts on what's next while you enjoy the moment?

RunnerSam, Pappy, Stone – thanks for the words of encouragement. I do feel sub-3 is within reach in two weeks. That’s the only day in the cycle the clock truly matters.

Question for all racers – what shoes do you race in and how does that compare to your normal footwear? I usually rotate between two pairs of Adidas Boosts for everything, and am looking to branch out.

SI: Glad to see you're having some improvement.Bdubs: Hope your issues are nothing serious. An Ekiden-style race sounds fun!RunGuy:

Can I chop off 3 seconds per mile and double the distance in 2 weeks?

I say "Hell yeah," because, as you noted, that race wasn't a good indicator of your preparedness. That said, "garbage legs" two weeks out... monitor carefully and taper wisely!

RRR: Another great week. Another PR. Another reason for me to do as you do. OK. I'm in. Going monastic till race day 11/4. Not "plant-based" monastic, mind you, but not gonna hit anything harder than a few drops of vanilla extract in my bullet-proof coffee.

Off to work...

Coach Jeff ROC wrote:

RunGuy:

Can I chop off 3 seconds per mile and double the distance in 2 weeks?

I say "Hell yeah," because, as you noted, that race wasn't a good indicator of your preparedness. That said, "garbage legs" two weeks out... monitor carefully and taper wisely!

Coach Jeff, you are the man. I agree with your analysis, and am closely monitoring the ole legs.

Allen, thanks for your comments as well! Love the supportive nature of the group. Not to mention the great training, nutrition, and attire ideas.

That's it for me today. Tell Monday I'll give it hell in a few hours.

Allen1959 wrote:

RunnersFix - Wow. I wasn't around back when you were posting before -- how old are you, and have you been running that sort of volume consistently?

RunnersFix is incredibly humble, and Smoove I am sure is either celebrating or rightfully passed out, so I will give a brief history. Yes, he holds that kind of volume year round, dropping down to the 110s sometimes and going up to the 140s, from what I recall. He qualified for and participated in the last Olympic marathon trials. Early this year he was under Smoove’s guidance when he popped a 2:18 PR at Ottawa. He has obvious talent but even more than that he has the best work ethic and very often “outraces” his talent.

An incredible runner. Impossible not to root for guys like him...

Now if only Pikachu and TheGarbageDisposal would come back as well...

Congratulations on your PR. I look forward to your recap and what you think went well. Also congrats to Smoove for running a great race. Both of you took a shot, and that deserves respect.

Allen1959 wrote:

Pappy wrote:

Allen, how can you already be making 2019 plans? Or are you just putting down some rough drafts? I think some of OR's playbook could be good for you. Try to figure out how to get some strides in though.

Pappy - Yeah, at this point I am looking at options, but why would it be too early to be making concrete plans? Agreed about the strides; they were part of my plan this year, but I neglected them because of the achilles issues.

Well, how many races are you going to run in 2019? What is your goal race? I believe you are running Sub 3 in the marathon again correct? When are you running this? Everything you do should build for it but how would/could you know what you need in relation to your goal in say March?

At best you can just write down the Goal Date. Working backward you can then write down 2-3 weeks before GD to start the taper and tuning. 5-8 weeks before then you can mark the actual training phase where you start dialing in on the goal. 4-6 weeks before that mark down as a transition period. Depending on what shape you are in before 11-17 weeks out from the goal, the plan is just to get yourself ready for the plan.

Personally, I could never schedule more than 3 weeks at a time. In all honesty, I don't even like scheduling more than 1 week outside of a rough draft. I normal would schedule the next week based off of the last two weeks while calculating the effects of 2 weeks ago on the last week. Give an honest assessment of where I'm at in relation to the goal and then schedule ahead.

I just don't think I could do more than a rough draft with some key checkpoints this far out and make it very useful. Things always happen.

Allen - I’m honored to share a PR with a bad ass like you. Good looking family btw. Thanks for sharing.

RunGuy - i am celebrating by driving home w the family Clark Griswold style. As for shoes, I race in the vaporfly, do speedwork in the Streak, and easy run in vomeros or lunarglides.

Coach - welcome aboard the wagon! 50 days here and all of a sudden getting way faster hmmmmm

RunGuy - I will admit to becoming a bit more obsessive about certain things since no beer including shoes so here is my rotation

Most of my mileage - adidas tempo 9

Some recovery runs - adidas energy boost

Tempos/alternations/long workouts - Nike zoom fly sp

Short races/speed work - Nike fly knit streak

Half Marathons - Flyknit Vaporfly (one workout in those Friday and they are back in the box until racing. First HM in them Sunday)

The tempo is a fantastic trainer. Just perfect.

Some quick comments.

Stone - Sorry for your loss.

TDR - That's an early start to the day. I guess that you found a group to run with.

WH - Enjoy the vacation.

Harrier98 - Solid week.

Coach Jeff - That's a solid week of training for a week that includes a race. The color of those Vaporflies is 'Bright Crimson'. At least that is what Nike calls it. Definitely not crimson in my book. Intentionally conspicuous for marketing purposes.

RGM - I would put that HM race result behind you. Just remember that the race was on untapered legs in less than idea conditions.

RRR - Nice job on the workouts this week. What really has me is the overall postive attitude and motivation. You and Pappy keep up the good work.

Th3bt - I totally missed your race in my earlier scan of the thread. Congrats on the podium finish and the cash prize. A nice close to the week. Hope the hammy is on the mend.

Sub 6:00 - Wow, you must have hit that knee really hard.

Allen - Dang! Those days off put you in the mood for a serious long run or what.

RunnerSam - Nice 3x3.

AJ - Congrats on the big fat PR. You ran a smart race and gave it all you had. And yes, to share 2:40:xx with Allen is an honor.

Shoe update: I could barely even get the Zoom Fly flyknit on my foot, and so they are going back. Incredibly narrow and low height shoe. Will wear something else in the marathon.