Road Racing and Training Thread Week Ending 08/05/2018

angryjohnny wrote:

krishna wrote:

No wonder you're angry, that sounds awful

It was awfully uncomfortable but even then running was the drug that cured my anger issues.

Respect

Speaking of humidity...the humidity here at the beach in NC is kicking my can soundly. Dew points of 75 and 76 for my a.m. runs, and bright sun. I go 8 miles and then have had enough. Strangely, I do not come in and head for the fridge...not a huge thirst...I just want to stop and get out of the heat. If I carry water, I gather I can run farther, but eveyone here knows how much I hate carrying water. Will look to double tonight. Will consider this my sea-level altitude training.

Happy running, everyone.

Ah, Stone! You are too kind. I'll do my best to live up to your expectations. It's great to see you're still running and doing it with such grace, incidentally. You're a major inspiration to me and, I'm sure, to many others too.

Nice to meet you too, Jeff. I'm not sure "epic" is quite the right word to use for my running at this point (or even "comeback" for that matter). After so many false starts, I'm a bit nervous to jump the gun on declaring the project a success, you know? Regardless, I'm looking forward to following your build to Boston! Are you really on a "no sugar" diet? How did that come about? Is it hard? I know I would stand no chance.

welcome to florida

J - You got it, brother. I have been thinking it to be Florida-esque.

And it is giving me a massive appetite, too.

Did the double. Second run was a sunny 90 + 74 = 164 (feels like of 101), though I did have some shade along the way...4.5 at 6:33 overall...6:56, 6:31, 6:35, 6:21, 3:07. Felt better than this morning. Always does. Did 8.13 at 6:50 overall in the a.m.

OR -- Well done. Just curious ... have you been completely injury-free of late? No little nagging aches or pains? Just still amazes me that you physically can run marathon pace or faster every day, day after day, with no recovery runs, and lately hardly a day off. And doubles, too. Incredible resilience. (I'm figuring 6:45 in a 100° steam bath equates to 6:20 or better!) Carry on. I'm looking forward to marathon season. Alas, feeling a bit envious here on the sidelines ...

Allen - Thanks very much...My body is feeling pretty good, though in the past few days, my right achilles started barking at me (down low, near the heel). I feel it mostly in the first two miles and then after a run. Perhaps my Kinvaras are getting beaten down. I even ordered some new shoes and some insoles while here on vacay. They were supposed to arrive today, but “severe weather” has delayed the package. Hope they arrive tomorrow. My knee has been feeling pretty good, and all other systems are “go.” I feel strong (muscles, etc)...though, overall, I would say that I am tired from the heat.

I kept waiting for your race report... so much so that I went back and searched through the thread! Turns out I missed it way back on page 1, right after I posted!

Congrats on the PR and the victory! It's a good omen for a great autumn!

outsiderunner wrote:

My body is feeling pretty good, though in the past few days, my right achilles started barking at me (down low, near the heel). I feel it mostly in the first two miles and then after a run.

I experienced the same symptoms most of last year and this spring with my right achilles. I managed through it by doing eccentric heal drops. I was advised not to dip much beyond level if the pain is insertional.

Recently, it's the left one that hurts. Worse than the right achilles ever did. It helps that my knees are healthy enough now to tolerate greater-drop shoes. That lessens the achilles stress I think. Hopefully, it will improve like the other one.

Allen1959 wrote:

outsiderunner wrote:

My body is feeling pretty good, though in the past few days, my right achilles started barking at me (down low, near the heel). I feel it mostly in the first two miles and then after a run.

I experienced the same symptoms most of last year and this spring with my right achilles. I managed through it by doing eccentric heal drops. I was advised not to dip much beyond level if the pain is insertional.

Recently, it's the left one that hurts. Worse than the right achilles ever did. It helps that my knees are healthy enough now to tolerate greater-drop shoes. That lessens the achilles stress I think. Hopefully, it will improve like the other one.

I don't know if this is applicable, helpful, or just anecdotal, but I'll throw it out there.

In the past, I've had Achilles issues on the left side that I'd call "moderate chronic." But I've been problem free for the past couple of years and I have a theory about this. A couple of years ago when I went to low HR training, I was loathe to give up running in the hills. Running uphill, however, inevitably put me over the line. One adjustment I made was to approach the steep uphills with very small strides... very little leg motion... Instead, I take very small "ankle bounces" uphill, entirely on the forefoot, almost like trying to use only the kinetic stored energy in the tendons of my lower leg. I did it to keep the HR low, but I'm postulating that the disappearance of Achilles issues is related to this periodic ankle bouncing.

Kinda reminds me of how Lydiard said (if I got it right) that his athletes never had Achilles problems because of the hill bounding.

I’ve wondered how much of that observation might be survivorship bias, but with my flare-up of lower leg issues, might give bounding a try when things are back to normal.

(Did 4x.75 steady/solid run with .1 brisk walk rest this morning. Total of 3.3 walk/run averaging 6:41. Hoping to get back to a light-normal next week if things go well.)

Sub 6:00 wrote:

Kinda reminds me of how Lydiard said (if I got it right) that his athletes never had Achilles problems because of the hill bounding.

I’ve wondered how much of that observation might be survivorship bias, but with my flare-up of lower leg issues, might give bounding a try when things are back to normal.

(Did 4x.75 steady/solid run with .1 brisk walk rest this morning. Total of 3.3 walk/run averaging 6:41. Hoping to get back to a light-normal next week if things go well.)

I meant to add that Lydiard observation, too.

I'm not suggesting that this is a way to cure an acute problem. In my case, I had stiffness and some tenderness to the touch maybe in the morning getting out of bed which entirely disappeared once I warmed up on a run. As with anything, the poison/cure is likely in the dosage. As I said, it wasn't something I was specifically targeting; it just kinda happened. So it's a correlation, but not necessarily a cause.

outsiderunner wrote:

And it is giving me a massive appetite, too.

I sense the appetite is not coming from the weather but from the vacay food. I e. More processed food. Lots of animal foods. And not much high fibrous plant foods.

10 pcs of whole fruit of day Overcome most of this. You can substitute cut whole fruit berries and grapes etc if it equals 3 lbs

You can’t run well whilst eating burgers and dogs tater salad and fries. (Just a guess)

Been a bit distracted lately, but here are some quick drive by comments.

GT- Your race result it a good indicator that you are close to being able to hit your sub 3 goal. Perhaps you may have done better on rested and tapered legs. May you be the harbinger of things to come for the other sub 3 hopefuls including me. Honestly I am envious of of your 5k race result. Keep up the good work.

RGM - Congrats on the PR and win.

Coach Jeff - Started following you on Strava a week or two back to see what you have really been up to. Keep up the good work and I and it seems that you have picke up things this week.

Sub 6:00 - In light of your posterior tibial tendon problem I will hold off on the hard sell of the Leesburg 20k. Hope it gets better soon. Note that I run a good portion of the race route on a regular basis.

RRR - I'm with Pappy on biking and tightening the hamstring. I think biking tends make the back half of my legs tight. With that in mind I tend to back off on any serious biking the week or two before a race.

Allen - Congrats on defending your 15k title. Good to see your hard work payoff. Hope the achilles gets better soon. My long run average pace tends to be a bit faster for a few reasons. The weekend long run is almost always in the morning with cooler temps while the weekday runs are in the afternoon. The longer run helps average out the slower first mile or two. Toward the end of the long run I try to make an effort to keep the pace up despite the fatigue.

OR - I know you have been looking for some races for a fitness check. There are a couple to consider. First is the Leesburg 20k on Aug 19 and then there is the Parks Half Marathon in Rockville Md. Sept. 9. Stating the obvious here, but due to the time of year these races are generally in warm humid weather.

Lastly, welcome to the new and returning posters.

Jeff - Definitely, don’t try while acutely injured! I’m sticking to theraband and raises for a bit. And maybe a 4 mile jog here in a bit.

SI - Leesburg is doubtful for me. But it looks like a nice race, so maybe next year.

Allen1959 wrote:

outsiderunner wrote:

My body is feeling pretty good, though in the past few days, my right achilles started barking at me (down low, near the heel). I feel it mostly in the first two miles and then after a run.

I experienced the same symptoms most of last year and this spring with my right achilles. I managed through it by doing eccentric heal drops. I was advised not to dip much beyond level if the pain is insertional.

Recently, it's the left one that hurts. Worse than the right achilles ever did. It helps that my knees are healthy enough now to tolerate greater-drop shoes. That lessens the achilles stress I think. Hopefully, it will improve like the other one.

I’ve been dealing with chronic insertional achilles tendinopathy off and on since 2004. During a flare, it will hurt at the beginning of the run and then go away. It will also be tender a few hours after the run causing me to limp around the house. This summer it was the trigger for me to dump doubles a few weeks earlier than planned. You can keep this injury at bay by keeping your lower leg muscles loose, wearing high offset shoes, managing training load, and doing heel drops (without pain) but apart from that it really doesn’t ever go away.