HOULIHAN SHELBY with the AR in heusden

that goes without saying wrote:

Trudy Sting wrote:

I’m sending out an SOS .

It will all come tumbling down when she admits...

And we can put Jerry Shoes to rest too.

Naturally (although she won't admit). For me, the last straw was when Jager was ranked the most suspicious doper of them all in 2016, way ahead of Farah, Rupp and Kiprop.

Indeed. There’s no way on fvcking earth she’s clean. Americans need to stop sniffing her knickers and wake up.

Maybe patriotism, but why is Cory Mcgee of New Balance pacing a Nike Runner? Also is she wearing what looks like Vaporfly shoes in one of her Instragram posts?

PRs for both Schweizer and Fraser? Do they get better coaching now than they did in college?

Not sure if this is the reason, but they have the same agent

got_to_ask wrote:

Maybe patriotism, but why is Cory Mcgee of New Balance pacing a Nike Runner? Also is she wearing what looks like Vaporfly shoes in one of her Instragram posts?

would love to see that picture from her wearing 4%ers ?

Why is it a nogo to pace someone from another shoe company ?

I guess Cory McGee saw a great opportunity to

A: help make something big happen

B: get a nice tempo in her legs after her race

C: earn a little money before heading back to the US

The cynicism on this board is tiring. My default on Shelby and most US runners are that they are clean. The US has a robust anti doping strategy who I believe are doing their jobs well. Schweizer also had a PB so are you guys assuming that she's doped too? Shelby's time is exactly in the ballpark that I expected given her recent times and progression.

Wake up fanboys wrote:

that goes without saying wrote:

Naturally (although she won't admit). For me, the last straw was when Jager was ranked the most suspicious doper of them all in 2016, way ahead of Farah, Rupp and Kiprop.

Indeed. There’s no way on fvcking earth she’s clean. Americans need to stop sniffing her knickers and wake up.

got_to_ask wrote:

Maybe patriotism, but why is Cory Mcgee of New Balance pacing a Nike Runner?

I think you meant to ask, "Why is Cory Mcgee, Stephen Haas client, pacing Shelby Houlihan, Stephen Haas client?"

Also, I'm sure Nike or BTC paid her well.

Plus I'm sure it's cool to be part of an AR.

Do you have evidence, or are you some stupid ass that when someone produces a great performance they automatically are juiced. Using your "logic" I guess Tommie Smith, Bob Hayes, Peter Snell, etc., were all juiced back in the day. You are one ignorant fool.

Good for her wrote:

Thank goodness there were no doped up Africans in the race.

Just the doped up Americans.

[quote]Concupiscurd wrote:

The cynicism on this board is tiring. My default on Shelby and most US runners are that they are clean. The US has a robust anti doping strategy who I believe are doing their jobs well. Schweizer also had a PB so are you guys assuming that she's doped too? Shelby's time is exactly in the ballpark that I expected given her recent times and progression.

The US has more doctors and medical institutions, and more Americans are mesmerised by them than in any other country.

yoyomama wrote:

Courtney in Bowerman Kit

hehehaha wrote:

Thats Fraser

If you meant Courtney Frerichs, she didn't run at Heusden today.

Concupiscurd wrote:

The US has a robust anti doping strategy who I believe are doing their jobs well.

Houlihan turned pro in the summer of 2015. In her first 2 1/2 years as a pro, USADA tested her 5x. Most of these appear to have been in-season -- she was not tested at all in 2015, 2x in the summer of 2016, 2x in the spring of 2017 and 1x that fall. That schedule doesn't appear to leave much time for out-of-competition testing.

Obviously, no one knows whether she's dirty. If a Kenyan ran her times and had that testing record, would you be so outraged if people wondered? Have you forgotten the LA Olympics? the 1983 Pan Am Games? The "Breakfast of Champions"?

But...but...but wrote:

Concupiscurd wrote:

The US has a robust anti doping strategy who I believe are doing their jobs well.

Houlihan turned pro in the summer of 2015. In her first 2 1/2 years as a pro, USADA tested her 5x. Most of these appear to have been in-season -- she was not tested at all in 2015, 2x in the summer of 2016, 2x in the spring of 2017 and 1x that fall. That schedule doesn't appear to leave much time for out-of-competition testing.

Obviously, no one knows whether she's dirty. If a Kenyan ran her times and had that testing record, would you be so outraged if people wondered? Have you forgotten the LA Olympics? the 1983 Pan Am Games? The "Breakfast of Champions"?

Excellent analysis

T&F Nut wrote:

Do you have evidence?

Here's an American gold medalist/WR holder talking about using steroids in 1960.

Subway Surfers wrote:

Excellent analysis

+1

Plus, there is Gatlin, and Rupp, and Jager, etc., and the accepted beef and kissing excuses, and USADA let Armstrong dope all his way to 7 TdF wins, despite positive tests and witnesses. Only after his retirement, they began to act.

We do not have robust anti-doping here. That's only part of the show, nothing else. Including the Armstrong saga.

Over 30 years ago, at the age of 19, Zola Budd ran 14:48, barefoot(!), to break the 5,000 meter world record. Honestly, after all this time, knowing what Budd, Kristiansen, Ribeiro, et al were running in the 80’s and 90’s, it’s a bit surprising the AR is still north of 14:30.

Concupiscurd wrote:

The US has a robust anti doping strategy who I believe are doing their jobs well.

The USADA "Athlete Test History" page might be worth a look. It's interesting to see how often athletes are tested. Take Jenny Simpson. USADA tested her 17 times in her first 5 1/2 years as a pro. That's basically 3x/year. Is that a lot or a little?

sigh.

That famous meeting in 1968 when Jesse Owens tried to placate the San Jose guys (Smith, Carlos, Evans, et al)? Connolly was in the room. My heart sank when I read that.

She ran 3:57/14:34, which is not out of whack with Rowbury's 3:56/14:38, especially with a primarily distance-based training program. Still, you have to wonder what her ceiling is at the 5 now, because she won both races and the 5 was not at all competitive for her. It is tough to run as fast when you're running solo like a time trial after (I would assume) 3k as here.

Bekele did it after 2k, but on what? If he had 12:30 guys to chase, I assume he would have run even faster. If Houlihan gets into a race like the Rabat 5000m that just took place, maybe she will run in the 14:20s. After all, she crushed Hassan at the end of her last 1500m, and Hassan turned around and ran 14:22. Houlihan should end this season with at least one more American record, at 1500m, and I would like to see her run in a fast 800m as well. This is a literally incredible season for her.

Schweizer is off to a great start as a pro, a big pr at 1500 and now close to breaking 15. With the current Bowerman female lineup, she may well be running 14:40s next year.