Easy vs Recovery runs

Daniels' Easy pace was faster than I was used to as well.

Do you ever double? When I double, my second run is usually on a hard day... and SLOW.

I am a 2:35 marathoner so dont take my advice if youre faster than that. I run 70-85 a week and my easy runs are 9-12 min miles on dirt roads. I do two long runs and two speed workouts a week. I do a lot of two a days. When I run slow I run slow dude.

no I don't double. I was running 5 1200m intervals at 5:45 pace and 4 miles at 6:20 pace each week with a long run at 7:50 pace. Then 3 other days at like 9 minute pace, a little over.

Now on the 2Q i'm doing a lot of marathon pacing and my easy runs are now faster. Same exact heart rate though.

Trying to figure out why it's good to run easy runs faster (or fresher).

Bad Advice Giver wrote:

I am a 2:35 marathoner so dont take my advice if youre faster than that. I run 70-85 a week and my easy runs are 9-12 min miles on dirt roads. I do two long runs and two speed workouts a week. I do a lot of two a days. When I run slow I run slow dude.

I am not that fast. I am trying to get sub 3. I was always told to run slow, but I mostly did it by feel and heart rate. feel and heart rate are both saying go a bit faster. Wonder if I'm not working hard enough on the hard days.

that said, i'm at VDOT for easy days now and before I was way slower.

I think you are just responding well to the training right now as you have backed off the hard workouts. As hard as MP 12 miles may feel, it may not be putting the same strain on your legs.

It sounds like you are still running on feel a little bit as you just feel fresher on those easy days. Sometimes a change in training can revitalize the legs a bit. working different muscles and working them differently can make them feel fresher.

Relatively speaking, I am a sub 6:50 10k guy..have only maxed out with 40+ mpw a few times, still slowly building my miles over time. For myself, my easy days weren't easy enough the past few years. The last 6-9 months I've become much more dialed in easy days being very EASY, for me at least. A solid tempo pace for me is 7:10-7:30 depending on the route and weather conditions, my easy days are now 9:15-10 minute pace. I've made the addition of strides on my easy days, and damn, I really feel a difference. Not as many dead legs days as I've had in the past, and keeping my heart rate low. I never understood the whole easy day concept, and why they're important. My ignorance finally came to light.

Bad Advice Giver wrote:

I am a 2:35 marathoner

my easy runs are 9-12 min miles

wut

The VDOT easy paces always seemed too fast for me. I like Tinman's easy and recovery paces better. Find his calculator and use his. There is no issue running slower on easy days as long as you are still actually running.

Kinghobbyjogger wrote:

The VDOT easy paces always seemed too fast for me. I like Tinman's easy and recovery paces better. Find his calculator and use his. There is no issue running slower on easy days as long as you are still actually running.

Personally I am a big proponent of "easy pace" just being whatever feels easy that day and recovery pace just being whatever gets blood flowing in your tired legs.

Why concern yourself with pace or 'calculators' for those types of runs when you can just enjoy them and not bother thinking about it at all?

The year I ran 4:13 for the mile my easy days where 8-10 min pace on super flat routes. A lot of different ways to train even some of the greats ran butt slow on easy runs....but then you have others who rarely run 6 min + on easy days....general rule of thumb though is you can run as slow as you need on easy runs if your body needs it or even relatively fast as long as your recovering. Key being your recovering. Give yourself flexibility...if you feel good one day and you run 745 then that’s cool or another day it may be 9 min pace. Let it happen.

Easy runs are for recovery. If you're running too fast to recover from a run in time for your next workout, its not an easy run. Sometimes its better to go by feel than a chart.

Seems like no one is really attempting to address the issue.

If you have a choice between running slower and doing more miles or keeping your easy runs at a respectable pace and limiting mileage, which is better?

Or instead of tweaking mileage, you can tweak the difficulty of your hard days. Go hard on hard days and then have to shuffle around on your easy days, or go moderately hard and keep a good pace on easy days?

Or do you decrease frequency of hard days? What if you can recover in 2 days running 7:00 pace or in one day running 10:00 pace. Do you take the trash 10:00 pace mileage on your easy day and do as many workouts as possible or do you prioritize volume of quality running?

The point is that tweaking easy run pace involves a conscious choice to prioritize one facet of training over another. No one is saying what the priority should be.

I used to do whatever it took to rack up the miles. I got fast, improved across the board and then got hurt. Now, older and wiser, I focus only on two workouts and a LR. Non workout days are short and slow. Better to be a bit under-trained than the fittest guy in the stands.