Fair enough. At least we’re not saying that Desi kept drinking/eating because she was just tougher.
AJ is another good example of how fueling strategy is probably not the best explanation here.
Fair enough. At least we’re not saying that Desi kept drinking/eating because she was just tougher.
AJ is another good example of how fueling strategy is probably not the best explanation here.
I just want to know what people think of Yuki's training. I think he can race so much because he does not try to peak or taper.
Just my opinion but I don’t think he would run much faster no matter what training he does. A lot of people race their workouts. He uses races as workouts. The only thing separating him from the Kipchoges of the world is basic leg speed.
Congrats, Back into it, AngryJohnny, and pretzel man. Also, Average Joe for qualifying for Boston 2019.
Just finishing Boston last Monday is something to be proud of.
M29, first HM on 4/14/18. Finished in 1:26:25, goal was 1:22:XX
Training has went well the last few weeks, but I have been to busy to post.
Saturday was pretty chilly this time of year in the KC area. 39 F w/ 20 mph wind. The start of the race was great! Fun atmosphere and lots of competition. First nine miles were run at goal pace. Clicked off each mile between 6:00 and 6:20. I felt super strong and was excited for the second half of the race. There was a small caveat, the wind was at our back, but the majority of the hills were already scaled.
After the turnaround at mile 7, I began the march into the cold headwind. Nothing like Boston, but the conditions were challenging for a guy with Renaud's Syndrome. Noticed my pace started to lag for miles 8 and 9, but was confident I could kick it up a notch. By mile 10, my arms and legs were numb and I felt as if I was running in cement. Maybe I bonked, but the cold totally zapped me. Miles 11, 12 and 13 were a grind to the finish line but I got there .
I was disappointed initially with the time, but I knew I gave it all I had. I had a few similar problems in training on recent long runs in colder temps, but I was always able to divert from a head wind and warm up so I could regain pace. Saturday I wore a base layer, thermal half-zip, tights, gloves, and a beanie. By the time I reached the turnaround my clothes were very damp from all of my sweat. Damp clothes and cold windy weather don't mix well. The next time I happen to race in the cold I will re-evaluate what I wear.
Next up I have a 5k on May 5th , a half on May 19th, and a mile on June 5th. Looking forward to bouncing back and enjoying some warmer temps.
Hope everyone has a great week!
-HStu
Just popping into the thread to say a HUGE CONGRATS to AJ on an insane PR in incredible conditions.
I've never watched a more entertaining race and to run so controlled in that? Incredibly impressive.
Apologies for missing anyone else out, but wow. What a day you guys must've had.
Personally I'm running a 175km relay race in the Netherlands this weekend. Theoretically I'm racing 5 legs of 5-10km each between midnight Friday and Noon Saturday. Literally no idea how to pace/recover/fuel this but what the hell, let's give it a go.
Congrats again to Boston runners!
Thanks HHH et al. Good luck this weekend.
Great discussion here about what happened on Monday. Lots of very good points. The takeaway for me is that there are so many things that can go wrong in a marathon and each person is hit with a different combination of factors that makes broad generalizations very difficult. And that’s a big part of why the marathon puzzle so much fun to attempt and so rewarding to solve.
runrincerepeat wrote:
AJ - so the jist of the story is that you talk trash and then go home devastated. This will also happen in Jan 2019.
Run Fruit Repeat
Better to talk trash and go home devastated than to talk trash and stay home a quitter.
Hey guys, used to post here during training and got so much great advice from Stone, Smoove, Hereford, pewow, slo-twitch, consistency, working harder, and so many others. After 3 tries in 2015/2016 finally got into Boston with a 3:10 last year, and then ran the race on Monday in some crazy conditions. But just wanted to come back and Post here to say thanks to all of you who helped me get there. It was awesome, volunteers were great, I and I even got to see the wife and kids along boyleston. And now that I know what to expect in terms of logistics and the course, I have some motivation to get in again next year! Anyway thanks and all the best.
NiceGuy - Awesome job and congrats! Hope to see you there in '19. Sounds like we may have a nice contingent from RR&T representing.
Good stuff, Niceguy. I'm most likely running the 5k there next year, but I may sneak in a qualifier this summer or early fall as part of my Chicago training so I have the option of moving up to the marathon if I think I can handle two fulls in six months at age 46-47 (and if my family can handle both parents marathon training for the same race).
Either way, I'll be up there barring injury to Mrs. Smoove, so we can maybe have a good meet up for a shake out.
I will not quit.. .and I will not drop out! I was just trying to lull you into a complacent attitude then I realized I was dealing with A Mfing J who run Boston naked in poor conditions ..
I also soooooooo do not want to eat flesh ever again in my life... this is a driver for me. Being hurt doesnt help my psychy any but if its elliptical 2 hours a dam day not to eat a dead animal I am game.
Niceguy542006 wrote:
Hey guys, used to post here during training and got so much great advice from Stone, Smoove, Hereford, pewow, slo-twitch, consistency, working harder, and so many others. After 3 tries in 2015/2016 finally got into Boston with a 3:10 last year, and then ran the race on Monday in some crazy conditions. But just wanted to come back and Post here to say thanks to all of you who helped me get there. It was awesome, volunteers were great, I and I even got to see the wife and kids along boyleston. And now that I know what to expect in terms of logistics and the course, I have some motivation to get in again next year! Anyway thanks and all the best.
That’s great to hear, man! Congrats. Glad to hear you are doing well. Best to you and your family.
too hot wrote:
On a side note, I would love to see a statistical breakdown comparing race performances between those who wore minimalist clothing and those who didn't. It seemed fairly obvious to me that Kirui, Shalane, and Molly for example were acting as parachutes out there and the mere sight of it was jolting.
Haven't been able to find pictures of everyone yet, but here's what I have so far:
Wore a Jacket: 2/6 women DNF, Those that finished were: 1,7,9,16. 3/8 Men DNF, finishers were: 2,5,6,7,9.
Wore Armsleeves: 3/8 women DNF, those that finished were: 2,4,6,10,11. Men 3/5 DNF, finishers were: 1, 4
Wore Neither: 2/3 women DNF, finisher was 20th. Men 1/3 DNF, finishers were: 3, 15.
So in total, DNF rate by attire was as follows.
Jacket: 5/14 = 36%
Armsleeves: 6/13 = 46%
Neither: 3/6 = 50%
Thanks stat! Seems like clothing was not the X factor and I think AJ is right as well about how we can't make generalizations. The visual of Kirui's jacket flapping in the wind and the way Molly/Shalane appeared bogged down by all their clothing was what stunned me I guess.
too hot wrote:
Thanks stat! Seems like clothing was not the X factor and I think AJ is right as well about how we can't make generalizations. The visual of Kirui's jacket flapping in the wind and the way Molly/Shalane appeared bogged down by all their clothing was what stunned me I guess.
I agree—the visual was stunning. Those parchute jackets must have had some effect.
Also, while I think there are outliers, such as AJ, dressing warmly, and not wearing shorts and a singlet, would have to be in order for most. I have run often in the cold and wet, and, without a doubt, I would have worn tights and some type of long sleeve, aerodynamic top...a hat and gloves, too.
Also, Shalane said in a post race interview that she runs in “45-55.” So, basically she runs in perfect conditions year-round. Portland is too mild and constant in its weather. These runners need to get out in the cold and wind, and in the heat and humidity, too. These last couple of weeks here, with all of the wind, have been physically and mentally draining. I run in these conditions regularly, in addition to running hills regularly. Right now, while both wind and hills are difficult, I can say that I am really getting fed up with the wind.
Great analysis here, guys. I am very much enjoying everyone’s input.
Under those weather conditions I don't think those jackets provided much protection from the elements for very long. I would guess that before too long they were probably pretty wet under those jackets. The jackets being wet inside and out with the wind blowing it against your skin, I bet it felt rather cold. I honestly don't know how I would have dressed for those weather conditions. On the other hand it probably would not have mattered much.
OR - I hear you on the wind. April should not be this windy. I'm tired of it too.
outsiderunner wrote:
Also, Shalane said in a post race interview that she runs in “45-55.” So, basically she runs in perfect conditions year-round. Portland is too mild and constant in its weather. These runners need to get out in the cold and wind, and in the heat and humidity, too. These last couple of weeks here, with all of the wind, have been physically and mentally draining. I run in these conditions regularly, in addition to running hills regularly. Right now, while both wind and hills are difficult, I can say that I am really getting fed up with the wind.
Great analysis here, guys. I am very much enjoying everyone’s input.
Shalane broke her back and missed Boston last year by trying to do workouts in the snow. On the Morning Shakeout podcast earlier this year she said she was more cautious now about running on ice and snow because of it, so if the roads are bad she treadmills now for safety. I don't blame her, no way of knowing it'll be a once in a lifetime worst conditions 4 months ago. It's hot in Boston way more often than cold.
HarrierStu - Tough call on the clothing choice for that race. Without the wind I would have worn shorts, short sleeves, and possibly a pair of gloves. Gloves during warm up, but probably not during the race. For your situation with the wind I would have to look at what the wind chill would have been. 20mph winds that were probably gusting to 30mph is significant and the out and back course does not help with deciding what to wear. Your clothing choice was probably just about right for the headwind and probably over dressed for the tailwind. You might have got by without the base layer. In the end, that headwind in the final miles of the race was most likely what did you in regardless of clothing choice. FWIW the 10 miler I ran recently I was dressed the same as you except swapping the beanie for a headband. Temp was mid to upper 20's with very little wind and I would say that I was slightly over dressed, but had no real comfort problems.
Renaud's Syndrome... Had to look that up. I suspect that I have a mild form of that. That explains why my hands turn white at times during the winter. Annoying. Had it happen last night while trying to drink a post run smoothie.
GT - They need wind and cold--not ice. I almost never run on ice. Snow is okay, but ice is dangerous. Not sure how windy Portland tends to be, but they certainly needs some cold/wind training. Not sure how to say this, but those elites seemed awfully "delicate" out there.
Before I forget: I agree--completely--that this would have been a very tough race for which to dress, the rain perhaps being the most complex aspect--and the wind being the most difficult as per the overall struggle of the race. There is nothing quite like running into a more-or-less straight headwind for 26.2. Wind is a killer, even more so than hills.
I have chilblains and probably Reynaud's, too. Have gotten it on my feet, but in the last couple of years the problem has been with my hands. It is difficult to treat. My fingers get reddish blotches from the chilblains, and they also turn white sometimes, too. When white, my fingers stiffen, and it can be hard to use my hands.