Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
mile race pace. 200 jog easy rest.
Do people really do this workout?
break them up into sets of 4 and run 33, 32, 31, 30 for each set. 200 j between reps 400 w between sets.
Mile race pace for 200m should not induce much fatigue so i would try and reduce the recovery to 100m jog in say 45 seconds.
increase the speed or cut the rest
We used to run a version of this in college. We called it 30 30s - we would do 6 sets of 5 with 30 seconds rest. It was on grass and the distance wasn’t exact but we probably ran mile race pace. We got 2 minutes between sets. This workout took a lot out of me on the day but recovery was quick. It was a good sharpening workout that we used towards the end of cross and track seasons. BTW - we were a decent team and finished top 10 in cross two years in a row.
milermb wrote:
Mile race pace for 200m should not induce much fatigue so i would try and reduce the recovery to 100m jog in say 45 seconds.
yes, i agree. mile race pace is fine for 400+ or in a way you have mentioned above. i have always experienced longer stuff to be better.
anyway, yesterday i have started the serious track work. after a few quarters the plan was to run 2 sets of 3x200 with 30s rest at about 800m race pace to get used to race feelings. perhaps i have had a bad day but that session was hard.
Better than you think wrote:
We used to run a version of this in college. We called it 30 30s - we would do 6 sets of 5 with 30 seconds rest. It was on grass and the distance wasn’t exact but we probably ran mile race pace. We got 2 minutes between sets. This workout took a lot out of me on the day but recovery was quick. It was a good sharpening workout that we used towards the end of cross and track seasons. BTW - we were a decent team and finished top 10 in cross two years in a row.
This is a very smart runner. Another way of progressing in the workout is to eventually develop the ability to go through 12.5 laps in close to your 5000 time.
Early season develop the 'ins', later in season develop the 'outs'.
If you're in high school (more natural speed) you can probably hit something 30-31 avg off of 1 minute between reps no problem.
If you're older, probably start more up at mile pace and either keep there or slowly bring it down.
Breaking into sets isn't a bad call either. Depends what the purpose is- pure sharpening or relaxation at race paces and get faster.
wisenheimer at work wrote:
milermb wrote:
Mile race pace for 200m should not induce much fatigue so i would try and reduce the recovery to 100m jog in say 45 seconds.
yes, i agree. mile race pace is fine for 400+ or in a way you have mentioned above. i have always experienced longer stuff to be better.
anyway, yesterday i have started the serious track work. after a few quarters the plan was to run 2 sets of 3x200 with 30s rest at about 800m race pace to get used to race feelings. perhaps i have had a bad day but that session was hard.
Probably due to the fact that:
1. It was your first "serious" track work this year, and
2. 30 seconds is a very short rest duration for 200's at 800 pace.
wrktngnr wrote:
Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
We do this type of session all the time up to 20-25x 200m at mile effort with 30" idle rest
joalturn wrote:
Probably due to the fact that:
1. It was your first "serious" track work this year, and
2. 30 seconds is a very short rest duration for 200's at 800 pace.
you are right. 200's at 800m pace with 30s rest is not the way to go.
Sloinnorcal wrote:
Better than you think wrote:
We used to run a version of this in college. We called it 30 30s - we would do 6 sets of 5 with 30 seconds rest. It was on grass and the distance wasn’t exact but we probably ran mile race pace. We got 2 minutes between sets. This workout took a lot out of me on the day but recovery was quick. It was a good sharpening workout that we used towards the end of cross and track seasons. BTW - we were a decent team and finished top 10 in cross two years in a row.
This is a very smart runner. Another way of progressing in the workout is to eventually develop the ability to go through 12.5 laps in close to your 5000 time.
Early season develop the 'ins', later in season develop the 'outs'.
Oh yeah, I think they call that a race......
wrktngnr wrote:
Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
There are a couple ways to do this workout and how you structure it really depends on the goal of the workout. The structure of doing it at around mile race pace with 200 jog easy rest will focus the workout on improving your running economy - basically this makes you run more efficiently and is beneficial no matter what race distance you are running. I'm training for the 10 mile to half marathon distance right now and still do this workout all the time.
One caveat with that workout is that going faster is not necessarily a good thing. If you run too fast and strain to run a faster pace, you actually will not get the same benefit that you will at a more comfortable pace. This is why this workout isn't that hard, but that's fine. I listened to Jack Daniels give a presentation once where he talked for a while about this.
On the other hand you could try to structure this workout to really improve your speed, in which case you would want to increase the pace or decrease the rest to make it harder. I don't do this type of workout as often as the other one mentioned above so won't pretend to be an expert on these.
2E+2 x (8x200@ mile race pace w/ 200 jog), 800 jog between sets +2E .... JD Phase II 5k training for 40-50mpw runner. that's 16x200. I'm sure there are other ways to do it and other reasons to do it those ways depending on your goal of the workout.
If it's early in a season/cycle and I'm just trying to improve speed, then I treat them like strides and might just walk 100 or 200m between reps and anything faster than mile pace is great.
If it's later in the season and I'm working on specific speed I care about pace and jogging set amounts between.
my coach gives me this workout actually. The way he sets it up is you go every 2 min. So, you run 30seconds you get 90seconds rest. We would go first 4 reps maybe 33/32 second four 32/31 third four 31/30 last four under 30.
He wanted us to go as long as we could but if we needed a longer break we get a set break of another 2min.
wrktngnr wrote:
Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
In HS I had similar PR's to you, 9:22 for Two-Mile, 4:26 and 2:05 for Mile/Half Mile. I could not break 60 in the 440.
***We (2 of us) did 32 X 220 Yards in 0:32 with 220 Yard jog in between. It made men out of us. Since you are doing 16, I would do them in 0:30-31. Jog the intervals. Being that you are a 2:00 guy, you should be able to do that IMHO. Not sure how much that will do for your 800 but it should be one of many pieces combining to lower that 1600 time.
30:45X-C1978 wrote:
wrktngnr wrote:
Let's say you have to run a workout of 16x200. For a miler with pbs of 4:30/2:00, how fast would you run this workout and with what rest? Why? This is in a week that also has a tempo and a race.
In HS I had similar PR's to you, 9:22 for Two-Mile, 4:26 and 2:05 for Mile/Half Mile. I could not break 60 in the 440.
***We (2 of us) did 32 X 220 Yards in 0:32 with 220 Yard jog in between. It made men out of us. Since you are doing 16, I would do them in 0:30-31. Jog the intervals. Being that you are a 2:00 guy, you should be able to do that IMHO. Not sure how much that will do for your 800 but it should be one of many pieces combining to lower that 1600 time.
31-32 seems more realistic. 30 seconds would mean 2 miles at 800 pace!