DUKE women at Raleigh

Sophia just wanted to party in college...check her social media. Can’t say exactly for the others...but most of them weren’t highly recruited by other coaches because we knew those women weren’t going to do much in college. So they went there because Duke offered them WAY more than anyone else. I wouldn’t blame Coach Riley in her 2nd year yet...

Duke has been an ongoing disaster for years. Or perhaps not if the athletes themselves are happy about the Duke program.

notrump wrote:

Duke has been an ongoing disaster for years. Or perhaps not if the athletes themselves are happy about the Duke program.

BUT WHY????? 3 different coaches in 5 years and the place sucks all talent out of people. What is it if it’s not the coach????

Billings was just as good if not better than Carrnahan in HS, and she just dropped a 15:4x 5k this weekend, it’s definitely the school wether coaching or the inviroment/culture, or maybe it’s both

Ik a few grammar errors above, it’s late and I’m tired...

But to the person saying three coaches in five years, the problem is they can’t get good coaches there so they keep bringing in what they can get aka not good... basically means there’s bad culture and nobody good will coach there or decent, so bad coaching will ruin the talent they have for the foreseeable future sadly. Honestly would do my best to convince anyone planning on going there not too.

Current coach was at vandy for years and did great, so it’s not true they can’t get good coaches. Plenty of coaches would jump at the chance to coach the women there.

What is it if it’s not the coach????

The coaching puts in a program and coordinates with a good medical team. But the real successful squads are going to have a good of 3 or so in each class that will be talented teammates and sort of demonstrate how things are done and what is expected. Call it strong peer pressure to succeed.

If you don't have it--a strong work ethic in teammates-- I don't care how good the coach is the team won't run to it's potential.

Tracktownpizza wrote:

Current coach was at vandy for years and did great, so it’s not true they can’t get good coaches. Plenty of coaches would jump at the chance to coach the women there.

I use good to general here, good to me is someone who makes their team better and a contender, id describe this coach as decent maybe but not anymore than that.

plenty of coaches would jump to coach there but not plenty of elite ones that can make a program great or vastly better then currently.

also looking more into it, their two head coaches for track are mainly eventers and hurdles, doesn't help distance runners much

their ladies xc coach is in season two now, she was that asst you mentioned at vandy, how much control she had their as an asst idk?

then the mens xc coach is a volunteer one.... his best achievement before joining duke was guiding a team to regional xc championship......

so they have ten "coaches" 8 are for sprints and events, other two arnt even full head coaches(one being a vol) and really don't have that much history other than the lady from Vandy somewhat.

While Carnahan and Billings may have performed at similar levels in HS, if one were to dig below the surface to training and lifestyle you would have seen an upside with SC and risk in LB.

That being said, I don't think it is LB or the coach at this point. There are just too many examples. There is something about Duke that chews up young fast high achieving type A girls and spits out slower versions of themselves. As a coach I would strongly discourage any young woman from attending Duke let alone running there.

HS regional xc championship in Kentucky* to clarify

Well, in Duke's defense. Wilbur is from a hammer now kind of team, that program is pretty hard on kids, not much left in the tank after that.

Duke coach is one heck of a recruiter though. Nice freshman class coming in. Have to say Vandy hasn't gotten much since she has left. She seems to be sucking the talent away from them. Now what happens once they are there, not so sure. That's the problem with recruiting all stars rather then focusing on making them. "nothing left in the tank" was spot on.

ficustree wrote:

While Carnahan and Billings may have performed at similar levels in HS, if one were to dig below the surface to training and lifestyle you would have seen an upside with SC and risk in LB.

That being said, I don't think it is LB or the coach at this point. There are just too many examples. There is something about Duke that chews up young fast high achieving type A girls and spits out slower versions of themselves. As a coach I would strongly discourage any young woman from attending Duke let alone running there.

You would strongly discourage them from attending a top ten university? Awfully short sighted there.

Not sure what you’re looking at. Head track coach is men’s distance coach and has been there for years. My understanding is that the men’s side isn’t fully funded, with resources going to other events in track. Some of the younger distance guys are pretty good and have shown improvement, but it’s a young team. I think people need to give the women’s coach a few years. There aren’t any senior women on the roster, which is a sign of what she inherited. I don’t know that I’d draw conclusions this early in a season anyway.

reelemin wrote:

Duke coach is one heck of a recruiter though. Nice freshman class coming in. Have to say Vandy hasn't gotten much since she has left. She seems to be sucking the talent away from them. Now what happens once they are there, not so sure. That's the problem with recruiting all stars rather then focusing on making them. "nothing left in the tank" was spot on.

Recruiting "talent" has never been the issue...it's what kind of talent. We've had a joke for a long time when we stop recruiting a crazy kid (yes, often Type A/OCD/borderline personality disorder) who expects a big scholarship..."Welp, she's nuts - send her to Duke!" And they actually do end up at Duke often enough ha! And yes, they often don't have much left in the tank...exhibit 1A from this year's recruiting class: Rylee Bowen -

. Check out that progression...or lack there of. But this happens everywhere to be fair (you have to recruit these all starts to some extent)...and to be fair to the current coach, it sounds like she took over an ESPECIALLY toxic team environment almost two years ago...

It would be nice if more coaches looked at progression. My daughter has improved 8-10 seconds every year since the 7th grade in the 1500/1600/mile events. Her coach intentionally didn't hammer her so she wouldn't burn out and would show consistent improvement. She broke a 5 minute mile equivalent in all but two of her first races her Junior spring season. So shes a solid performer with consistent growth. Duke would not write her back. Another mid-west distance team only offered books. She ended up at a good program so all is good. But frustrating that these two schools only cared about footlocker and nike.

There is not one reason to recruit Carnahan over Billings their Senior years both from Georgia together. Not cross country or track. Billings was the #1 recruit in state by far.

To chalk up all these great recruits as “crazy” and therefore can’t even match high school doesn’t explain how successful Jermyn was there!

Eating disorders and other issues were rampant on the team when Jermyn was there, despite some good results.

Agree on Billings being a better choice out of high school. Not sure what the lifestyle stuff under the surface would have been. I can say that both were well liked in the high school XC and track community in Georgia.

As to the best recruit, Emma Grace Hurley came out of Georgia that year with better PRs and consistently beat both Billings and Carnahan head to head.