Jewbacca, do you vary the volume of your weeks based on the percentages recommended by Daniels?
Jewbacca, do you vary the volume of your weeks based on the percentages recommended by Daniels?
Well, officially official I guess. Paid my marathon fees for next Saturday. Game on. Last year's winner seemed to have signed up as well (2:54) and if it goes the way last year went, second place was 3:03, which means I may be in no man's land for most of the race... unless I go with last year's winner.
Obviously, I hope there's a bunch of us with the same goals...
paulc wrote:
Jewbacca, do you vary the volume of your weeks based on the percentages recommended by Daniels?
I honestly haven't paid attention to them, but I think what I'm doing isn't far off. I took a down week after Houston and then had 14 weeks to my goal marathon. They've looked like this (my %'s are really easy because I'm using 100 miles as a max week):
76%
82%
90%
97%
95%
58% (HM race)
81% (2 days off for recovery)
101% will be this week
Then looking forward, my plan is:
100%
80% (10k race)
100%
90%
80%
60% (goal marathon)
Jeremy R wrote:
Well, officially official I guess. Paid my marathon fees for next Saturday. Game on. Last year's winner seemed to have signed up as well (2:54) and if it goes the way last year went, second place was 3:03, which means I may be in no man's land for most of the race... unless I go with last year's winner.
Obviously, I hope there's a bunch of us with the same goals...
Ooh, this is exciting. Do you have any idea how fit last year's winner currently is? And was that a super strong race for him, or an easy win?
If things get going quick in the early miles, you obviously don't want to get sucked a long. But your hard long runs show you are very fit right now. I know you're shooting for sub-3, but some of your runs indicate low 2:50s. Maybe. If they go out in mid to low 6:40s, I might be tempted to roll with them if I were in your shoes.
Oh yeah I would go for the W! Gamble and go
OR - Just wanted to chime in with positive thoughts for your marathon this weekend. So looking forward to seeing how well you do. The weather forecast looks pretty good - partly sunny, upper 30s, right? NNE breeze at 9 mph, which isn't too bad ... tailwind for a few early miles, then mostly crosswinds. With luck, a few 2:45ish guys will show up this year, and you will be able to run alongside or tuck behind a group. In my part of the world, any breeze less than 15 mph is considered "calm," so all should be good in any case. Especially given your strength. Enjoy your success. All those fast-paced hilly runs will pay off for sure!
LMAO maybe just do a Rupp and run on the leaders heels. Then just use your speed at the end.
@ consistency- It does sound exciting, however, I've never run a marathon before, so I'm a little scared of the end. Going out at 6:40 is pretty "easy" but unlike a 5K where if you blow up, you would only be at mile 1.5. Here though, it would be like mile 18... I have no idea who this guy is, and I tried to find his Strava and other results on Athlinks, but no luck. I'm probably gonna just go out by feel (short warm up) so the first two miles might be 7+ min. It does seem fun
@ RRR- I want to, but I also don't want to die. If I F this up, I won't have another shot at a BQ until December (planning on a more "real" marathon buildup, not this 6 week thing I just did haha
@ Pappy- If you ain't scrapin' you ain't racin'!
Go get’em OR. Looks like near perfect weather and a fast course. I’m calling 2:48:30. My only advice, and with the marathon this cannot be said enough: DON’T GO OUT TOO FAST.
Piling on to wish OR and Jeremy good luck this weekend!
OR - good luck and have fun. I agree with AJ's advice, although I don't worry about you in that regard given your propensity for 2nd half, downhill style running.
Jeremy - I will save my good luck wishes for you until next week - that's when your race is, right?
...and let's not leave out the well wishes for Coach Jeff.
Pappy wrote:
LMAO maybe just do a Rupp and run on the leaders heels. Then just use your speed at the end.
Pappy- When someone cruises in my wake racing and doesnt come alongside I start with the snot rockets.. Let em catch the shrapnel
Coach is racing this weekend! I thought it was next... good luck!! Be sure and carb load ..
Jeremy - Your marathon is NEXT Saturday, right? So you've got a nice taper week ahead?
I'm a proponent of starting conservatively in a marathon, but if the choice is between running solo in no-man's-land or staying with a runner who might be just barely faster than your planned pace, I would be inclined to choose the latter. I've had a couple of breakout races doing that, but it's scary and risky. Tough call. Especially in a marathon.
Researching potential competitors reminds me of a half marathon last year. I saw one tough local M55-59 competitor in the previous year's results. I also saw that he ran pretty significant positive splits in that race and others I checked. So on race day, I wasn't too concerned when he immediately opened a huge lead on me.
I finally caught him at 10K, but just at that point, intestinal issues forced a 52-second pit stop. It took ANOTHER six miles to catch him again. I was really hurting by that point, and considered slowing down and running with him -- hoping to outkick at the finish. Instead, I made the tougher but correct decision to pick up the pace as I passed, and he didn't challenge.
Anyway, I digress .... Best wishes next Saturday. Your fitness is definitely there. Stay positive and confident. This could be a good race! Racing is always more fun than chasing time goals.
I just did an interesting experiment where I charted out the Daniels' Elite marathon plan in 3 week cycles. Although the workouts are monsters, there is a subtlety there that I never noticed that might be optimum for Daniels' followers.
There are more or less three week cycles where Q 1 rotates between Marathon pace work, Long/Tempo/Long, and regular long runs. For Q2 workouts, it alternates between speed, threshold repeats, and longer tempo efforts closer to MP.
Maybe for those following Daniels', looking at that structure with more "plan A" type workouts can keep things more evenly mixed and well rounded instead of 12 weeks of basically T running.
Attempting the elite plan is inconceivable to me. I know that is not what you are saying to do, but I just wanted to note it - the plan seems nearly impossible to me.
Training Plan A actually follows a 3 week rhythm too, notwithstanding the 6 week phases. Every 3 weeks or so, you end up with a peak volume week which is also a one workout week. Every three weeks or so you end up with your long marathon paced run. Etc.
Smoove, I think the 3 week rhythm of a longer tempo and also some work touching on speed makes a lot of sense in the structure.
Not at all doing the workouts verbatim, but the structure I think is sound.
I just confirmed - he does indeed set up his weeks as cycles of straight long run, tempo-long-tempo, marathon pace (not sure if that is the order, but that's immaterial).
While I do not feel at all compelled to specifically schedule in faster vo2max style work into my plan, I think that is in part because I know that I will usually do a touch of speed maintenance throughout the cycle by way of shorter races. So I don't schedule I pace workouts, but I get in 5k, 4 mile and 10k races during the last 12 weeks of a spring cycle, and usually two 5ks and maybe one 5 miler during a fall cycle.
I definitely think that the vo2max work would be even more important if I were actually racing for position rather than racing for my best time outcome (even though I tend to be competitive for position in the masters category, the practical reality is that I am rarely actually racing another masters runner head to head, particularly in a marathon. Instead, we are all usually just running our own independent races and seeing who ended up running the fastest.)
Smoove - You mean needing the v02 work to cover surges and surge? Makes sense.. thats what killed me the last 2 miles of that 10k.. covering 7-8 surges by a guy and not having that faster work under my belt.. Def could have ran faster at an even pace.