Anyone know how drop in weight translates into speed gain?

Loren Seagrave addressed this at this years World Championships Conference. He said for every extra kilo of bodyweight you carry you have to produce 2 more kilos of force.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jdogfhrl0Bs&t=212s

If you have weight to lose, losing it will improve your performance. If you happen to lose weight while training without trying to hard to soley drop pounds, that's great. But you need to fund your research. You need to have energy to train, and can't worry about it.

So at a point, losing a lot of weight will yield diminishing returns. It might work for a while, but it is not sustainable. The shelf life for athletes making it on under-fueled training seems to be about 6-18 months. That's the lifespan before they get injured or damage themself with something like overtraining syndrome.

Training for performance and training to lose weight are two completely different things. I think trying to do both requires a lot of attention to detail that is not worth the effort or stress of most people.

Great topic. I started counting calories and lost around 10 pounds. I quickly saw gains in training and started running PRs in training. I was indestructible for a while, doing 3200x2 in 9:25-29. Ran a marathon PR easy. It came at a great cost.

That training cycle wasn't all easy. I would binge at times on foods that I cut out of my diet, then feel demoralized and bloated. My mood would swing all the time. I am pretty sure it accelerated the death of my marriage. The next season I maintained and ran about at the same level. The next season it was a stress fracture. I kept trying to repeat my first season success. My neuroticism increased, I isolated myself because I was obsessed with food. Training became about earning my meals so I could drop more weight which I thought would automatically entitle me to linear gains in performance. Every run was becoming dreadful, but when I thought about food that was motivating enough. The scale became my race course, and I always had to be "on". It was exhausting, and I ended up going from 156 to around 140. I chewed a pack of gum per day and drank a shitload of water. I'll never forget when I was visiting friends at home my old assistant cross country coach made a parting comment about how I was too thin. Everybody heard it but nobody said anything. I was justifying it for performance reasons, so it was ok to do, right?

At times these binges would get so bad I could put down so much junk food I would end up being 10 pounds heavier on the scale the following day with all the water, carbs, and salt. I started trying to throw it up at times, and I remember thinking in that moment as I was sitting on the floor of the bathroom near this nasty toilet how I got to this place. I trudged through my last marathon in my worst performance to date by far. I never set a single PR with the exception of that first marathon. In fact, I was not even close. My Garmin watch said I was in 2:17 shape though, are those things even close to accurate?

I quit running for months, and I ballooned to nearly 180. Eventually my appetite waned and I went down to 160 just eating when I was hungry and deleting Myfitnesspal. No more calorie counting for me. It was liberating. I went through a personally rough season in my life shortly after, without a doubt the worst "season" of my entire life. Thank goodness I did not have to face my disordered eating during this time, but then again I wasn't running so I was coping very poorly.

I started running again after hitting rock bottom, and I try to pay attention to my hunger cues and not deprive myself. I kept to 40-50 miles per week and trained for the shorter stuff. Had my best season to date, but I'll never return to what I was, and that is okay. I had my time in the sun and that time has likely come and gone. What I will say is that the neuroticism of runners combined with losing weight and dieting can be extremely dangerous. You won't realize you are on the crazy ride of disordered eating until you have been riding it for awhile. It is very hard to get off that ride, many never recover.

I encourage you to train smart, hard if you can. Try to be mindful about what you are eating but know that the scale doesn't automatically translate to better performance. It can be very dangerous.

easy. Newton's 4th law. less weight = less friction. less friction = faster times.

Do you need E = MC *2 explained?

If you are running the 100m, what weight/resistance training are you doing? You should focus on converting fat into muscle (essentially). It's all about lean muscle mass. Eat healthy, whole, unprocessed foods (no grains or sugars) with healthy mono- and saturated fats ( avoid polyunsaturates like seed oils)and the fat will melt away. Don't count calories or obsess with the scale. If you measure something, make it your waistline.

here's the thing wrote:

If you have weight to lose, losing it will improve your performance. If you happen to lose weight while training without trying to hard to soley drop pounds, that's great. But you need to fund your research. You need to have energy to train, and can't worry about it.

So at a point, losing a lot of weight will yield diminishing returns. It might work for a while, but it is not sustainable. The shelf life for athletes making it on under-fueled training seems to be about 6-18 months. That's the lifespan before they get injured or damage themself with something like overtraining syndrome.

Training for performance and training to lose weight are two completely different things. I think trying to do both requires a lot of attention to detail that is not worth the effort or stress of most people.

Thanks for the warning. I totally understand that. I said in my post that my ideal weight is 155 lbs. I'm not planning on dropping below my ideal weight to improve performance. I'm not training to lose weight. I've taken the sensible approach of cutting out most of the refined carbs, especially sugar. When I eliminated dairy consumption earlier this year my weight quickly dropped from 172 to 165 and I felt I was losing weight a little too fast so I went back to eating dairy products. By the way, some of the top sprinters are now avoiding dairy products. I've been told that Rana Reider's group (Dafne Shippers) doesn't consume any dairy products. I also recall a thread on this site where someone mentioned the Ole' Miss runners are on a dairy-free diet.

Sprinthard, thanks for the link to that Seagrave video!

Thanks for sharing your experience. Your story is of great benefit to all and the younger runners in particular should read your post. There have been a number of discussions on this site about certain young college distance runners who went down the path you describe. I was also a training animal back in the day when that was common but I ate like a horse and still stayed thin. Having a naturally high metabolism helps and I think a lot of runners have naturally high metabolisms. I use to eat a gallon of ice cream almost everyday. I remember reading back then that Arthur Lydiard would consume huge amounts of ice cream when he was running high mileage. Apparently Lydiard basically lived on ice cream.

I'm not a calorie counter nor a scale watcher. I do use the scale after rising in the morning, as another source of biofeedback. Most people's weight varies a few pounds a day, I've heard up to 5 lbs/day, so I don't stress out about weight but do keep an eye on it.

nice you've definitely done a lot of background work on this!

Couldn't agree with the points on dairy and sugar more. sugary drinks are the devil, and after you back off from dairy for a while and really think about the fact that it's all just animal secretions it kind of makes you not want to eat it anyway.

Lol my BMI has been 18.6 last 3 years I'm 31 I eat high carb low fat vegan like 4-5000 cals a day all the sugar I want I calorie count to make sure I get enough but now I just feast everyday I eat like Ryan hall sweet potatoes

I am built at the same height and weight and honestly, a weight drop may or may not make a difference. A few years ago in training, I was able to do a 14.19 100m. At that time, I was at about 175 pounds. I fluctuate between 168-173, usually being about 171 during races... I still cannot hit the 14.19 even if every distance from 5k to marathon is quicker. I would gather that improving your 800 and 400 times will eventually translate to a faster 200. Then, improving the 200 itself will create a faster 100. I have said this in other threads that while a weight drop may help, gait switch or better efficiency may be more useful. Also keep in mind that some 260 lb linebackers can do a 40 yard in 4.6. That would be about a 12.50-13.00 100 at my estimate. Some of them are carrying extra weight.

Overweight guy wrote:

I'm an older guy, 5'8" 171 lbs with an ideal body weight (for me) of 155 lbs so I'm carrying around 15 pounds of fat, mostly around the stomach and a little on the inner thighs and upper arms. Recently ran 14.22 FAT 100m. Just starting to work out again after 7 month layoff. The weight is starting to come off again (was down to 165 in April, was at 180 in January) due to positive changes in diet and burning calories from working out again. My plan is to lose the fat gradually through workouts and sticking to a healthy diet.

Does anyone here have an opinion on how losing 15 pounds may translate into running faster over 100m? I'm guessing even a 10 pound drop should make some difference. Of course training is the most important component but the weight loss puts the laws of physics more in one's favor.

Thanks!

HCLFV999 wrote:

Lol my BMI has been 18.6 last 3 years I'm 31 I eat high carb low fat vegan like 4-5000 cals a day all the sugar I want I calorie count to make sure I get enough but now I just feast everyday I eat like Ryan hall sweet potatoes

Well, it certainly has paid off for your grammar and punctuation, Cletus!