This weekend it's going down!! Rematch of the Hawks vs Miller duel from last winter.
Predictions? Rumor is that Max has been sick. Any word on Zach's training since UTMB? Is he healthy?
Refresher:
This weekend it's going down!! Rematch of the Hawks vs Miller duel from last winter.
Predictions? Rumor is that Max has been sick. Any word on Zach's training since UTMB? Is he healthy?
Refresher:
Hawks by a landslide.
Just excited to see these fireworks. These are the kind of races where I'm not really into who wins. I just want to see some big running. And these guys always provide awesome races to follow. Super excited about it.
A lot going into this race - very curious to see how it shakes out. Biggest questions:
-How fit/healthy is Zach? Can he rekindle the magic from the past two years? It's most likely going to take another CR to win
-How fit is Hayden? He keeps saying he's feeling good. The version of Hayden from CCC most likely can't be beat by this lineup
-Max King - Will it be sloppy? This might help his case. Is he sick? Would be game over if so
-Tim Freriks - R2R2R FKT (Wallmsley's no less) and a big win at Transvulcania earlier in the spring show he has a good, high ceiling. But, is his good day as good as Hayden's or the other two on a good day? Not sure if I believe it.
-Others - There's always the random guy that is just breaking onto the scene and dudes like Tayte could have something to say on a runnable course like this.
Regardless, should be a show for sure!! Very excited
Amongst runners, I think I’m not unique in being as or more jazzed about the TNF 50 as I am about NCAA XC this weekend.
High quality trail ultras are a ton of fun to follow and coverage is often better than road, track, or XC racing.
jjdjjdj wrote:
-How fit/healthy is Zach? Can he rekindle the magic from the past two years? It's most likely going to take another CR to win
-How fit is Hayden? He keeps saying he's feeling good. The version of Hayden from CCC most likely can't be beat by this lineup
-Max King - Will it be sloppy? This might help his case. Is he sick? Would be game over if so
-Tim Freriks - R2R2R FKT (Wallmsley's no less) and a big win at Transvulcania earlier in the spring show he has a good, high ceiling. But, is his good day as good as Hayden's or the other two on a good day? Not sure if I believe it.
-Others - There's always the random guy that is just breaking onto the scene and dudes like Tayte could have something to say on a runnable course like this.
I can't believe you forgot to mention ME!
But seriously, I will be asking volunteers at aid station who is leading.
I've gotta go with Hayden this time around. His buildup appears to be a perfectly gradual buildup peaking at 150 mpw. If everybody ran their best, I think he would come out on top. However, times aren't going to be even close to last year. The course is over a mile longer this year and there's about 1000ft of additional vert. That's gotta be about ten minutes slower with all else equal. As for Max King, has he ever been dominant over 50 miles? Seems kinda long for him unless this was a road 50 miler.
This reed guy doesn't know who Max King is, huh? Dude is 100km world champ and has placed top 3 against the likes of Killian and Francois in some of the world's nastiest most technical races in Europe. That being said, I still pick Hawks.
I'm assuming 'this reed guy' is Cody Reed. Who I heard wasn't racing?!
Hawks vs Frieriks is the most logical battle. To me it seems like Zach is being mildly pushed into racing since he's a new TNF runner and it's a TNF race. That's if Max King isn't on top form. But yeah, Hawks has to be the favourite.
I dont think Max placing top 3 meant much at Sierre Zinal. Weather was perfect this year for that course. He ran 2:34 which is 2 mins slower than your other American Joe Gray on a much sloppier day. However, with the course lacking any super long steep ascents Max could hang in there, but i think Hayden blows up honestly and I'm gonna go with a darkhorse coming from behind. Seems Zach is not fit and also Tim Freriks win at transvulcania was overrated because nobody actually showed up this year. I'm a slow old guy and I placed pretty well this year there so that should give you some insite!
Max king top 3 places in both Sierre Zinal and Marathon du Mont-Blanc were actually impressive considering the competition! Did you check the field?? He beat some serious competition in Switzerland!
That may be true but not 100 percent true. Many of the guys in those races were not running well and havent been for quite some time. Its sorta like beating someone who has been injured and or sick for long period, you get a pat on the back and not really respect. At sierre zinal the field was actually thin from a professional perspective. The favorite, Mamu from Eritrea was fresh off of 2 world championship races just 1 week before so he was not a factor on race day, simpson had been injured all summer and winter, the rest were guys who are not capable of breaking 2:34 on that course so Max simply had to run average for a pro athlete to finish podium. In years prior he would not have been top 3. He lost to kilian on a great weather day for this course with a slow winning time. In the days of Marco and Jono, a 2:34 would never win, simply too slow! The race was not at a high level this year. I have heard next year it will be fast as many top athletes have already declared they will come! Hoping for a showdown of the Americans Joe Gray, Max King up against top euros Simpson, Kilian and perhaps Pupi. 2018 would be safe bet that fast times will come but i dont think record
HHH Runner wrote:
I'm assuming 'this reed guy' is Cody Reed. Who I heard wasn't racing?!
This reed guy is Reed Breuer. Go Reed!
I think he knows who Max is, but perhaps doubted his dominance on this kind of course.
Has a Euro other than a Spaniard won this race?
Max was also 5th at Glen Coe Skyrace a couple months ago, nice and technical 50k (maybe 55?) with lots of vert. Anyway, still not sure he can take down this field but should be exciting.
And not sure who posted it, but Freriks got the R2R record, not R2R2R. Regardless guy is fit.
my money is on Krupicka
Having raced all these guys and run all these courses mentioned I'll say this: Max is someone I greatly respect for #AnySurfaceAnyDistance . He can pop a 2:14 marathon and OTQ and he can place top 10 at Comrades and win 100km world road champs (look out if he ever runs a 50-miler on a track!). He also ran really well at Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal (compared to what he's done in the past there)....he has really improved his climbing this year! However, we must remember that Chuckanut ,Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal are only 32km-50km races. Duration is a bit shorter compared to a 6 hour race. Historically Max has struggled to get top 10 at TNF50 in SF....and even at Lake Sonoma 50 has never been better than 3rd. I think he can win, but we must remember at 50-miler with 11,000' of climbing is a very different kind of race. It is exactly what makes Zach Miller so dangerous there. Hawks has done workouts like 4 x 5km in 15:37 ave. with a 2-min rest....while running 120-150 miles per week on mostly trails and topping 20,000' of climbing some weeks. He also has the "long ultra" experience of going around 12 hours at CCC and the "long climbing" ability from races like Speedgoat. I'd say look out! Best of luck to all the runners out there! I really hope the traffic on the Golden Gate Bridge doesn't mess up the race!
Euro legenz wrote:
That may be true but not 100 percent true. Many of the guys in those races were not running well and havent been for quite some time. Its sorta like beating someone who has been injured and or sick for long period, you get a pat on the back and not really respect. At sierre zinal the field was actually thin from a professional perspective. The favorite, Mamu from Eritrea was fresh off of 2 world championship races just 1 week before so he was not a factor on race day, simpson had been injured all summer and winter, the rest were guys who are not capable of breaking 2:34 on that course so Max simply had to run average for a pro athlete to finish podium. In years prior he would not have been top 3. He lost to kilian on a great weather day for this course with a slow winning time. In the days of Marco and Jono, a 2:34 would never win, simply too slow! The race was not at a high level this year. I have heard next year it will be fast as many top athletes have already declared they will come! Hoping for a showdown of the Americans Joe Gray, Max King up against top euros Simpson, Kilian and perhaps Pupi. 2018 would be safe bet that fast times will come but i dont think record
Idk if Zach takes the 3 peat, I'd love to see it, just don't know if his body is ready. I am calling OG Max King for the surprise victory. Hawks has younger legs and riding a lot of momentum the past few months, but something tells me Max King takes it. Can't wait to see what a refreshed Mocko does on his home turf. All the best to ya in 2018 Sage, hoping you nail that OTQ at Houston.
S. Canaday wrote:
Having raced all these guys and run all these courses mentioned I'll say this:
Max is someone I greatly respect for #AnySurfaceAnyDistance . He can pop a 2:14 marathon and OTQ and he can place top 10 at Comrades and win 100km world road champs (look out if he ever runs a 50-miler on a track!). He also ran really well at Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal (compared to what he's done in the past there)....he has really improved his climbing this year!
However, we must remember that Chuckanut ,Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal are only 32km-50km races. Duration is a bit shorter compared to a 6 hour race. Historically Max has struggled to get top 10 at TNF50 in SF....and even at Lake Sonoma 50 has never been better than 3rd. I think he can win, but we must remember at 50-miler with 11,000' of climbing is a very different kind of race. It is exactly what makes Zach Miller so dangerous there.
Hawks has done workouts like 4 x 5km in 15:37 ave. with a 2-min rest....while running 120-150 miles per week on mostly trails and topping 20,000' of climbing some weeks. He also has the "long ultra" experience of going around 12 hours at CCC and the "long climbing" ability from races like Speedgoat. I'd say look out!
Best of luck to all the runners out there! I really hope the traffic on the Golden Gate Bridge doesn't mess up the race!
Euro legenz wrote:
That may be true but not 100 percent true. Many of the guys in those races were not running well and havent been for quite some time. Its sorta like beating someone who has been injured and or sick for long period, you get a pat on the back and not really respect. At sierre zinal the field was actually thin from a professional perspective. The favorite, Mamu from Eritrea was fresh off of 2 world championship races just 1 week before so he was not a factor on race day, simpson had been injured all summer and winter, the rest were guys who are not capable of breaking 2:34 on that course so Max simply had to run average for a pro athlete to finish podium. In years prior he would not have been top 3. He lost to kilian on a great weather day for this course with a slow winning time. In the days of Marco and Jono, a 2:34 would never win, simply too slow! The race was not at a high level this year. I have heard next year it will be fast as many top athletes have already declared they will come! Hoping for a showdown of the Americans Joe Gray, Max King up against top euros Simpson, Kilian and perhaps Pupi. 2018 would be safe bet that fast times will come but i dont think record
Hey thanks - it's been hard to get the "marathon speed" back (at least for me). For sure missing out on a lot of pain this weekend out in Marin! Another reason why I respect Max King so much: he'll do the short and fast stuff, XC, and the SkyRunning stuff and longer mountain races....and do pretty darn well at all of them! He's not afraid to mix it up. I think he can win still, but if i were a betting man I'd put my money on Hayden. Also, I don't know all the course changes and how the new route/weather/conditions of the trails will play out so that certainly could be a big factor. I've seen people get lost out there and the crowds/traffic can certainly be an issue. It is very likely Zach will take it out with a slew of sub 7-min miles for the first half though....(even on the uphills). I think his front running "strategy" is his best strategy....always. A 3-peat at TNF50 would be legendary! Heck to win twice there deserves some serious credit! This race can "make an ultra career" and the $10,000 for 1st place also doesn't hurt. The women's field/race is also too close to call with Ida, Howe, and Kimmel (to name a few!). Usually someone wins by 2-10min at least though.
King for the win? wrote:
Idk if Zach takes the 3 peat, I'd love to see it, just don't know if his body is ready. I am calling OG Max King for the surprise victory. Hawks has younger legs and riding a lot of momentum the past few months, but something tells me Max King takes it. Can't wait to see what a refreshed Mocko does on his home turf. All the best to ya in 2018 Sage, hoping you nail that OTQ at Houston.
S. Canaday wrote:
Having raced all these guys and run all these courses mentioned I'll say this:
Max is someone I greatly respect for #AnySurfaceAnyDistance . He can pop a 2:14 marathon and OTQ and he can place top 10 at Comrades and win 100km world road champs (look out if he ever runs a 50-miler on a track!). He also ran really well at Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal (compared to what he's done in the past there)....he has really improved his climbing this year!
However, we must remember that Chuckanut ,Mont-Blanc and Sierre-Zinal are only 32km-50km races. Duration is a bit shorter compared to a 6 hour race. Historically Max has struggled to get top 10 at TNF50 in SF....and even at Lake Sonoma 50 has never been better than 3rd. I think he can win, but we must remember at 50-miler with 11,000' of climbing is a very different kind of race. It is exactly what makes Zach Miller so dangerous there.
Hawks has done workouts like 4 x 5km in 15:37 ave. with a 2-min rest....while running 120-150 miles per week on mostly trails and topping 20,000' of climbing some weeks. He also has the "long ultra" experience of going around 12 hours at CCC and the "long climbing" ability from races like Speedgoat. I'd say look out!
Best of luck to all the runners out there! I really hope the traffic on the Golden Gate Bridge doesn't mess up the race!
In case you guys didnt know, there is also a race this weekend with some actual elite runners in it. Unfortunately, it is streaming only on flotrack, but you shouod be able to follow along via live tweets, etc.
Through the second aid station (Tennessee Valley) looks like there's only 3 guys willing to go out: Miller, Hawks, and Freriks... Max sicker than he seemed?
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
Move over Mark Coogan, Rojo and John Kellogg share their 3 favorite mile workouts
Mark Coogan says that if you could only do 3 workouts as a 1500m runner you should do these
Red Bull (who sponsors Mondo) calls Mondo the pole vaulting Usain Bolt. Is that a fair comparison?