Notre Dame

Great Lakes Regional wrote:

Oh and my Niece who is a HS Junior who is being recruited by nearly every school in the country and will probably run sub 10 minutes for 3200 has ZERO interest in ND. My brother was so pissed at my daughters treatment that ND is off limits.

That is awesome!!!!! Send that girl to Michigan.

Oh and congrats to your daughter. I just got super excited about your niece and was incredibly impressed with your brothers sense of family loyalty. Very cool story.

Great Lakes Regional wrote:

My daughter wanted to go to ND since she was 5 years old. She was okay but no super star in HS. She ran 11:01 for 3200 and asked to be a walk on. She was admitted to the school but told that she wasn't good enough to walk on.

She walked on to another school in the Region and has had the opportunity to run against ND for 4 years. She would have been a scorer for ND every year at the Regional Meet and as high as their 3 girl on 2 different years.

I have since heard similar stories from several others. I enjoy watching ND struggle with lack of depth.

So because a competitive D1 program didn't let you're mediocre daughter on the team and then she did well elsewhere, that makes Notre Dame wrong for not picking up a mediocre runner? Runners who weren't good in high school do great things in college all the time, but that doesn't mean good programs should take in every crap high school runner that wants to walk on when there are better athletes the program can get, not to mention roster limits. You do a great job of hiding how bitter you are. Its ok to be jealous of Notre Dame. Too bad your daughter doesn't have a degree from there.

I am a Division I collegiate coach. Let me say there is NO program in the country that wouldn't let a 11:01 3200 meter girl walk on. I have been around this game a long, long time, and know exactly what everyone allows on their team. Notre Dame could never in its history pass over a 11:01 walk-on. Doesn't mean the kid will travel, doesn't mean they will ever earn a scholarship. But walk-on.....be real. The reason they are doing so now is arrogance. And isn't it interesting that Joe Piane retires after keeping the program in the national spotlight for decades, and their program goes backward. I guess experience does matter.

This dad's story would coincide with the period in time where the ND coaches cut half the existing team.

Going with a lean and mean roster probably sounded like a good idea at the time, but 3-4 years later they have no depth. After a good 2-3 year run with the women, neither team and no individuals at NCAAs.

Yes the loss of Joe is the ticket. His experience was golden but he was both women coach and head of track and field. As others noted the head now is a sprinter. He’s sucked the resources and destroyed any chance of depth. Just FYI coach D 1. they rejected my kid too and she was even faster. New head just won’t fund anyone who isn’t a national finalist and wants a lean team. Comes at a very sad price as this WAS one of my favorite programs. The girls are still amazing ladies, there just aren’t enough. Now they will just have to watch NCAAs on Flo.

Makes sense wrote:

This dad's story would coincide with the period in time where the ND coaches cut half the existing team.

How did you come to that conclusion? The “dad” gave no timeline.

Great Lakes Regional wrote:

My daughter wanted to go to ND since she was 5 years old. She was okay but no super star in HS. She ran 11:01 for 3200 and asked to be a walk on. She was admitted to the school but told that she wasn't good enough to walk on.

She walked on to another school in the Region and has had the opportunity to run against ND for 4 years. She would have been a scorer for ND every year at the Regional Meet and as high as their 3 girl on 2 different years.

I have since heard similar stories from several others. I enjoy watching ND struggle with lack of depth.

We turn down 11:01 kids all the time & we are at NCAA’s this week & only improving...I suppose in rural backwater no where 11:01 isn’t bad...but most 11:01 kids never amount to anything. Glad yours did...but every coach knows that if you add too many hobby jogger women, you end up with a sorority. No way they could justify taking the time trying to find out. Boo hoo hoo dad. Ever think that experience helped shape who she was at the other program & she wouldn’t have been so determined otherwise? But for the record, Alan Turner is indeed in over his head & doesn’t know what he’s doing...

Great Lakes Regional wrote:

My daughter wanted to go to ND since she was 5 years old.

This is why people hate ND. The unfailing attention it gets from whole families for no good reason. (I recognize that "unfailing" doesn't apply to you and your family after ND made a poor decision with your daughter. Kudos to you!)

Great Lakes Regional wrote:

My daughter wanted to go to ND since she was 5 years old. She was okay but no super star in HS. She ran 11:01 for 3200 and asked to be a walk on. She was admitted to the school but told that she wasn't good enough to walk on.

She walked on to another school in the Region and has had the opportunity to run against ND for 4 years. She would have been a scorer for ND every year at the Regional Meet and as high as their 3 girl on 2 different years.

I have since heard similar stories from several others. I enjoy watching ND struggle with lack of depth.

Quite frankly, this sounds exactly like the type of arrogance that ND is known for. I’ve known many people that have similar experiences with Notre Dame in areas not related to cross country.

Families develop an obsession with Notre Dame (mine included), but the reality doesn’t match the hype.

I'm saddened to hear some bad experiences from recruits on here. I walked on at Notre Dame and frankly they had no business letting me on the team. I loved my time there. Some coaches were good, some weren't, but overall it was a very rewarding experience. Was under a different coaching era than the current staff, though.

Anyway, happy to see how the guy's team develops over the next few years. Go Irish

You're either a liar or a terrible coach - I'll go with liar. If you'd like to prove otherwise, please post your school's name and I will look through each girl's HS PR's to see the type of talent you are recruiting. You won't though... because you're a liar.

I know multiple 10:5x-11:0x girls who got full ride scholarships to multiple D1 programs; to say they wouldn't be a worthy walk-on is idiotic. Heck, 11:01 will put you in the top 10-15 girls at just about any HS state meet. What coach turns down top 10-15 talent?

More so, any high school girl running 11:01 is not a 'hobby jogger'; it takes tons of talent and hard work to run that type of time in HS - once again proving you don't know a thing about running.

Everyone wants to hate wrote:

Makes sense wrote:

This dad's story would coincide with the period in time where the ND coaches cut half the existing team.

How did you come to that conclusion? The “dad” gave no timeline.

He said his daughter "has had the opportunity to run against them for four years. "

I took that to mean she was currently a senior.

You'd be surprised who I am. And if I hadn't said Alan Turner doesn't know what he's doing, I'd be happy to name myself & school lol. Come to think of it, I can't think of a single woman on our roster of about 20 that ran slower than about 10:30/4:55/2:11 in her primary event in high school...would we love more 10:4x/4:5x-high/2:12-ish women? Sure! But we sure as hell aren't giving them any scholarship...and when the little schools or distance only schools are being very generous with that caliber of woman (as you mentioned) and we aren't...we're generally not getting women that slow. I'll tell ya what though...I'm probably talking to that other guy's niece who "may break 10:00" if she's really that good. Now I'm aware some big programs have been forced to keep rosters of 30 - 40 women (Like Minnesota or Florida State) by their administration - often in order to keep 15 - 20 men around. Especially since you can count 'em 3x for Title IX reasons. So of course you let an 11:01 woman show up in that case - give her a pair of shoes & a t-shirt & meet the "gear girls" squad once a week for "practice" (maybe send a volunteer or GA with them to their one meet a season) & voila...you have yourself 60 more women for the athletic department! Yes, every once in a while one of them becomes something...I'm sure you can find examples. But that's going to ignore the hundreds more that just turned it into a social club when they realized how far off the top they are.

For the record, Matt Sparks is a good coach who knows what he's doing & Sean Carlson is a good recruiter who's learning & I wish them both the best because they're good people who do it right. Their hands are just tied in certain ways...and don't need more butt hurt dads with princess daughters tearing them down. Maybe they saw that 11:01 girl was a short heel striker with a big mom shaped like a pear and she was ALL IN to run that 11:01 in the 4th heat at Arcadia but couldn't break 2:25/5:20 to save her life. Or maybe she looked pre-pubescent and/or about to snap in half & was a time-bomb just waiting to go off. If a kid has run 2:15/5:05/11:01 - we'll (and I bet they) still strongly consider that kid & watch her run while learning more about her...now THAT's some potential with that kind of consistency & range. And of course they probably know who we're talking about since you've been so specific & they're probably obviously regretting they didn't have room on the roster now that she's been so successful...but you can't win 'em all. To the Notre Dame fans & alums out there...your distance program is still in good hands even if Turner is the arrogant one. Hopefully they can continue to figure out how to keep him out of his own way...and this from a coach who has to recruit & compete against Notre Dame's distance program.

Please stop acting like 11:01 contributing in a major program is a stretch. I just went through the rosters of the 5 teams that qualified for Nationals from the Great Lakes Region. Michigan, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Eastern Michigan and Indiana. 4 of the 5 teams have someone running at the National Meet that ran slower than 11:01 at the HS level.

All 4 teams had someone that ran slower than 11:01 that would of helped Notre Dame who did not qualify as a team.

In the region there was over 20 women that ran slower than 11:01 in HS that would have been in the top 5 on the Notre Dame team. Most impressive was Hanne Christensen from Western Michigan who finished 6th in the Region way ahead of Notre Dames first runner. Hanne ran 2:25--5:20--11:34 at Grand Blanc HS (the same school as Grant Fischer and Gabby Anzalone).

Full of yourself wrote:

Please stop acting like 11:01 contributing in a major program is a stretch. I just went through the rosters of the 5 teams that qualified for Nationals from the Great Lakes Region. Michigan, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Eastern Michigan and Indiana. 4 of the 5 teams have someone running at the National Meet that ran slower than 11:01 at the HS level.

All 4 teams had someone that ran slower than 11:01 that would of helped Notre Dame who did not qualify as a team.

In the region there was over 20 women that ran slower than 11:01 in HS that would have been in the top 5 on the Notre Dame team. Most impressive was Hanne Christensen from Western Michigan who finished 6th in the Region way ahead of Notre Dames first runner. Hanne ran 2:25--5:20--11:34 at Grand Blanc HS (the same school as Grant Fischer and Gabby Anzalone).

*would have

*Fisher

Full of yourself wrote:

I just went through the rosters of the 5 teams that qualified for Nationals from the Great Lakes Region. Michigan, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Eastern Michigan and Indiana. 4 of the 5 teams have someone running at the National Meet that ran slower than 11:01 at the HS level.

All 4 teams had someone that ran slower than 11:01 that would of helped Notre Dame who did not qualify as a team.

In the region there was over 20 women that ran slower than 11:01 in HS that would have been in the top 5 on the Notre Dame team. Most impressive was Hanne Christensen from Western Michigan who finished 6th in the Region way ahead of Notre Dames first runner. Hanne ran 2:25--5:20--11:34 at Grand Blanc HS (the same school as Grant Fischer and Gabby Anzalone).

Oh, so we're talking about rural backwater nowhere. So my point still stands...I get that those women don't get many chances to compete against high caliber competition & half their schedule gets snowed or rained out through the spring...so they're not going to get nearly as many opportunities to race after crappy training weather all winter. If I may ask, what were the other track PR's of this 11:01 girl?

I guess DI Coach does not have anyone from Illinois on his team. 20 Girls under 10:30 in HS yeah right.

Your last comment was even sillier than your previous ramblings. Someone presents numbers and you respond in generalizations.

You are saying that all of these 11 minute girls have been given less opportunities?????? Yet they still kick your teams asses. Good point. Must be coaching.