What time would Rupp have to run in Chicago for you to consider him the greatest American marathoner of all time?/

I don't think there's anything he can do in this coming Chicago to be considered the best American marathoner ever. It's going to take a couple big wins to put him above Meb imo. I'm not a hater, Rupp is great - but Meb has quite a resume, even if Rupp puts together a ridiculous time here, he needs a couple wins to be considered the "greatest" - you didn't say fastest.

Rupp will end his career as the American goat, but he needs a few performances to do that. One fast time or one win won't do it.

Meb has two major wins, a faster PR, and a better olympic medal.

Shorter has two better olympic medals, and a handful of wins.

Hall and Ritz have better PRs.

The truth is that KK is the greatest American marathoner by virtue of times, wins (including over some all-time greats), and world + still-standing American records. No olympics? Who cares, the Olympic marathon is weaker than any major. Rupp needs to surpass KK's times and get several more wins to be the greatest.

Anything is possible with Rupp because we here at letsrun.com

only hope the best for him.

Rupp can get distracted in the last miles of the marathon, kind of like

stopping and smelling the roses. But.

If he can hit his marks and not get freaked out knowing he is a world

class runner, he could get that marathon world record, provided

the weather conditions are in his favor.

As has been said already, to be the greatest American marathoner, he'd need to win in Chicago then win a few more. As if now I don't think you could rank him above Salazar never mind Shorter, Rodgers, KK and Meb.

That said, what could he do in Chicago to be the best US marathoner ever? I suppose if he won it in WR time that would do it. I mean, I thought Kipsang was the GOAT and now I think Kipchoge is better so if he runs faster than those guys have run, yeah, I guess by some transitive property of comparing marathons times, Rupp would have to be the best American ever.

I agree completely. He would need to go under 2:03 to even be in the goat conversation. Barring that, there's nothing he can do in Chicago to become the goat, or even to surpass any one of Rodgers, Salazar, Shorter, KK, and Meb.

1st place doesn't yet get him into the conversation, but would be a good start

From a pure time perspective he will have to run faster than Ryan Hall's 2:04:58. I don't want to hear about how there was a tailwind that day. Boston is still Boston and it's a very tough course.

He'd certainly have to beat 2:05:42.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xT8AX0YOuy0

KudzuRunner wrote:

He'd certainly have to beat 2:05:42.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xT8AX0YOuy0

Oh I dont think so.... Khannouchi became American in the middle of his career. He is still listed to have run 2'05.49" under MAR in 1999 in Chicago. After that he ran twice under 2'06 in 2002 (London & Chicago) running for the US.

So most definitely he has to look at Ryan Hall's time in London in 2008 (2'06'17"), if you want to exclude his Boston 2011 (2'04'58").

Cuckoo-land wrote:

Oh I dont think so.... Khannouchi became American in the middle of his career.

In others words, Rupp is not capable of ever bettering KK’s time. All of KK’s wins occurred while he lived in America and was being coached by an American.

If we are saying he never runs another race, I'd need to see him run ~2:04:50 to say that he is DEFINITIVELY the best American WITH NO CAREER AFTER THAT. His body of work so far with never having finished outside of top 3 in a race + 2:04:50 would do it for me.

Now, if we are assuming he runs a full career, possibly does well at other Majors and Olympics for the next ~4 years. 2:05:40 - 2:06:10 would probably be my time.

No time will make me think that. Still needs a win at the big show.

His marathon career is way too short to be the goat. I think he could get there but to be the goat now.... he'd have to run a crazy, unfathomable time. Something we all agree is impossible and he does anyway. Something like sub 2:04 tomorrow

Cuckoo-land wrote:

KudzuRunner wrote:

He'd certainly have to beat 2:05:42.

Oh I dont think so....

Then Rupp is NOT a 2:05:42 guy? Soften the required time because Rupp is soft. Okay.

First he would have to win and second, he would have to come within a handful of seconds of the world record to be considered the GOAT American in light of the careers of:

Frank Shorter

Bill Rodgers

Alberto Salazar

Meb Keflezighi

An argument can be made for Khalid Khannouchi but because he was already 28 years old before he became an American and he didn't represent the USA in Olympic competition, I'd have to put an asterisk next to his name.

Under 2:03?!

You guys are idiots. He wins a major or two and runs 2:06-2:07 he's def USA GOAT.

been around ya' know wrote:

First he would have to win and second, he would have to come within a handful of seconds of the world record to be considered the GOAT American in light of the careers of:

Frank Shorter

Bill Rodgers

Alberto Salazar

Meb Keflezighi

An argument can be made for Khalid Khannouchi but because he was already 28 years old before he became an American and he didn't represent the USA in Olympic competition, I'd have to put an asterisk next to his name.

I agree with your post except Rupp has to win several true major marathons against some of the best. Chicago has not been a major marathon for several years.

Loud chewing people wrote:

Under 2:03?!

You guys are idiots. He wins a major or two and runs 2:06-2:07 he's def USA GOAT.

Ahem, other American runners have won more than one major marathon, and the American record is 2:05:42.