phidipidippides wrote:
Real steepler wrote:The first lap skips the inside water jump, therefore the last six laps with the inside water jump are shorter. The last six laps are about 7m short of 400m. 1-2 seconds short.
Dude are you freaking kidding me? Do you not know how many laps are in a steeplechase?
And furthermore, you think it could take "2 seconds" for them to cover 7m? (Which is wrong anyway...) If they were jogging 7:30 miles it wouldn't even take 2 seconds to go that far.
Water jump is only skipped for the first 200. Then seven laps with water jump. Inside pit is about a second faster each lap.
Jager is a beast. He's like a white Kenyan, only taller with good hurdle technique
You do realize that running 10m per second is 10 flat for 100m right?
Your boy is good, but he ain't that good.
You still need context when you say someone closed in 56.
It's pretty odd to refer to someone's split for 392m.
Anyone know his 784m split?
What about the last 1558?
(I do not want to diminish the fact that closing the last 400m of a race over barriers and a water jump in 57. is pretty damn good. But when you simply write that someone closed in 56 without specifying the distance it implies for 400m)
I can close in 42 if you pick the right light to start that split.
56.7 is good but it was a slow race. It was an 8:16 high race.
Perspective/stats is needed here. In our 2016 Olympic preview, we talked about what Kemboi has closed in in the past.
2012: Kemboi closes in 56 mid in 8:18 race.
2013 - Kemboi closes in 56.8 (60.29 for outside water jump, we converted) in an 8:06 race.
2015 - Kemboi closes in 56.6 in 8:11 race.
So Kemboi has closed as fast as Jager in faster races while celebrating. That being said i went and watched the 2015 race, and don't think he could have gone a whole lot faster even if celebrating.
(56.6 in ’15, 60.29 in ’13 — which converts to 56.8 with an inside water jump, 56-mid in ’12)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Si9_M-BDqv0
In 2013, he definitely could have gone faster.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lloek649XGA
Of courrse, I think having watched a replay that Jager could have gone faster if pushed to the line.
PrZ wrote:
7:20 at the bell, 8:16 final time. That's some absolutely insane finishing speed for a steeple. And people were doubting him winning...lol.
Gutted for Bayer placing 4th 3 years in a row, that sucks big time.
Well lets see, maybe it has a little do with him being a 3:51 miler that requires that type of speed. Not sure any other steepler in the world has that type of mile speed.
phidipidippides wrote:
Inside water jump wrote:He did say last 400, which it isn't.
He said last 400 NOT last lap, and he didn't say it's the same as the last lap, geez.
And why are you making such a fuss over a trifle, the inside water jump doesn't make that much difference, it's only about 3-4 meters shorter per lap (you can tell the steeple start was about 20-25 meters behind the 200m mark on the track, which is lost over the 7 jumps) which is about half a second. So Jager was something like 57.low for the last 400m over barriers.
You seem like you're a real hit at parties.
Wrong! You're running less than 400m on 6 laps. The first lap is always 400m on an inside water jump.
You need to divide the distance between 200m lane 1 start and 3k steeple start by 6
Math Magician wrote:
phidipidippides wrote:He said last 400 NOT last lap, and he didn't say it's the same as the last lap, geez.
And why are you making such a fuss over a trifle, the inside water jump doesn't make that much difference, it's only about 3-4 meters shorter per lap (you can tell the steeple start was about 20-25 meters behind the 200m mark on the track, which is lost over the 7 jumps) which is about half a second. So Jager was something like 57.low for the last 400m over barriers.
You seem like you're a real hit at parties.
Wrong! You're running less than 400m on 6 laps. The first lap is always 400m on an inside water jump.
You need to divide the distance between 200m lane 1 start and 3k steeple start by 6
Dude. There are 7 water jumps. You're an idiot. If you don't believe me just watch a race and count, if you're able to go that high.
Math Magician wrote:
phidipidippides wrote:He said last 400 NOT last lap, and he didn't say it's the same as the last lap, geez.
And why are you making such a fuss over a trifle, the inside water jump doesn't make that much difference, it's only about 3-4 meters shorter per lap (you can tell the steeple start was about 20-25 meters behind the 200m mark on the track, which is lost over the 7 jumps) which is about half a second. So Jager was something like 57.low for the last 400m over barriers.
You seem like you're a real hit at parties.
Wrong! You're running less than 400m on 6 laps. The first lap is always 400m on an inside water jump.
You need to divide the distance between 200m lane 1 start and 3k steeple start by 6
It doesn't matter that the first lap is 400m. There are still 6.5 laps left, and for the 6 full and the last half lap you are cutting off distance for the jump. It's really not that hard MATH MAGICIAN, but maybe I am not sympathetic enough because I don't know what it's like to have a pea brain.
phidipidippides wrote:
Math Magician wrote:Wrong! You're running less than 400m on 6 laps. The first lap is always 400m on an inside water jump.
You need to divide the distance between 200m lane 1 start and 3k steeple start by 6
It doesn't matter that the first lap is 400m. There are still 6.5 laps left, and for the 6 full and the last half lap you are cutting off distance for the jump. It's really not that hard MATH MAGICIAN, but maybe I am not sympathetic enough because I don't know what it's like to have a pea brain.
You two guys are busy chasing each others tails.
At the finishline after the first 200m you have 7 laps to go. Each of those laps will be short 1/7 of the distance between the 5000m start and the steeplechase start. 7 # 6 # 5 # 4 # 3 # 2 #1 # F (each # represents a waterjump)
Since I like nice round numbers and 21m is a nice round multiple of 7, then lets say each lap is 3m short of 400m = 397m.
From the other side of the track 200m to go will be 3m up the track from the 5000m start. 600m to go will be 6m up from the 5000m startline. and so on.
Finish
#
200m to go is 3m from 5k start
#
600m is 6m from 5k
#
1000m is 9m
#
1400m is 12m
#
1800m is 15m
#
2200m is 18m
#
2600m is 21m
3000m is 21m
(again, each # represents a waterjump)
Whether or not the difference is 3m or 4m or 3.1416m doesn't rally matter. Each steeplechase lap with a water jump is less than 400m by a little.
Everything adds up.
Here is an IAAF standard track marking where the steeple lap (inside jump) is 396m . (396.084)
8 flat is 480 seconds for 3000m. Take 480 seconds divided by 3000m and it's 0.16 s /m. That's .64 seconds for 4 meters.
Add about 0.65 s to get the 400m split.
His 56.70 lap was a 57.35 400.
Correct the subject line to read "Evan Jager closed in 57!"
It isn't important that the 56 second closing lap was 400m. we aren't comparing his 56 with other 400m splits, we are comparing it to other 397m splits. Nobody ever reports the last 400m of a steeple, they report the last lap.
wejo wrote:
The top four all broke 60 on the last lap.
Jager 56.70, 57.98 for Stanley Kebenei, Hillary Bor 58.13, Andy Bayer 58.48
Great running all around.
Ekso wrote:Jager runs a really bad race at Payton Jordan, disappears to Park City for months, and then shows up at USAs in world class form. I don't think he's a doper and I'm glad he's looking good.
But if he was in NOP, everybody and his mother would be screaming that he's doped. Definite double standard.
I don't buy the logic. The NOP has been linked to practice that a) many people find unethical b) may be breaking anti-doping rules.
Bowerman Track Club as far as I can tell hasn't been linked to those things so I think it's perfectly normal for people to treat people in the groups differently.
*without any hard evidence or indictment, just to make you fell better about yourself
Pre-Medicated wrote:
I can't imagine running 57 for 400H, much less over barriers at the end of a race. Must feel amazing.
Running 57 for 400H does not feel amazing, and being that it's too slow to win just about any race, it feels even worse.
Someone wanted vid of the race:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OuDK1pis78wejo wrote:
The top four all broke 60 on the last lap.
Ekso wrote:Jager runs a really bad race at Payton Jordan, disappears to Park City for months, and then shows up at USAs in world class form. I don't think he's a doper and I'm glad he's looking good.
But if he was in NOP, everybody and his mother would be screaming that he's doped. Definite double standard.
I don't buy the logic. The NOP has been linked to practice that a) many people find unethical b) may be breaking anti-doping rules.
Bowerman Track Club as far as I can tell hasn't been linked to those things so I think it's perfectly normal for people to treat people in the groups differently.
I don't buy your excuse. People have been accusing NOP of doping since long before the leaked USADA report, and also since before the whistle-blowing that generated the investigation.
Actually, Ekso didn't go far enough. Many of the distance winners at these championships have recently run "poorly" (poorly for them, that is), and somehow manage in just a couple weeks to come back to the same fitness as in years past when they had no blips, hiccups, or interruptions. Hmmm.