Harvard Takes Another Hit - From a Coach on Staff

The athletes deserve to be treated with respect, by coaches who are looking out for their welfare, and who are not being abusive to them, especially not to young women. If you can't see this simple fact, then you are an idiot. Just because someone is a coach, does not give that person the right to abuse and harass other people.

Why did you even write this post?

*Long, exasperated sigh*

Stating again that I don't know the reality of the situation, but I know the smell.

Are you self-defining abuse and harassment? Back in the good old days abuse meant beating the S out of someone. Harassment intentionally seeking to cause distress with repeated actions. The environment being cultivated now is one where anytime someone feels uncomfortable (especially young women as you point out) they are being harassed and abused.

Now it's impossible for any outsider who didn't directly witness anything to tell if this guy is actually intentionally intending to cause harm or simply making passive comments about how it's important to keep your weight down if you want to run at your best. And, unless these girls are already dangerously thin, he's right. To further that, even first-hand encounters are unreliable because you idiots have yourselves convinced that the world is out to get you and that any sign of discomfort is proof of negligent behavior.

Get yourself a pair of lady nuts and face the world. You'll feel better afterward.

This is a post by someone trying to rationalize their inept coaching ability. respect is earned and coaches need to realize that just as athletes do. Too many inept coaches out there who can't get it done and can't get through to the athletes, so they blame them.

Sorry, good coaches don't make excuses or issue ultimatums, they get it done. Time for you to be done.

Does your parents have to earn your respect? Kids use to just respect adults and now you have adults saying adults must earn the respect of kids. Insane. What happened to the baseline level of respect that all kids had for adults? Guess that must be earned to.

Oh and i guess your boss has to earn your respect as well right? Or do you do what your boss says or get fired? No earned respect there. You are setting up kids to rebel against authority and in fairy land thats fine but in corporate america that doesnt work. I think that if you have the best of intentions for your athletes and you know your leading them in the right direction you dont have a problem with with saying do it my way or dont run for my team.

No, I guess what I meant was more of a trust issue. When you earn the athletes trust, they will listen and follow. But, if they don't trust that you are in it for the right reasons then you end up with a mess.

Yes, adults deserve respect, agree with you 100%, as long as they act like adults. That is part of the problem here

Comments about weight issues are not that simple. Even seemingly passive or loss advice can trigger an athlete to lose too much weight. In the book The Silence of Great Distance we read where Stephanie Herbst asked coach Tegen if losing weight would make her faster. Read the book for the result. This is just one of many instances. Young girls should not be encouraged to lose weight by make or female coaches. It might not be harassment but it's poor judgement and Jason should know better.

adsfsdafasd wrote:

Harambe wrote:

When there are women on the team giving statements that directly contradict each other then it certainly casts doubt on the extremity of the accusations leveled.

Not at all, it simply supports the narrative of different treatment of different groups of athletes.

That's assuming these women are selfish and totally self absorbed -- caring not one bit about the experiences of their teammates (and often best friends). Do you really think these people would stand behind their coach if their teammates were making such claims to them?

Why can we not take defense of the coach at the same value as criticisms of the coach?

As is often the case, it seems like there has been a lot of piling on to the coaching staff here, and it's impossible evaluate many of the reports as serious grievances or semi-spiteful former athletes getting their shots in while there's national attention. I was on a college team. I know how athletes can feel after 4 years of (mis)treatment.

I do hope Harvard Athletics continues on their review of the program, clearly a boiling-over of culture problems that can be addressed at the very least.

In the book The Silence of Great Distance we read where Stephanie Herbst asked coach Tegen if losing weight would make her faster. Read the book for the result. This is just one of many instances.

Did it mention the daily weigh-ins for the females?

Read the article and comments, teammates are pitted against one another. certain members have been pushed away to a volunteer coach. Others have separate practice times. They are not allowed to be friends, little to no association with the exiled members.

This is the work of an insecure coach, he does not trust his athletes. Does not trust these who don't see things his way. Is not man enough or adult enough to deal with this in a professional manner.

Thank you for stating the obvious. I don't know what has gone on with the Harvard team regarding overtraining to the point of injury or pushing runners beyond what they can do in a particular point in their training, but for me it's a deal breaker to say (however subtly) that someone should lose weight to run faster. As a high school runner, member of the first Harvard women's cross country team, and a longtime high school coach, I can't think of one occasion when losing a pound or two paid off in anything good. No one should be close to "dangerously thin" in order to think that a few pounds will make a difference. Maybe in the short run, one has some faster races, but it's just not sustainable. For a coach to suggest that this is the way to become a better runner is irresponsible.

Thats division 1 sports for you. Coaches do whatever they can to push athletes to run for faster. Not saying its right or wrong but its reality. Walk on athletes are usually not coached at all ie having workouts posted and doing them on their own or they are coached by a volunteer. If a coach has dismissed an athlete or an athlete quit, it is not beyond the realm of the imagination for them to not want his current runners as to not have the negative attitude spread throughout his team and to possible recruits that may be on visits or come to join the team. All very common practices. As far as the weight thing, Ive seen athletes develop eating disorders because of a coach so i never address weight with athletes but Im sure thats done on a pretty regular basis as well. Sorry but this is the reality of Division 1 sports

Agree with the above poster 100%. Well said.

Hi Coach- You're absolutely right about this. We know from studies that yes you will run faster with less weight, however, we also know that there is a higher risk of hormonal issues, bone density/stress fx problems, overtraining and etc by having a caloric deficit. Not to mention the psychological stress when too much emphasis is placed on food. The best coach I have ever crossed paths with is one that told me flat out "If you want to run longer distances you need to gain at least 5Ilbs". This particular coach was really progressive in training methods/philosophy, but what made him a great coach was that he was a high level endurance athlete. I think being an athlete yourself and having done higher levels of training makes a difference in understanding how athletes respond both physically and mentally to training. I think it takes more than just who you know to be a good coach. You do have to listen to your coach, but if it's causing mental physical harm then removing yourself from the situation is smart. Until things right themselves, however that may be, I applaud the women who recognize that the situation is not good for them and are putting energies into training for a fall half which one poster wrote. There really is more to life than collegiate sports...

Herein lies the problem:

1. Distance running does not smile upon those who are heavier than necessary. Even people who don't run can see this.

2. "Necessary" body-fat levels vary from one person to the next and the difference is significant between those who can stay healthy while being very lean versus those who need more fat to stay healthy. For instance, I would break down, get sick, etc. if I went below 8-9% for more than a few weeks when I was competing seriously, but I knew other guys that could be 5-6% year round with no problems.

3. Women do not want to be babied, nor should they. They don't want to be told half-truths or lies simply because they are females, which is understandable.

So how does a coach have a healthy conversation about this with females who ask about weight?

You mean 101: How to pay attention to relevant statistics in order to reduce inequitiesThat would be a genuine class with irrefutable evidence. You are going to deny that racial and gender differences exist in every area of society?

Alex P Keaton's Left Nut wrote:

Have any of these universities developed an undergrad program for Outrage yet? Certainly they're doing something right in teaching it.

Outrage 101: Race and Gender Differences - how to distort statistics and amplify resulting discrepancies

Outrage 224: The Terror - how to be offended by the slightest comment or action, an introduction to safe spaces

Outrage 312: Gender Inclusion - making the case for an infinite amount of genders and how to be appropriately outraged when one is not recognized

Outrage 450: Outrage in High Performance Athletics - how to react when coaches expect you to perform at a high level

xcvxcvxc wrote:

You mean 101: How to pay attention to relevant statistics in order to reduce inequities

That would be a genuine class with irrefutable evidence. You are going to deny that racial and gender differences exist in every area of society?

Alex P Keaton's Left Nut wrote:

Have any of these universities developed an undergrad program for Outrage yet? Certainly they're doing something right in teaching it.

Outrage 101: Race and Gender Differences - how to distort statistics and amplify resulting discrepancies

Outrage 224: The Terror - how to be offended by the slightest comment or action, an introduction to safe spaces

Outrage 312: Gender Inclusion - making the case for an infinite amount of genders and how to be appropriately outraged when one is not recognized

Outrage 450: Outrage in High Performance Athletics - how to react when coaches expect you to perform at a high level

Add to Outrage curriculum: Revisionist History: if you don't like your nation's history because it no longer fits your view of political correctness:, deny it and rewrite it. Tear down centuries-old statues because it makes some people "uncomfortable."

Thank you.