Ross Tucker disagrees.
Ross Tucker disagrees.
too legit to forgit wrote:
I consider Kipchoge's time as legit as a track record. It will be done in the next couple of years.
Which time? He has been great but no where near 2:00 in any marathon.
So you think it's laughable?
Who are these people who often run faster in time trials or practice? Elites?
Kipchoge is a competitor. To some degree this was a race between the three and the fact that Kipchoge won the race before halfway and still mustered that amount of effort shows that he would certainly have dipped under 2 if he'd had even a bit more competition.
The fact that you don't think so is laughable.
Rojo is correct here. Look at Bekele's records. Pacing matters more than competition.
LRC is such a strange place. Nothing like the Sub-2 event has ever been done in the history of running, and since ONE guy didn't achieve it on the first try, despite coming extremely close to hitting 1:59:99, there are still large quantities of people saying it CANNOT be done. Or, that a person running sub-2 with near-perfect conditions isn't satisfying enough. What?? Let's see what the human body is capable of.
I think if we have more events like the Nike sub-2, with larger, more competitive fields and cash-incentives to stay on pace, we will see a sub-2 in the near-future.
Phil me In wrote:
too legit to forgit wrote:I consider Kipchoge's time as legit as a track record. It will be done in the next couple of years.
Which time? He has been great but no where near 2:00 in any marathon.
The time he just did.
Yes, the windscreen made a huge difference and there was the psychological factor of going after the goal, plus the superior athlete who'd never at full strength gone for time alone in a marathon. However, I am convinced that a huge psychological hurdle has been knocked down, just as with Mutai and Mosop in the wind-aided Boston marathon of 2011 when they ran low 2:03 and then in the next few years all kinds of nobodies ran better times than Geb, a 26:22 guy, ever ran. I wouldn't be shocked at all to see Kipchoge break 2:02 this year at Berlin and low 2:01 wouldn't surprise me within a year or two. I'm assuming he is not shot by that race and that the experience of running that pace has prepared his cns and muscles to do something much closer to it than to the current WR. Psychological hurdles are huge in distance running.
too legit to forgit wrote:
I consider Kipchoge's time as legit as a track record. It will be done in the next couple of years.
Lapped runners doing the pacing for 100% of a race, don't think that is legitimate.
The psychology is very important.
In a typical marathon, there is some conservative strategies because you don't want to blow-up and lose.
In Sub2, you saw them eliminate some of that, because no one would "lose".
Peppers pot wrote:
too legit to forgit wrote:So you think it's laughable?
Who are these people who often run faster in time trials or practice? Elites?
Kipchoge is a competitor. To some degree this was a race between the three and the fact that Kipchoge won the race before halfway and still mustered that amount of effort shows that he would certainly have dipped under 2 if he'd had even a bit more competition.
The fact that you don't think so is laughable.
Rojo is correct here. Look at Bekele's records. Pacing matters more than competition.
"Pacing"
Who would have predicted the 5/10 WRs dropping to 12:44 and 26:43 in 1992, after 15 years of almost complete stagnation.
People familiar with PEDs?
I'm going to merge this thread with the other one or two discussing the same thing.
But yes, it may be done with new shoes and drugs on a fake course, but not anytime soon in a legit marathon.
As for the next Bekele, well we are still waiting aren't we? Bekele's and Gebs' aren't very common.
Kipchoge is a MONSTER talent.
This is not right, Berlin last year was probably warmer than the Nike stunt on Monza. There is no way that they can legally replicate the total distance pacing over the Berlin course. They may use a car for drafting, but big city marathons actually have the clock car right behind the leaders so the public can see the leaders and their time in the same shot. The lead car usually has the cameraman on board and there is usually a far larger gap so more is in the shot.
The difference between Monza and Berlin alone has to be worth a minute or two.
You'd have to offer a 4:04 miler that money and see if he can do it, not some random dude.
You're going to be backtracking very soon.
Kipchoge has tried to do it ONCE and came very close.
Such drivel.
What happened to experts tucker Magness and john Steiner?
Have they been replaced?
It's tough to keep up with the broe joey favs of the day!
I feel like I'm being trolled. I don't have to "bet a thousand dollars" to have a discussion. Have you ever run a race? If the race is set up to be "first to break 2", it's a hell of a lot different than the standard run-of-the-mill WMM. Breaking two will be athletic immortality. If it is a three man race as 37km, all know the stakes of not being first across the line. Sure, all three could slow down, but 20 years or more to get things right?
Do you think Wanjiru v. Kebede, Chicago 2010 didn't benefit from it being a race? You think Kebede didn't "try harder" to break Wanjiru? You think Wanjiru didn't "try harder" to keep coming back? That is what adrenaline and refusing to lose is all about.
It is not a catch all of course. The stars must line up, the ability must be there. For all we know maybe they should have went out at 59:30? How many times has someone actually went out at 2 hour pace?
You're just one of those guys that once they make up their mind, will actually wish and hope for ill will on people just to keep being right. Your tweet day of proved that much. Small, insecure personality.
Gotta bee wrote:
"Pacing"
Peclng
Peppers pot wrote:
too legit to forgit wrote:So you think it's laughable?
Who are these people who often run faster in time trials or practice? Elites?
Kipchoge is a competitor. To some degree this was a race between the three and the fact that Kipchoge won the race before halfway and still mustered that amount of effort shows that he would certainly have dipped under 2 if he'd had even a bit more competition.
The fact that you don't think so is laughable.
Rojo is correct here. Look at Bekele's records. Pacing matters more than competition.
He was in a race, not a practice TT
rojo wrote:
I'm going to merge this thread with the other one or two discussing the same thing.
But yes, it may be done with new shoes and drugs on a fake course, but not anytime soon in a legit marathon.
As for the next Bekele, well we are still waiting aren't we? Bekele's and Gebs' aren't very common.
Kipchoge is a MONSTER talent.
The bottom line Rojo, and i agree with you, is that NOBODY is anywhere close to that 2hr mark right now IN AN ELIGIBLE RACING SETUP. Not even close, not even the "monster" or Bekele.
People should just go and compare how much the depth of the finishers among the elite has gone south when they try to run these silly 1.01 first halves. Top ten in a major used to run 2.07/2.08 - not these days. More like 2.10 or above due to all these implosions or retirements.So I expect that mark will be broken in the next 15-20 years, in line with recent trends of improvement....
By the way, Nike going after that record is done. Unless Kipchoge wants to try it again they have nobody else able to try without imploding in a 2.14.... Shame for them Bekele is with the other guys. Adidas & Sub2HR seem a little more serious about it.... and we'll keep on seing improvements in a far smaller order of magnitude.
rojo wrote:
I hate to admit but the arrival of the EPO and the huge drop in track records sure is strong related.
Coincidence. Just look at the evidence! EPO has zero effect on elite runners.
Back to topic: the sub-2 will fall, as soon as a male as talented and hard working and clean as Mrs. Transparency Radcliffe comes along. That's only a question of time!
Am I living in the twilight zone? The Boston Marathon weather was terrible!
Des Linden: "The entire sport" has changed since she first started running Boston.
Matt Choi was drinking beer halfway through the Boston Marathon
Is there a rule against attaching a helium balloon to yourself while running a road race?
How rare is it to run a sub 5 minute mile AND bench press 225?
2024 College Track & Field Open Coaching Positions Discussion