I'm DESPERATE to get faster

Xc training wrote:

Hey guys a a female HS and about to start xc training here are my pr's

200- 36.6/ 37.0 (not sure cuz I ran this in practice)

400- 80

800- 2:51

1600m- 6;17

5k 22;45

Tell me about my strengths and weakness and what I should do in the summer for xc training. Btw my in season mileage for track is usually 15-19 miles for xc it's 25 miles per week. Also I hope running sub 21 or maybe sub 20 for the 5k in the fall

You're going to have to increase your mileage, no doubt about it. I would say try to get up to 40-45 miles a week if you want to see some gains in your speed and distance.

Also, what type of workouts do you do? How long are your long runs, and do you do any long runs at all? On 25 miles per week, I can't imagine you doing any long runs.

Also, what grade are you?

From looking at your 5k time, your aerobic power is very weak. So increasing your mileage, doing some long runs, and doing 800 and 1 mile repeats will put you in the right direction.

I'm a sophomore and my "long run" is about 5-5.5 miles. And the workouts I usually do is well it varies from week to week but mile repeats, some ladders, 800s, 400s...etc

Well, I'm one of the partisans of the Summer of Malmo (SoM), which can be adjusted for a gradual buildup for your volume and experience level. (You'll find it easily with Google.)

But in my experience (20+ years of coaching females), a simple lack of *muscular strength* holds a lot of girls back. So, where the SoM would advise you to double most days, I'd advise that you make an XBX session the first of the two (and if you want to add on a little extra running after the exercises, that's okay):

https://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~rfburger/xbx-plan.pdf

Yes, I'm aware that the illustrations are old-timey and some of the commentary sounds silly--it came out fifty years ago!--but the exercises are sound. Starting at the very first level is fine--with 5-7 sessions per week you'll move up fast.

In all seriousness, I've found that becoming a better all-round athlete is one of the keys for a lot of high school girls' improvement, particularly because so few of them nowadays have had a background of daily, vigorous phys ed during their grade school and middle school years.

Please take proper training and learn technique .

good luck !

Thank you for the information but I read the packet and looked at the excercises but none of them seem challenging they all seem pretty easy

I've read your packet that you gave me, but all those excercises seem really simple and not much of a challenge. Anyone else have anything else to say?

Xc training wrote:

I've read your packet that you gave me, but all those excercises seem really simple and not much of a challenge. Anyone else have anything else to say?

You sound desperate for a quick fix. You may want to consider listening to experienced coaches.

There is a lot of training information out there. Some people say, "You don't have the speed! Work on that with these hills and sprints!", while others say, "You don't have the endurance, so increase your mileage and make your long run 10 miles!". In reality, a mix of all kinds of training methods plus dedication and consistency are what helps. I started running in 7th grade with 20mpw and a 24:40 5k. By 8th grade, I was running 35mpw and 5:18 1600, 11:50 3200 , and 18:30 5k. I have not run any more than 35mpw since. Now, as a sophomore, I run 4:37 1600, 10:13 3200, and 16:52 5k. I improved by 1.5min in the 5k without changing my training. I only grew 1 inch and 5lbs since 8th grade as well. I didn't gain much muscle. What helped was consistency and dedication.

I feel like what you're doing is looking for a quick fix to your apparent "slowness" and that it is a problem that needs to be fixed. Your current 5k time, 22:45, is not slow, it's just a step on your progression. As you said, you have only been doing 15 to 25mpw. I will now outline some steps that will make you a stronger and more dedicated runner, and then I will provide some guidelines for you to make your own specific training plan. This is a process which takes time, and luckily it's summer and you have plenty of that!

Step 1: Start a training log. Unless your browser messed up, if you go to the bottom of this page, there is a link to FINALSURGE, a running log that allows you to do all kinds of stuff, and its free! Logging your training is key for consistency because it keeps you regimented. You'll see "30mi last week" and you'll know that you have to hit 35 this week. You'll be able to track your progress as well.

Step 2: Start running! For the first 2-3 weeks, don't worry about a specific training plan, just get out the door 5 times a week. (or 6, but 5 is probably good for you now). Set loose mileage goals for each week, but don't do any tempos or fartleks or intervals or whatever just yet. Just run some miles and log them on your new training log.

Step 3: Start a specific plan. At this point, you should have worked your way up to about 25mpw, and now you can start specializing a bit. I have worked out a guideline for coming up with a schedule below:

Mon: easy run

Tue: tempo

Wed: easy run

Thu: tempo or fartlek

Fri: easy run

Sat: off

Sun: long run

--Easy runs are medium length runs at easy pace. Easy pace is the pace at which you feel like you could run forever. You should be able to hold a conversation with a friend while running at this pace. I estimate your easy pace at 10:00/mi or so, but you should go by feel.

--Tempo runs are medium length efforts at your lactate threshold pace. That is the pace you can hold for an hour-long max effort. For you, that is around 8:15-8:30/mi. A Tempo run is around 15-20min for our purposes.

--A fartlek is an easy run that has short, fast bursts in it. Do your normal easy run but every 2min or so, throw in a short (30sec ish) burst at mile pace. It's like an interval workout, but it is less tailored for a specific purpose other than general fitness.

--Your long run should be 25-30% of your total mileage. If you're running 30mpw, that week's long run should be 7.5-9mi. This is at easy pace. As you get more advanced (sub-20 5k level), you can make the long run into a progression run. Don't get ahead of yourself though.

Your mileage progression throughout the summer should look something like this: 15, 20, 25, 15, 25, 30, 35, 25, 35 and hold 35 until school. The down weeks are important. Give your body a rest every couple of weeks.

Those exercises you said were too easy? They are still good for you. If they are too easy, try increasing the number of times you do it or increase how long you do it. Stuff like bodyweight squats, calf raises, planks, push-ups, and light arm exercises are really good for injury prevention.

Lastly, to handle this increased stress on your body that comes with the extra running, you need to eat healthily and a lot. Forgive me if this is a stereotype, but a lot of the female runners I know interpret healthy as: "I'm going to eat fruits and vegetables and maybe some bread, but only before a race." That is wrong. You need a balanced diet, and a lot of it. I usually eat 3500+ calories a day if I can, and I only weigh 130lbs! Here are some tips for eating properly:

1. Don't shy away from carbs. They give you energy. Eat bread and pasta, and stick to whole wheat *if possible*. Beans and root vegetables are also a superb source of carbs. Don't get carbs from processed junk like sweets, etc. Healthy carbs should be 50-55% of your daily caloric intake.

2. Eat a lot of protein. Lean meats like chicken, turkey, and fish are your friend here. Also, beans (them again!) are really good, perhaps better. Eating a bit of red meat is also fine, as long as it's lean. You need iron from the red meat, especially since females lose some iron with menstruation. Cutting back on saturated fat in your protein-containing foods allows you to supplement with healthier fats. Protein should be 15% of your daily caloric intake.

3. Fat is not bad. Just make sure it's good fat. Getting fat from vegetables, nuts, and seeds (monounsaturated fat) is the best option. Dairy fat is a lot better than meat, but still not quite as good as from vegetables. Fat should be the remaining 30% of your daily calories. Having a healthy amount of good fats speeds recovery.

4. Dairy is very helpful. It's not the only way, but it is by far the best way to get protein, calcium and vitamin D into your system. Calcium and vitamin D will help with bone growth, which is good because it will fight stress fractures. Chocolate milk is the best recovery drink to have right after a run. You walk in the door, get water, then get some chocolate milk! Try to avoid whole milk if you can, instead drink 1% or 2%. Skim is not great since a tiny bit of fat helps absorb the vitamin D (a fat soluble vitamin).

5. As I said earlier, eat a lot. Don't be afraid of getting fat, since you're running. Don't weigh yourself to monitor fatness since you'll be gaining muscle. Instead, just watch your muscle definition. If you're getting a bit pudgy, bump your mileage up a bit and decrease your portion size just a tiny bit. Don't cut fat or carbs from your diet, just eat a little less overall.

Being a distance runner requires time and dedication year-round. It takes discipline. Based on your times off of an apparent lack of training, you have talent. Don't squander it because you don't want to put in the effort. Hopefully all of that is enough to get you started, but feel free to ask questions. I love helping people with running. Good luck!

tl;dr: I spent an hour writing this and making sure it's good when I should be studying for my history exam. Humor me and read the whole thing and consider it seriously.

I agree with the idea that more strength is important. Lots of ways to accomplish this. The best bet is to find a good weight trainer that knows running. They are not easy to find.

If money is a problem, Youtube has a bunch of "hotel room workouts" that will have some good exercises. You then need to be sure you are doing the exercise well by looking at other videos because some of those videos have terrible form.

I also agree more running time is important. The key to adding distance is to pace the runs very carefully so you don't run a bunch of extra KMs slowly. That doesn't mean do high intensity workouts either.

Woah thank you sooo much for taking your time writing this out, really means a lot! You really put a lot of useful information on here that I will definitely use! And since a lot of you recommended to do the extra strength training I guess I'll do the excercises in the packet plus some extra excercises of my own and of course following Alabama runner's training plan. Also you guys said it seems like I'm looking for a "quick fix" which is somewhat true because I'm really not that patient with my training and I'm tired of hitting the same old slow times. Anyway thank you so much!

I have another question. Okay so in the summer mid july I will HAVE to go this summer program (don't ask, I don't even want to go) which will make me not run for about 2.5 weeks. Will this "break" from training waste all the training I did in june/ early july. Oh and I am starting XC training next week (I'm taking this week off) and right before the break I will hit my goals of 35 miles... so you guys think this break will affect my performance?

Xc training wrote:

I have another question. Okay so in the summer mid july I will HAVE to go this summer program (don't ask, I don't even want to go) which will make me not run for about 2.5 weeks. Will this "break" from training waste all the training I did in june/ early july. Oh and I am starting XC training next week (I'm taking this week off) and right before the break I will hit my goals of 35 miles... so you guys think this break will affect my performance?

Interesting. Short answer: sure it will, short term. Longer answer: it doesn't have to set you back too far.

I read the discussion about the old X B X exercises above. I used to do those and coach those. They ARE simple, but that doesn't mean they're easy. (Just pick a random level from, say, Chart 3, and see whether you can perform all the exercises/reps, with proper form, done in the target time. You might find it pretty tough.) The great thing is, you can do them practically anywhere--probably even during your summer program. So if you do that, you'll hold on to a surprising amount of fitness.

There's a lot of time between that mid-summer program and the start of xc practices. If you're consistent with your mileage buildup and some kind of strength work BEFORE the program, I think you'll find that after the program it only takes a couple weeks for you to get back to where you'd left off.

...Especially if you're consistent with SOME kind of fitness work during the program itself. You'd be amazed at how much condition you can maintain, with just 10-15 minutes a day of vigorous exercise. It's not ideal, but it's 100% better than doing nothing.

Xc training wrote:

Hey guys a a female HS and about to start xc training here are my pr's

200- 36.6/ 37.0 (not sure cuz I ran this in practice)

400- 80

800- 2:51

1600m- 6;17

5k 22;45

Tell me about my strengths and weakness and what I should do in the summer for xc training. Btw my in season mileage for track is usually 15-19 miles for xc it's 25 miles per week. Also I hope running sub 21 or maybe sub 20 for the 5k in the fall

I think your sub-21 will come from consistent running over the summer. I would slowly bump up your mileage and top out at 35mpw in August. Finish up your runs with some striders and get in some hill work. I would also jump into a couple road races to break up your training. I coached at a private school and you are about typical for a freshman with no previous running experience. If this is your first year of running, it takes a year or two to build up your leg muscles and aerobic system. Sub-21 is pretty quick, don't get discourage if it doesn't come right away, make sub-21 your goal for the season. Listen to your coach, hopefully you are getting similar advice from them. Don't overly focus on running, enjoy your summer and good luck next season.

Run more often than you have been. Run longer on some runs than you have been. Run faster on some runs than you have been. Eat more than you have been. Sleep more than you have been. Rest on some days as much or even more than you have been.

DOMINATE.

Really the key is to modulate your running more. The only way you can be healthy while doing more of everything is to balance more training with more recovery. I think the #1 thing a high school girl can do wrongly is to flip the switch into training harder without accepting that this will also require even better recovery and calories. Most girls regress due to injury, anemia, or burn out if their training increase isn't gradual. You have to be serious about avoiding those types of hurdles by doing all the little things right if you expect to have any success when making a big leap forward.

I'd say during the summer focus on running more often and just make sure each week you do at least one thing longer than usual and at least one thing faster than usual. It's that simple. If you need me to be more specific, then do 1 hour+ longer run each week and 8x200 each week. Otherwise just run more. And, yes, if 7 miles is your long run then I don't think improving means running 5 or 6 miles all the other days. I'd actually say that doubling some days with just another 3 mile run is smarter. So I'm being very literal when I say run "more often."

It's not just running and diet that can make a difference here. I see a lot of people who aren't running as fast as they want to "just" run and eat fairly healthy, then just sit around all day staring at screens.

Not saying you do, but making sure your day includes lots of walking around, bicycling, yard work, dog walking, grocery cart pushing, raking, whatever, can go a long way toward the overall fitness that's necessary to progress as a runner. Replace those things I mentioned above with the activities that make sense to you. If it's summer, swim a LOT. Get on your feet a lot, don't just sit around!

I give you the very best advice if you want and can afford it.......Get you a very good coach with experience and very good results before. You need to train more seriously than before and 5-6 workouts per week to reach your goals.

....and to better your ability in XC you don`t have to do strength or special hillworkouts more then now and then......You just need 5-6 workouts per week with one maxVO2- interval and one treshold interval/sustained treshold run and the 3-4 other days distance workouts at your best individual aerobic pace......Thats it! Don`t try to complicate the issue!