How the hell do I fix my knee

Bump

see a good PT and get an objective assessment of your upper leg strength

you likely need to improve the lateral strength of your leg... and not with sitting quad exgensions

Kortizone

I recommend regular deep tissue massage for the IT band issue. You might want to go once per week.

Also, consider whether you should get an orthotic or switch to shoes with some stability. They can wedge up the medial side in your shoe a little bit so your knee buckles less. That does introduce a whole new biomechanic gait cycle than you are used to, though.

I've only had intermittent knee issues, but I found deep tissue massage fixed everything much faster than RICE ever could. The "stick" wasn't precise enough to do what human hands could.

for real...go to a pool and get a kickboard and use long flippers, kick for 20 minutes or more 3 days a week...the strength and functional flexibility from this unique load saved my knees from the same issue.

IT band surgery worked for me.

One of my worst memories is running the last 9 miles of the Boston Marathon with searing IT band pain. Then I had to walk 3 miles home because I took the wrong T train because I was so out of it.

What ultimately helped: High Catch Power Hang Snatch

Best of luck to you. I had had 7 years of constant knee / IT band trouble and so far have been 2.5 years pain free. I like this exercise because you don't need a lot of weight for it to be effective, making it pretty safe. I only did it for a few months, but that seemed to do the trick.

Dang. I don't have a pool or a lifting bar accessible where I'm at (or in an hour radius). Thanks for the responses. Any other ideas?

You could just buy one. If you're 150lbs, you probably will peak at 90lbs for the exercise. This is speaking as someone who's 140lbs and peaked at around that much - and I've been able to half squat 19 reps at 340lbs - well, maybe more like a 15/32 squat. You won't need an actual Olympic (7') bar, and since it's light, no need for a rack. Form is key, though, and requires practice before getting anywhere near even 50lbs. Sounds like you're not willing to put in that work. Best of luck, regardless. I don't miss what you're going through.

kanny wrote:

What ultimately helped: High Catch Power Hang Snatch

I snatched 220# weighing 146 but many decades ago, and would be happy to do 20# as described.

Why do you feel this was helpful for your knees?

220# at 146# is insane. I never had the stones to do a real snatch (sounds sooo wrong) as I’m pretty risk averse. My arms are too long for the C&J, so I stuck to deadlifts - I still blame squats for my initial knee injury, though it’s probably irrational.Some exposition: I had had years of horrible knee pain (which included IT Band pain) as a result of torn meniscus from 12 years ago that I never got fixed. As late as 3 years ago, it kept getting worse, and I ran with a terrrrible limp as I was stubborn about stopping, as even months of rest didn’t help. It all came to a head during a trip to Japan where even walking was excruciatingly painful for the whole 10 days. This is going to sound nuts, but we went to one of the biggest temples, the Todaiji, where there’s a statue of a healing buddha (Binzuru). Supposedly, if you touch the part of the body you’re having trouble with, it will help to heal it. Of course, I did it for laughs (and desperation) but didn’t really think much of it. At the end of the trip, still limping, I accepted that I’ll probably be limping my whole life - it was a low point, as I was only 38.A few days after returning, I randomly went back to this website that has a vertical jump calculator, and one of the lifts that you can use for conversions is the “High Catch Power Snatch.” I’d always been terrified of the snatch. My knee hurts just watching people do real snatches. However, for some reason I decided to try it out, but made it a Hang version to minimize risk of injury as very little weight was necessary. Plus, I wanted a quick “snap” from start to finish.I started with a 15lb minibar to get my form down, and got up to 65lbs in a week. A weird thing started happening. My knee pain, which was still there even after 11 days of no running on the trip, began to disappear. Two weeks later, I was around 80lbs for the HCPHS, and the pain was completely gone. It was a frickin’ miracle. I only did it for about 2 months then stopped (90lbs), as I felt like it served its purpose. 2.5 years later I’m still pain free in the knee. I have theories about how it went down from a biological/medical standpoint, but a simplistic explanation would be there was something in the vertical jump simulation (without actually doing one which would result in high landing forces) that "righted" the knee area.Probably too much info, but I feet like the context was necessary. I could still be wrong, and it could all be just one big red herring.

Details please wrote:

I snatched 220# weighing 146 but many decades ago, and would be happy to do 20# as described.

Why do you feel this was helpful for your knees?

Strengthen your butt and hips. I really think that will solve it. If you work on this properly for several weeks and still have issues come back and ask for other suggestions, but this is the easiest place to start and most likely reason. clams, donkey kicks, one legged squats, bridges, planks...all good.

David S. Pumpkins wrote:

Strengthen your butt and hips. I really think that will solve it. If you work on this properly for several weeks and still have issues come back and ask for other suggestions, but this is the easiest place to start and most likely reason. clams, donkey kicks, one legged squats, bridges, planks...all good.

This is interesting to me. Since I posted this I've continued to look things up and I've been doing these exercises, and I've noticed that the leg I injured is super weak in the hip. I don't know how I've never noticed this before.

When I do clamshells, for example, I can only lift my injured knee up halfway as the other healthy leg. That blew my mind. No matter how hard I try it just won't go higher, while the other is easy.

In other hip exercises the injured leg will quickly cramp up in the hip, while the other is fine.

Incredible to me that 8 years after beginning running I finally realized this and it has been there all along. Mind blowing.

According to the guy that runs runnersconnect.net he claims every runner has weak hip&butt issues, just to different degrees. This may be helpful if you want to keep the work focused...

http://strengthrunning.com/2011/02/the-itb-rehab-routine-video-demonstration/

Thank you for sharing your story. This method makes sense to me. I always liked doing snatches and could do 135# as a scrawny runner, with a regular bar. In my mid 20's I'd not run for a couple of years, happened to meet some guys training in a gym, with a couple of platforms at the front of the room. Their coach, Bob Hise, had me try the big bar with big plates, and I snatched it right up standing straight, which must have been okay as he let me train with them.

We had competitions and I won a novice one, with the 220 snatch and a 275 clean & jerk, then did 280 soon after. My press was terrible. The coach liked doing a one arm snatch after training, so I practiced a few times and did 165# with one arm. This didn't feel as difficult as the whole body could help the one side, and the arm was mainly used for balance. After a year, the group was breaking up and I went back to running again, thank goodness, as the weights were very hard on the body.

Personally and speaking from experience I think dead lifts are much harder on the knees, especially at the top, though heavy squats are probably not good either, plus the risk of being in a bad position with either of them and / or having an accident.

Man, that is some serious weight. I know that when you're in that world, it probably doesn't sound like much, but to mere mortals it's terrifying. You must've had a really excellent no step vertical jump.

Interesting take on the deadlifts - I felt like it was the only safe haven for my knees - even with the lockout. I even did "rack pulls" starting about 9" higher for more weight. The only reason I stopped doing DLs/RPs is I refuse to remove my wedding ring for anything, and the high weight (for me - mid 300s) was killing my ring finger.

Thanks for the compliment. The coach, competition and program were awesome, and the reason for success. I was doing 185# squats and some guy insisted I do at least 225 or not use the bar and it freaked me out but I did it, probably once, then eventually did 386, and 5 sets of 5 with 310. I liked doing overhead supports on the rack, standing up from a split with 550 or so #s figuring they'd help my c&j, and did the same for the snatch. We also did cleans / snatches from hangs and boxes etc.

Regarding deadlifts, I'd done a few moderately in recent years, not seriously, with no problem but a year or so ago tried them again and somehow rocking back at the top felt a scraping in my knees over several reps. Perhaps not having done them for awhile made my knees more susceptible, as thereafter I felt the same scraping when running, which resulted in my knee and lower leg swelling up, having to stop running, and I'm still trying to resolve this issue. Also, the hamstring and muscles around the knee feel not quite in balance.

You might be low in zinc, magnesium or b12.

I have this injury as well (more a hip problem that has spread) just before I run I specifically foam roll that area between my glut/butt and my hip (oh so sore) but I am up and running again after.

Your hamstrings and calves maybe too tight.

With my back I have found that not expecting a solution works best.

Keep doing the exercises. Every time I go up and down stairs I stretch the heck out of my hips. It takes a few extra seconds. No biggy.

When I wake up in the morning the I do the knee to chest stretches before I roll over.

As you get older its harder to keep it all going right, and things do not get fit, or lose flexibility at the same rate.

Assume you'll always have it and keep doing the stretches.

I have all of those things you describe, plus 10 surgeries. The most recent being a TKR. But glute strengthening, if you ride a bike, cleat placement, hip flexibility and core. Its all that matters to keep my knee and lower back under the most amount of control. Not pain free, but tolerable for me.