The emperor has no clothes: Jemima Sumgong has tested positive for EPO!!!

james naismith li wrote:

trollism wrote:

Of course the 'mishandling' of his tests.

I think given what we know about the IAAF and WADA we can be pretty confident that this was a cover up.

Doper.

From the guy who defends Bradley Wiggins? HA!

Indeed.

Happy Hour wrote:

TeaBagginNoMore wrote:

I will not return as a fan to the sport until they start taking such measures. I have absolutely zero interest in professional sports from now on.

Professional distance running has a long history & culture of doping...nothing new there. And I'm glad NFL fans don't have your attitude toward professional sports.

It has a history of doping but it doesn't mean we should tolerate it. That is a cop-out bullshit answer and people like you with that "turn a blind eye" mindset are the biggest problem of all. The people cheating normal clean runners out of places or money. Getting money for appearance fees for their fast bogus PRs while clean runners have to stay at home watching the race. IT'S FRAUD. And should be treated like it along with the those that facilitated (Dirty Coaches, Dirty Agents, Dirty Cheats giving their athletes testosterone massages). Lance Armstrong had to pay back sponsorship money when he got busted and there should be a clause in every road race or running contract that if you get busted for using illegal drugs you will have to PAY BACK PRIZE MONEY and APPERANCE FEES as well as money that has been paid for TRAVEL and HOTELs. You will be taken out of the results.

Until people are held accountable then it will be the same thing every single year. And if it's the same thing every single year then why have any kind of rules on banned substance at all. Might well just have a free for all and Joe Runner douche bag above will be happy.

Renato Canova wrote:

2) The fact Jemima took EPO doesn't change my clear opinion about the fact EPO doesn't work with the top Kenyans and Ethiopians working in altitude, at the higher intensity of training.

3) Jemima is, of sure, one of the best marathon runners, but winning Olympics doesn't mean you are the best. Jemima Sumgong is [....] n. 27 all-time, with a PB of 2:20:48

So how fast does someone need to run for us to know for certain they're clean? Sub 2:20, maybe?

(for who thinks the "clean" limit is 2:10 : do you know that in 1985 not an African, but Steve Jones from Wales, ran 2:07:13 without rabbits, with a crazy split at HM of 61:53).

All I'd like is to know your "clean limit" - what level of performance is good enough that we know there was no doping involved?

conova or sorry canova your cover is blown .

your b.s and gatekeepping of the truth is done.

1.

as for steve jones , he was british ,

at same time as all other brits dominating middle distance

he was on the steroids like all the rest , cram etc , coe took it to up a level

higer hct and recovery from correct roid , smoked too can raise hct.

imagine lopes similar ,

bont believe in fairytails,

2.

bekele's gained a minute with epo from elite time but remember was

the best epo in micera and wasnt quite same after had to use the normal stuff

lagat

doping then and doping now , igf-1 lr3 ...............

age can wait when taking this stuff.

track might aswell be WWE at this stage as just as fake ...................

and just as controlled as wwe , controllers decide who dopes

and who wins alot of time .

And like when soviet union was excluded from pro boxing for all those years

and to claim that you were world champion is hollow ,

if not part of club not taking part , just like russia in athletics now.

hollow championships ,

and leads to breakaway associations again like wwe and wwc

which further taints the whole thing

2) The fact Jemima took EPO doesn't change my clear opinion about the fact EPO doesn't work with the top Kenyans and Ethiopians working in altitude, at the higher intensity of training.

I have been fascinated by this statement and how you state it as a "fact". Do you have a scientific background in physiology and evidence that would prove this claim to be "fact?" I hope not, because the only you could make a statement like that, and come to that conclusion is if you experimented on your runners with EPO while doing higher intensity training at altitude. There is no other way to test your hypothesis without first admitting to testing EPO on your athletes while at altitude.

Considering, Kipchoge ran 2:09 and usually runs 2:03, Sumgong ran 2:24 not sure if her time would have been 2:18 in better conditions but I would say looking at the race again it is pretty clear epo gave her an extra gear to pull away with. This nonsense that EPO doesn't work is lying dead on the canvas. The nonsense that the Olympic Marathon champ isn't the best is laughable, the Olympic Marathon might be the only event (perhaps the WCs) with any half credible testing (qualified athletes are tested in the lead up weeks and immediately afterwards). Elite dopers avoid major champs like the plague.

Isn't Mo Farah only ranked 27th all time for 5 and 10, yet these days it is enough to make him invincible?

broken arrow wrote:

I agree with you. Taking EPO raising red blood cell count (hematocrit) and therefore you have more oxygen going to the recruited working muscles. Why are these athletes taking EPO if it does not work if you are Kenyan...it is a form of candy or food for them?????? C'mon man, these athletes are cheaters pure and simple.

It's pretty stunning Canova enjoys calling people stupid... And then writes things that beg the obvious -- How Could He Know So Much About Epo and so passionately -- Without Having Intimate Knowledge of it -- such as administering the use of EPO???!!!???

Truly a non-stupid person would never make such contentions with out having some intimate knowledge such as using it on some elite athletes and seeing "no benefit," if they weren't blah blah blah.

How about lifetime erasure and ban of doped athletes Coaches and Managers?

In the naivest of worlds probably ten percent of East Africans are on something other than their feet each day.

Agreed. Sumgong probably could run sub 2:20 last year if she wanted to, but the London and Rio races are quite tactical until the closing stages.

broken arrow wrote:

I agree with you. Taking EPO raising red blood cell count (hematocrit) and therefore you have more oxygen going to the recruited working muscles. Why are these athletes taking EPO if it does not work if you are Kenyan...it is a form of candy or food for them?????? C'mon man, these athletes are cheaters pure and simple.

Great point...athletes aren’t going to risk a 4 yr whack and the wrath of the running community for a PED that doesn't work (i.e., benefit vs risk analysis) 🤔. And many athletes experiment with it first (varying dosages, time periods, etc.) to see if they notice an improvement in performance before committing to a structured program targeting key competitions. Increases in baseline Hct/Hgb VO2max, improved time to exhaustion (dependent on the dose) is what the athlete and coach is evaluating. This is all covered in the scientific literature on EPO's influence on Hct/Hgb & VO2max and it's effect on endurance exercise.

ukathleticcoach wrote:

Point 3 us really clutching at straws. You previously said elite Kenyans did not benefit from EPO. Now it's only the actual No 1 and being Olympic champion does not putt you in that category!

Even with your shifting goal posts how about the female 1500m world record holder!

I remember when I pointed out that Abraham Kiprotich was an example of a Kenyan (though running for France) elite marathon runner who got caught using EPO after improving his marathon time to 2h 08xx and winning some marathons. Canova replied that 2h 08 was not an elite marathon time and that 2h 06 should be considered elite. I replied that therefore the 2004 Olympic Champion Baldini was not elite as his PR was 2h 07 xx and Canova replied that Baldini could have run 2h 04 at the Olympics in 2004. Why not apply the same logic to Sumgong?

The IAAF should honestly make the sport amateur again and just flat out remove prize and appearance money from any race. Travel expenses only. If they have that money to spare then they should give that money to more worthy causes such as improving healthcare or infrastructure in the towns the races are held. This would give a morally justifiable purpose to organising the elite races and would help make the sport more popular. It would also rid the sport of this awful profession of agents and certain coaches who are just trying to money of an athlete's hide. Athletes would also be likely doing something more productive with their lives other than training, sleeping (and doping). Do it IAAF.

I think your assumption here is that humans have a maximum limit of RBC's and heamocrit levels and that training at maximum capacity for that individual will get you there. Unfortunately your big flaw in this assumption is that EPO can send these parameters into artificially higher levels that are beyond the individuals capacity. We know this as cyclists in the 80's and 90's had blood akin to treacle. Also you may be assuming that this is not a limiting factor to performance, however it is and especially for the Marathon where 98% of ATP production occurs via the aerobic energy system.

Every time RC posts about EPO on LRC, he is getting exposed.

This will help clean up the sport.

He is brave, I will give him that.

Keep up the good work, RC!!

Mo Farah, 5000m: 31st person, 64th on time.

10000m: 16th person, 28th on time.

As usual brilliant from Renato.

He tells us for years EPO doesn't work on 'elite Africans', Olympic champion gets busted and his excuse is that she's 'not elite'.

Just another non-elite with weak mind disease, just this one happens to be a dominant Olympic champion.

Paula she was drinking epo !!! She is not clean

trollism wrote:

As usual brilliant from Renato.

He tells us for years EPO doesn't work on 'elite Africans', Olympic champion gets busted and his excuse is that she's 'not elite'.

Just another non-elite with weak mind disease, just this one happens to be a dominant Olympic champion.

Trust him: he apparently has lots of experimental evidence that EPO does not work on elite altitude born, - raised, -trained Kenyans and Ethiopians, while he learned that it does help the other elite runners except for the British.