Lance Armstrong handed defeat by federal judge

zzzz wrote:

I agree with Armstrong's argument that the USPS suffered no damages and got what they wanted in terms of exposure, so I hope he wins the court case. The USPS Cycling team was highly visible through those years, and certainly got the kind of attention that that kind of advertising aspires to. They certainly got way more advertising value from winning the TDF than if the USPS was a run-of-the-mill team. And they want ALL that money back? Free, top-level advertising for years?

Well, except for the fact the entire contract was based on an elaborate fraud. Is fraud okay now?

Your position as a fan-boy is understandable. Someone who is not emotionally invested can take a more objective view and judge him by his actions and not the occasional nod and 'hey bruh' you might get as a local.

pop_pop!_v2.2.1 wrote:

zzzz wrote:

I agree with Armstrong's argument that the USPS suffered no damages and got what they wanted in terms of exposure, so I hope he wins the court case. The USPS Cycling team was highly visible through those years, and certainly got the kind of attention that that kind of advertising aspires to. They certainly got way more advertising value from winning the TDF than if the USPS was a run-of-the-mill team. And they want ALL that money back? Free, top-level advertising for years?

Well, except for the fact the entire contract was based on an elaborate fraud. Is fraud okay now?

There is no fraud if the company made a ton of money. They did not lose money on the deal.

Jimmy21 wrote:

I don't know why, but that article really irked me on the fact that the USPS shouldnt be owned by the government. I was kind of on the fence about whether the USPS was a public service or a communist business that shouldn't. Reading that article made up my mind. The government shouldn't be running businesses

The reason we have a government run postal service is so all the people out in rural #MAGA land can get their mail delivered anywhere in the US for 49 cents instead of getting charged a few bucks to have a private carrier deliver the mail. People in liberal big cities would probably see better service and not much of a price difference with privatization of mail service because economies of scale favor mail delivery in big cities. But in rural areas, it is very expensive to deliver mail service because people are far away and there are too few people to have any sort of economies of scale.

The case against LA is under the false claims act. The USPS is asking for their money back plus treble damages. It is disingenuous at best to argue that USPS has no damages when they expressly bargained for a clean cycling team that did not rely on doping to win. Had LA come to the bargaining table and refused to sign the contract because he was candid about planing to dope, USPS would have never paid him $23 mil and would have probably never even signed him up. Also, the doping allegations were swirling all around Armstrong throughout the USPS years. Arguably, had he truly been a clear rider as he represented to be and promised to be in his contract, there would have been no doping allegations. Thus, the USPS advertising exposure was tainted. You cannot possibly say that the value of the exposure of a winning TDF rider dogged by doping allegations is the same as the value of a winning TDF rider who widely respected as a clean rider with no doping allegations.

where did he touch you? wrote:

Your position as a fan-boy is understandable. Someone who is not emotionally invested can take a more objective view and judge him by his actions and not the occasional nod and 'hey bruh' you might get as a local.

Need a better effort than that.

Lemond is "the gold standard" for the sport? Stick to running.

The funny thing about this is that everyone knew about doping in cycling and admits they did, but they are claiming that they didn't know Armstrong was doping, so he defrauded them.

The federal judge denied LA's motion for summary judgment -- which means the USPS presented evidence sufficient to raise material factual issues that must be decided by a jury. That doesn't mean the USPS has won the case, but it does mean LA must now either settle with the USPS or go to trial. A trial will be a big gamble for both sides: LA faces financial ruin if he loses (the judgment will likely not dischargeable in bankruptcy), but the USPS could lose all if the jury finds LA didn't cause the USPS to suffer any injury. I predict a settlement before trial.

Yowsers wrote:

Lemond is "the gold standard" for the sport? Stick to running.

The funny thing about this is that everyone knew about doping in cycling and admits they did, but they are claiming that they didn't know Armstrong was doping, so he defrauded them.

Meanwhile the "defrauded" entity made a huge amount of money defrauding people buying their Armstrong junk. Of course, as someone noted, the defrauded people will never get their money back.

No Fraud wrote:

Yowsers wrote:

Lemond is "the gold standard" for the sport? Stick to running.

The funny thing about this is that everyone knew about doping in cycling and admits they did, but they are claiming that they didn't know Armstrong was doping, so he defrauded them.

Meanwhile the "defrauded" entity made a huge amount of money defrauding people buying their Armstrong junk. Of course, as someone noted, the defrauded people will never get their money back.

What government stuff did people buy? Cycling fans, who know about doping, bought team gear and do so for every team they like...even though they know there is doping.

Your post is as stupid as the one claiming Lemind is the gold standard of the sport.

Dial it up wrote:

he's the greatest fraud in American history and it isn't even an argument

Fixed that for you, fanboy.

He should be put in jail.

carol palmer wrote:

He got what he deserved. Everything is as expected.

If postage goes down in price, I'm all for it.

Made Money wrote:

There is no fraud if the company made a ton of money. They did not lose money on the deal.

Making money and fraud are 2 completely different issues. Fraud has to do with HOW you made money not IF you made money.

xcrnrz wrote:

Dial it up wrote:

he's the greatest fraud in American history and it isn't even an argument

Fixed that for you, fanboy.

He should be put in jail.

I predicted people would try and fail to argue it. However, I expected an actual effort. Millennials suck.

Jimmy21 wrote:

I don't know why, but that article really irked me on the fact that the USPS shouldnt be owned by the government. I was kind of on the fence about whether the USPS was a public service or a communist business that shouldn't. Reading that article made up my mind. The government shouldn't be running businesses

You my friend understand nothing about how the world goes round

In LAs defense, I believe my postman is guilty of doping, but definitely not PEDs.

Dial it up wrote:

I run into him once in a while and he's a pleasant, entertaining guy.

In the democratic free world most crooks, liars, con men, whatever you want to call them, are pleasant and entertaining, how the feck do you think they survive?

Beware pleasant entertainers. wrote:

Dial it up wrote:

I run into him once in a while and he's a pleasant, entertaining guy.

In the democratic free world most crooks, liars, con men, whatever you want to call them, are pleasant and entertaining, how the feck do you think they survive?

Yea it could just be that he's a normal dude raising his kids and living his life or he's a psychopath with a current agenda against angry 20 minute 5kers from letsrun.

gilt wrote:

I dunno, I agree the guy is guilty, but $100 million is a little steep.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/more-sports/lance-armstrong-handed-defeat-by-federal-judge/ar-AAmTLVW?ocid=spartandhp

Yet you probably think it's fair a CEO to get prison time and larger monetary penalties for fraud his underlings committed.

Dial it up wrote:

Yea it could just be that he's a normal dude raising his kids and living his life or he's a psychopath with a current agenda

I realise you're trolling, but I'll bite anyway.

Answer:

He's both.

Most psychopaths, crooks, liars, con men, whatever you want to call them, are.