Rupp is what we though Ritz should have been

I think Ritz is what we thought he should have been.

And we let him off the hook!

I totally agree with this. Ritz is one of the greatest talents this country has ever produced and he's always itched at greatness... he just needs that defining moment. A NYC Marathon win would be the feather in his cap.

If you want to crown him then crown his @ss! He is what we thought he was and we let him off the hook!

Ritz has had a better career than any American distance runner in the generation before him.

Is that a disappointment?

He still has a better 5000 PR than Rupp and marathon PR (for now).

YAWN

Ritz never had the raw speed to do any of the faster things Rupp did.

Crackholme wrote:

Ritz never had the raw speed to do any of the faster things Rupp did.

Ritz ran 4:05 as a junior in high school and a 3:43ish 1500 at Pac 10s as a warm up for NCAAs. To say he doesn't have raw speed is an understatement. He was the type of high schooler who ran 1:54 on windy days in April. It is not Webb but he is 3:51-3:53 material all the way if he had wanted it.

Ritz won two Footlocker XC titles, NCAA xc, World XC Junior bronze behind Bekele, World Half Marathon bronze in 60:00, 27:22 10k at World's in 2009 as well, along with an American Record 12:56 5000m that year, took multiple American titles, is, I think, #3 all-time American in the marathon at 2:07:47 behind Hall and Khannouchi, and qualified for three Olympic teams. He currently has better pr's than Rupp at 5000m, half marathon, and marathon, despite being injured for much of his career.

different look wrote:

Ritz ran 4:05 as a junior in high school and a 3:43ish 1500 at Pac 10s as a warm up for NCAAs. To say he doesn't have raw speed is an understatement. He was the type of high schooler who ran 1:54 on windy days in April. It is not Webb but he is 3:51-3:53 material all the way if he had wanted it.

800m and 1500m is not raw speed.

different look wrote:

Crackholme wrote:

Ritz never had the raw speed to do any of the faster things Rupp did.

Ritz ran 4:05 as a junior in high school and a 3:43ish 1500 at Pac 10s as a warm up for NCAAs. To say he doesn't have raw speed is an understatement. He was the type of high schooler who ran 1:54 on windy days in April. It is not Webb but he is 3:51-3:53 material all the way if he had wanted it.

Overstatement

When Ritz was in high school he was the first high school runner I ever drove more than 60 miles to watch a high school race. High school running was so bad I had no interest to watch talent jogging 9:30 3200's to easily win I still remember the day I used to get The Harrier mailing and was shocked to see a high school junior won Footlocker in a 14:29 on the Orlando course. And also shocked to see that 3 others were right behind! High school long distance running was in deep decline for that last 10 years.

And then I watched him in the 2001 US championships 5000 run a 13:44 5000 after a season of probably racing 50 times for his high school team.

I never thought of him as being as being a future world record holder. Just the only American born distance runner that might have the rare talent to medal in the Olympics on the track for the first time since 1964.

Rupp obviously has the better International career with his two Olympic medals. And he developed the ability to run 1:48 800's and 52 last laps in long distance track races. I don't think Ritz had that ability and that's why he moved the marathon early. And went down and ran a 12:58 AR 5000.

different look wrote:

To say he doesn't have raw speed is an understatement..

OK he REALLY didn't have the raw speed.

It wasn't a question of wanting to, he NEEDED to have well under 4 speed and he did not.

I could agree except for Ritz's lack of kick.

Did Ritz ever run a lap faster than 60 seconds? I'm sure he did but I don't recall ever seeing him do it including his 5000M AR run.

I think that Meb would be a better template for Ritz.

Star wrote:

Ritz has had a better career than any American distance runner in the generation before him.

Is that a disappointment?

He still has a better 5000 PR than Rupp and marathon PR (for now).

Wow, I'd have to vehemently disagree. Bob Kennedy has a far better resume than Ritz. How many AR's does Ritz have? National Championships? International placings?

different look wrote:

Crackholme wrote:

Ritz never had the raw speed to do any of the faster things Rupp did.

Ritz ran 4:05 as a junior in high school and a 3:43ish 1500 at Pac 10s as a warm up for NCAAs. To say he doesn't have raw speed is an understatement. He was the type of high schooler who ran 1:54 on windy days in April. It is not Webb but he is 3:51-3:53 material all the way if he had wanted it.

Moran.

Zoom Kennedy wrote:

Star wrote:

Ritz has had a better career than any American distance runner in the generation before him.

Is that a disappointment?

He still has a better 5000 PR than Rupp and marathon PR (for now).

Wow, I'd have to vehemently disagree. Bob Kennedy has a far better resume than Ritz. How many AR's does Ritz have? National Championships? International placings?

Ritz (9th '07 WC, 9th '08 OG, 6th '09 WC, 10th '13 WC) has 4 international top tens (plus jr XC and world half bronze) versus Kennedy's 3 top tens (6th '96 OG, 6th '07 WC, 9th '99 WC). Ritz also has a faster PR in Kennedy's primary event, which is probably Ritz's 3rd or maybe even 4th best event.

I think they're actually pretty close. Kennedy is not "far better".

Ritz exceeded Kennedy.

Kennedy was very good in the 5000 but that's all that he did well in at the international level. And he ran on one Olympic team.

His best finish in an Olympics or World Championship was 6th.

Ritz's 3rd in that Zurich 5000 in 12:56 was pretty good.

He made Olympic teams in the 10,000 and marathon.

His best finish in an Olympics or World Championship was also 6th (10,000m).

Ritz was more versatile and I think he had an overall better international career than Bob Kennedy.