After a two year hiatus, Everest is open for business. Three climbers have died in three days. Should they shut it down for the rest of the year?
After a two year hiatus, Everest is open for business. Three climbers have died in three days. Should they shut it down for the rest of the year?
In addition, two climbers from India have been missing for two days at 8000 meters..
The die are usually the ones who don't know when to stop. They don't heed the rules, like turn around at noon, regardless of where you are, and go back. But, some would rather die try and admit defeat.
Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle. The traffic jam going up and down that mountain has become so great and the skill level of the "climbers" (who have to practically be carried up there by the sherpas) so low that all these fatalities are not surprising at all.
Emmanuel Goldstein wrote:
Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle. The traffic jam going up and down that mountain has become so great and the skill level of the "climbers" (who have to practically be carried up there by the sherpas) so low that all these fatalities are not surprising at all.
I find it extremely odd that this is always your contribution in any mention of Everest. Unfortunately, it seems that all you know about the mountain is what you have "heard" or possibly even read. I'm quite confident that you haven't even been to The Himalaya. That is very obvious. Go give it a try, and I assure you that you'll have changed your tune. Until then, your comments remain ill contrived and without depth.
He makes a good point. Sometimes, a good point is worth repeating. For those considering Everest, they NEED to know about the clogging on the mountain in the critical zone. It is a very serious issue and very costly. For what it is worth, he may save someone's life who was considering Everest, when it isn't worth the risk especially if you have a family and aren't the most selfish dude around...
The prospects of jamin finding himself a GF on Everest are quite high. She might be a tad bit too cold for his liking though
Emmanuel Goldstein wrote:
Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle.
So what you're saying is that Mike Rossi will soon be climbing Everest?!? Hell, dude probably won't break a sweat in qualifying to climb it.
never for me wrote:
He makes a good point. Sometimes, a good point is worth repeating. For those considering Everest, they NEED to know about the clogging on the mountain in the critical zone. It is a very serious issue and very costly. For what it is worth, he may save someone's life who was considering Everest, when it isn't worth the risk especially if you have a family and aren't the most selfish dude around...
Let's hope no one is making the decision to try or not try climbing Everest based on advice found here.
Emmanuel Goldstein wrote:
Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle. The traffic jam going up and down that mountain has become so great and the skill level of the "climbers" (who have to practically be carried up there by the sherpas) so low that all these fatalities are not surprising at all.
Agreed. Not even that great of an accomplishment these days either. People should stop. Obviously still an element of danger, but the way the Sherpas do just about everything for you, it's nothing to brag about. Someone wants to do it just to have done it but then they never talk about it ever -- ok then. Otherwise, I'm not impressed.
Turn around fools wrote:
The die are usually the ones who don't know when to stop. They don't heed the rules, like turn around at noon, regardless of where you are, and go back. But, some would rather die try and admit defeat.
Not necessarily. There are objective risks and subjective risks in climbing --- the risk of dying in an avalanche or a giant, unpredictable snowstorm, is less about the person and more about luck/chance/statistics. The risk of dying from a misstep, not clipping into the rope, spilling water in the tent, not securing the tent properly, etc are affected by the person.
It's not just about being stubborn and not heeding the rules... sometimes you follow the rules, turn back when you should, but still get trapped in an avy in the icefall.
As a mild recreation climber, such topics used to interest me. Now I've come to realize that there are simply a lot of narcissistic people in the world who will risk death for ego inflation.
So I encourage people to focus their energies on issues that really matter to the world. Things like outing Paula Radcliffe for her doping.
Why would they shut it down?
Climbers dying on Everest is not a source of concern for me in any way. These are big boys and girls who know the risks and take their chances. I'm good with them having that choice.
The people who have died this year got sick, and then died before they could get lower. This is a matter of luck. In addition most who die on Everest die on the way down.400 people have sumutted this year so far. Everest has a mortality rate if 2% so we can expect 5 more deaths at least. K2 has a 20-25% rate.
Turn around fools wrote:
The die are usually the ones who don't know when to stop. They don't heed the rules, like turn around at noon, regardless of where you are, and go back. But, some would rather die try and admit defeat.
Mountain Madness wrote:
Emmanuel Goldstein wrote:Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle. The traffic jam going up and down that mountain has become so great and the skill level of the "climbers" (who have to practically be carried up there by the sherpas) so low that all these fatalities are not surprising at all.
I find it extremely odd that this is always your contribution in any mention of Everest. Unfortunately, it seems that all you know about the mountain is what you have "heard" or possibly even read. I'm quite confident that you haven't even been to The Himalaya. That is very obvious. Go give it a try, and I assure you that you'll have changed your tune. Until then, your comments remain ill contrived and without depth.
Actually Goldstein makes valid point(s). Everest should have a qualifier (Mt. McKinley AKA Mt. Denali) like Boston, and the qualifier should be climbed solo & without oxygen.
Flagpole wrote:
Agreed. Not even that great of an accomplishment these days either. People should stop. Obviously still an element of danger, but the way the Sherpas do just about everything for you, it's nothing to brag about. Someone wants to do it just to have done it but then they never talk about it ever -- ok then. Otherwise, I'm not impressed.
People should stop simply because you think they should?
mid-40s Sex God wrote:
The people who have died this year got sick, and then died before they could get lower. This is a matter of luck. In addition most who die on Everest die on the way down.
400 people have sumutted this year so far. Everest has a mortality rate if 2% so we can expect 5 more deaths at least. K2 has a 20-25% rate.
Turn around fools wrote:The die are usually the ones who don't know when to stop. They don't heed the rules, like turn around at noon, regardless of where you are, and go back. But, some would rather die try and admit defeat.
There are four dead as of today. But deaths on Everest sometimes happen in bunches. It's not a linear trend.
never for me wrote:
He makes a good point. Sometimes, a good point is worth repeating. For those considering Everest, they NEED to know about the clogging on the mountain in the critical zone. It is a very serious issue and very costly. For what it is worth, he may save someone's life who was considering Everest, when it isn't worth the risk especially if you have a family and aren't the most selfish dude around...
You think those on the mountain don't know about the clogging? It's never mentioned in all their training with their guides? They've never heard about the Hillary Step and the lines there? Or the ladders across the ice field? They don't happen to notice all the tents at base camp and the other camps up the mountain? They don't happen to start early to avoid the crowds at key bottlenecks? Someone. Quick get on the satellite phone and make the climbers aware of this.
Flagpole wrote:
Emmanuel Goldstein wrote:Climbing Everest has become a bucket list thing--just like doing Boston, for everyone and his uncle. The traffic jam going up and down that mountain has become so great and the skill level of the "climbers" (who have to practically be carried up there by the sherpas) so low that all these fatalities are not surprising at all.
Agreed. Not even that great of an accomplishment these days either. People should stop. Obviously still an element of danger, but the way the Sherpas do just about everything for you, it's nothing to brag about. Someone wants to do it just to have done it but then they never talk about it ever -- ok then. Otherwise, I'm not impressed.
I can't remember the last time anyone mentioned to me how they'd climbed Everest, but maybe I'm just traveling in the wrong circles.
low skill level and also extremely high climbing fees, which really reduce the desire to do the right thing and turn around before the clouds come in. Even back in the early 1990s when I trekked in Nepal, the climbing fees were already something like $10,000 for many of the mountains. How many people are going to pay tens of thousands of dollars to climb Everest and then turn back at noon without getting to the summit? Lower the fees markedly, reduce the # of permits markedly (clamp down on the resulting black market), require a high skill level, and allow time for multiple attempts, and you'd see a reduction in deaths.