Hill and BTC should have been DQ'd for pacesetting

You strike me as a person who consumes his own nitrogenous waste on a daily basis.

I'm not hearing a "no they shouldn't be DQ'd because _____"

anyone else?

I disagree. Pacesetting is fine in this sort of race (i.e. non-paced) so long as the individual doing the pacing gives a genuine effort. For example, doesn't anyone remember how there were constant demands for the Kenyans and Ethiopians to "work together" to set a fast pace and burn out Farah? I really doubt anyone would have seen it as an issue if Gebremeskel and Gebriwhet decided to trade leads for a full race and force an Olympic/World Championship to be fast.

The real problem with this is that Lomong and some of the others may not have been giving a genuine effort. In Lomong's case, it was kind of obvious given his dropout once he slowed.

firstly, it wouldn't be Hill that is DQed. It would be Bayer, Lomong, and then Jager. Seeing as Bayer and Jager both finished their races (without literally jogging it in) it comes down to Lomong. I personally spoke to some of the BTC guys about this today (sat) and they were all genuinely surprised when Lomong dropped. So that obviously wasn't the plan, despite appearances. and I'll admit that it appeared like pacing.

The other argument: running a fast pace in the early stages of a race doesn't mean you're pacing. The BTC guys other than Hill all benefit by having the race be close to 7:30. In a 7:50 race you have to worry about lots of people in the field like Lagat, Heath, Jenkins, etc. SO the BTC guys agree to run fast because it benefits their whole group, as long as they hold it together, which obviously didn't happen aside from Hill.

I'll call bs on them not knowing he was pacing and going to drop out. He ran through the line and ran straight onto the turn, only turning when he hit lane six, coating to a stop in lane six. Nobody drops from a race this way just because they're hurting.

The announcer in the field even said "and Lomong drops out, his apparent pacing duties finished."

No reasonable person would think this was unintentional or unplanned for him to drop.

But trading leads isn't pacing. Trading leads is of course allowed in the rules.

It is pacing that is against the rules.

But the question remains of who should be punished and how? That isn't covered in the rule book.

I think pacing should result in a suspension against the one pacing.

Bad Wigins wrote:

I haven't seen video of this race, but judging by the article, Lomong's early exit is proof enough that he was not a "participant" under 144.1(a)

The IAAF has never interpreted its own rule this way, so who are you to say?

If an athlete is entered in the race and starts with everyone else, the athlete is a participant. As long as that athlete doesn't violate the "lapped or about to be lapped" provision, there's no issue.

The significance you attach to the specific approval for an officially designated pacesetter is again your own, not the IAAF's. The provision serves to emphasize the point that, as long as an athlete starts with everyone else, there is no violation, even if he is designated and paid for the pacing purpose. That's it.

(I am leaving aside any "mixed gender" issues, which have no pertinence in the context under discussion.)

I thought it was just another case of Lomong miscounting laps.

More importantly:

"pacing in running or walking events by persons not participating in the event, by competitors lapped or about to be lapped, or by any kind of technical device other than those permitted under Rule 144.3 (i)".

Lomong wasn't lapped now, was he?

As others have said, Lomong was a participant in the race, he started and whether he finished or not is irrelevant, he could have tripped or anything. Not finishing isn't not being a participant.

I think you have deliberately misinterpreted that rule in order to try and create a controversial thread.

Metric Miler wrote:

I think you have deliberately misinterpreted that rule in order to try and create a controversial thread.

Bad Wigins being disingenuous, I'm shocked at his lack of candor...SHOCKED

Metric Miler wrote:

I think you have deliberately misinterpreted that rule in order to try and create a controversial thread.

You're wrong. He's just not very a smart person.

Jerry Schumacher, and by default the USATF and even Alberto Salazar, by dint of a lack of any protest whatsoever much less sanction of any kind, all feel that BTC was within the rules. Eric Jenkins, who was perhaps most negatively impacted ny the tactics, felt that BTC caught him by surprise but showed no animosity hatsoever. That is because he is a class act.

Meanwhile an notoriously weak-minded troll on LRC has proclaimed otherwise. He and he alone knows and should enforce the Almighty Rules as he interprets them. May all of us not sleep until Bad Wigins' crusade is justified with sanctions. penalties and beatings administered by an anonymous torturer wearing Galen Rupp's pollen mask!

BTC may not have technically broken the rules, but the whole spectacle was a little distasteful. As others have noted, LRC would be exploding if NOP had done the same thing.

Hill should not have been disqualified.

He was impeded by runners getting in his way ahead of him.

badtasteinmouth wrote:

LRC would be exploding if NOP had done the same thing.

Um, no.

Which four NOP men could even run 1,600 in 4:03 and 2,000 in 5:06 right now? (And which three could still finish a 3000 after that?)

Not RUPP.

FARAH isn't exactly "available."

Even if he could hold the pace, LEVINS isn't American.

CENTRO? No.

This race showed that BTC is the strongest distance track group in the US right now. Probably in the world.

sub-elite couch wrote:

Hill should not have been disqualified.

He was impeded by runners getting in his way ahead of him.

Has he officially been DQ'd or is the OP just speculating?

Rules...no wonder the sport isn't more popular. the sport shouldn't be so damn complicate.

reed wrote:

firstly, it wouldn't be Hill that is DQed. It would be Bayer, Lomong, and then Jager. Seeing as Bayer and Jager both finished their races (without literally jogging it in) it comes down to Lomong.

Why would Jager have been DQed even with the OPs idiotic premise being etched in any reality?

What? LOL

When was the last time any of these mother Fukers medaled ?

Did you even use your pea size brain b4 u wrote that shid???