I will "prove" that god does not exist.
Hey, "god, you can blow me" !
See, nothing happened, hence god does not exist
I will "prove" that god does not exist.
Hey, "god, you can blow me" !
See, nothing happened, hence god does not exist
I feel sorry for his students wrote:
To all the atheists wrote:Would you be shocked to find out that the Big Bang Theory was first formulated by a Catholic priest, Fr. Georges Lemaitre?:
http://www.amnh.org/education/resources/rfl/web/essaybooks/cosmic/p_lemaitre.htmlBefore you discredit him, realize that he also held a PhD in physics from MIT.
So? Plenty of well-educated and smart people believe in god. It doesn't mean that god exists.
still feeling sorry for my students? The courtesy of a reply would be appreciated!
As to your post, it also doesn't mean God doesn't exists either, does it?
Some day when each of us takes our last breath, then and only then will we know if ours was the correctly held position/belief.
Until then we are akin to two squirrels chasing each other around the tree. From a distance it's very amusing to watch. However, using insults (like the flying spaghetti monster in the sky, really, are you 12 years old?) or personal attacks concerning mental capacity, is not a very productive way for any of us to try to state our position or our deeply held beliefs.
Just Saying.... wrote:
Just look at the 6000 different sects of Christianity all derived from a common source. Which one is right?
Protestantism is quite fissiparous. But Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy are very similar doctrinally: one of the principle differences is not that there is a papacy but how it is exercised, for example. Catholicism (~ 1 billion) and Eastern Orthodoxy (~200 million) account for roughly two-thirds of all Christians globally.
former atheist 23 wrote:
Correct. Particles have been shown to appear from quantum foam. Which is not "nothing".
But atheists can keep on bleating about how theists fail to provide proof. Once someone proves that mass can arise from literally nothing, I'll believe the universe can exist uncaused.
As a former atheist, I can certainly appreciate the arguments. And no, the term "atheist" has not lost its negative connotation. The New Atheists are as irritating to me now and Christian fundamentalists screeching at me from college campuses were 25 years ago.
DING DING DING
WE HAVE A WINNER!
Smooth Playa wrote:
[quote]former atheist 23 wrote:
Correct. Particles have been shown to appear from quantum foam. Which is not "nothing".
But atheists can keep on bleating about how theists fail to provide proof. Once someone proves that mass can arise from literally nothing, I'll believe the universe can exist uncaused.
As a former atheist, I can certainly appreciate the arguments. And no, the term "atheist" has not lost its negative connotation. The New Atheists are as irritating to me now and Christian fundamentalists screeching at me from college campuses were 25 years ago.
"Screeching at me" - the theist, so childishly prone to placing himself at the center of all stories. Much like toddlers.
There's no way at all to know what's happening outside our "universe", or what was happening before the big bang. It could be that the big bang happened in a corner of a much larger universe-- it could be that big bangs happen all the time. We don't really know; maybe there is a god controlling all this stuff, and maybe not. Though of course, the idea that this God takes a deep interest in the behavior of humans and all that seems pretty unlikely.
Why are you wrote:
I feel sorry for his students wrote:So? Plenty of well-educated and smart people believe in god. It doesn't mean that god exists.
still feeling sorry for my students? The courtesy of a reply would be appreciated!
As to your post, it also doesn't mean God doesn't exists either, does it?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Neither you, nor anyone else has provided even ordinary proof.
"Some day when each of us takes our last breath, then and only then will we know if ours was the correctly held position/belief."
I've seen this and similar statements many times. There's actually no reason to think it is true.
When we die and our brain ceases to function, there's no reason to think that any kind of "knowing" can or will take place.
The quoted statement is just another example of begging the question--that is, assuming what needs to be proved. You need to demonstrate that anything (well, besides decomposition) takes place after death...before talking about knowing something after death.
This short 44s clip sums it all up nicely:
An unexplained Higher Power. wrote:
Just Saying.... wrote:Does any religion explain how their god was created? The god who created god is the deity I want to worship.
A common argument from atheists and skeptics is that if all things need a cause, then God must also need a cause. The conclusion is that if God needed a cause, then God is not God (and if God is not God, then of course there is no God). This is a slightly more sophisticated form of the basic question “Who made God?†Everyone knows that something does not come from nothing. So, if God is a “something,†then He must have a cause, right?
The question is tricky because it sneaks in the false assumption that God came from somewhere and then asks where that might be. The answer is that the question does not even make sense. It is like asking, “What does blue smell like?†Blue is not in the category of things that have a smell, so the question itself is flawed. In the same way, God is not in the category of things that are created or caused. God is uncaused and uncreated—He simply exists.
How do we know this? We know that from nothing, nothing comes. So, if there were ever a time when there was absolutely nothing in existence, then nothing would have ever come into existence. But things do exist. Therefore, since there could never have been absolutely nothing, something had to have always been in existence. That ever-existing thing is what we call God. God is the uncaused Being that caused everything else to come into existence. God is the uncreated Creator who created the universe and everything in it.
Why not just say the stuff making up the universe is the ever existing thing? Why do you need to make up God?
Smooth Playa wrote:
Lyndon LaRouche wrote:[quote]An unexplained Higher Power. wrote:
We know that from nothing, nothing comes. So, if there were ever a time when there was absolutely nothing in existence, then nothing would have ever come into existence. But things do exist. Therefore, since there could never have been absolutely nothing, something had to have always been in existence.
You need to read up on quantum mechanics. Particles occur from nothing all the time. The Casimir effect for one.
Agreed that the statement "We know that from nothing, nothing comes." doesn't hold up but science is still a long way from understanding how a universe can pop up out of nothing.
Just to be clear, particle/antiparticle pairs do pop out of the vacuum but it takes energy and so this mostly happens with very small particles (like the photons in the Casimir effect). For particles with mass, the probability goes like exp(-m/T) where m is the mass of the particle and T the temperature so it's really hard to create even a hydrogen atom this way. Plugging something like the mass of the universe into that equation is just silly--way outside the bounds of applicability of the model. Also, we are talking about the creation of matter/antimatter pairs yet in the universe the antimatter appears to be missing. The origin of the universe can't be explained away as a routine quantum fluctuation.
halfast wrote:
God these threads are stupid.
I hear ya mon.
We are ALL atheists.
I just just have one more on my list than most.
An unexplained Higher Power. wrote:
Just Saying.... wrote:Does any religion explain how their god was created? The god who created god is the deity I want to worship.
A common argument from atheists and skeptics is that if all things need a cause, then God must also need a cause. The conclusion is that if God needed a cause, then God is not God (and if God is not God, then of course there is no God). This is a slightly more sophisticated form of the basic question “Who made God?†Everyone knows that something does not come from nothing. So, if God is a “something,†then He must have a cause, right?
The question is tricky because it sneaks in the false assumption that God came from somewhere and then asks where that might be. The answer is that the question does not even make sense. It is like asking, “What does blue smell like?†Blue is not in the category of things that have a smell, so the question itself is flawed. In the same way, God is not in the category of things that are created or caused. God is uncaused and uncreated—He simply exists.
How do we know this? We know that from nothing, nothing comes. So, if there were ever a time when there was absolutely nothing in existence, then nothing would have ever come into existence. But things do exist. Therefore, since there could never have been absolutely nothing, something had to have always been in existence. That ever-existing thing is what we call God. God is the uncaused Being that caused everything else to come into existence. God is the uncreated Creator who created the universe and everything in it.
This. Very well said. I will be stealing this. If only you had used a registered name, I could have given you credit ;-)
I understand why everyone may not be CHRISTIAN (shoot, folks MET Jesus back in the day and still didn't believe), but I simply cannot fathom why and how people do not understand that God exists.
Well I do have advanced degrees in biology, can I talk about evolution? Or is that left for guys like Disco Gary and Rojo?
thejeff wrote:
An unexplained Higher Power. wrote:A common argument from atheists and skeptics is that if all things need a cause, then God must also need a cause. The conclusion is that if God needed a cause, then God is not God (and if God is not God, then of course there is no God). This is a slightly more sophisticated form of the basic question “Who made God?†Everyone knows that something does not come from nothing. So, if God is a “something,†then He must have a cause, right?
The question is tricky because it sneaks in the false assumption that God came from somewhere and then asks where that might be. The answer is that the question does not even make sense. It is like asking, “What does blue smell like?†Blue is not in the category of things that have a smell, so the question itself is flawed. In the same way, God is not in the category of things that are created or caused. God is uncaused and uncreated—He simply exists.
How do we know this? We know that from nothing, nothing comes. So, if there were ever a time when there was absolutely nothing in existence, then nothing would have ever come into existence. But things do exist. Therefore, since there could never have been absolutely nothing, something had to have always been in existence. That ever-existing thing is what we call God. God is the uncaused Being that caused everything else to come into existence. God is the uncreated Creator who created the universe and everything in it.
This. Very well said. I will be stealing this. If only you had used a registered name, I could have given you credit ;-)
I understand why everyone may not be CHRISTIAN (shoot, folks MET Jesus back in the day and still didn't believe), but I simply cannot fathom why and how people do not understand that God exists.
Some people have the ability to remove themselves from their own bias and look at religion from a birds eye view. 6,000 religions were created by man over time and they have similar patterns. They explain the meaning of life and ensure that there's an afterlife. They provide people comfort and make uncertainty easier to grapple with. If that's what you need to make you feel more comfortable, then to each their own.
But when 2 of the top 3 GOP candidates are running on the religious platform that's absurd. Making policy decisions based on the bible is no different than Obama forcing every building to be constructed with brick because he worships the 3 little pigs.
yoyoyoy wrote:
thejeff wrote:This. Very well said. I will be stealing this. If only you had used a registered name, I could have given you credit ;-)
I understand why everyone may not be CHRISTIAN (shoot, folks MET Jesus back in the day and still didn't believe), but I simply cannot fathom why and how people do not understand that God exists.
Some people have the ability to remove themselves from their own bias and look at religion from a birds eye view. 6,000 religions were created by man over time and they have similar patterns. They explain the meaning of life and ensure that there's an afterlife. They provide people comfort and make uncertainty easier to grapple with. If that's what you need to make you feel more comfortable, then to each their own.
But when 2 of the top 3 GOP candidates are running on the religious platform that's absurd. Making policy decisions based on the bible is no different than Obama forcing every building to be constructed with brick because he worships the 3 little pigs.
I am not talking about religion. I am talking about God.
PS- you already made that comment earlier (or you stole it from someone else)
thejeff wrote:
[quote]An unexplained Higher Power. wrote:
This. Very well said. I will be stealing this. If only you had used a registered name, I could have given you credit ;-)
I understand why everyone may not be CHRISTIAN (shoot, folks MET Jesus back in the day and still didn't believe), but I simply cannot fathom why and how people do not understand that God exists.
We're telling you why and how we don't BELIEVE (not understand) this. Belief in a God is based on unprovable assumptions, so while I can understand why people believe, I don't find any of the arguments very compelling.
For instance, why do we have to accept that something had to have created the universe? Maybe instead, the universe just exists because of the physical laws governing the area in which it exists, the same way an incredible river can travel thousands of miles due to simple geography. Why are the laws the way they are? Maybe they just are, and there is no reason, no cause. Humans are very good at seeing patterns, but this ability causes us to invent narratives and causation out of randomness. We are naturally inclined to see cause and effect even when none exists
Green Table Mountain wrote:
Well I do have advanced degrees in biology, can I talk about evolution? Or is that left for guys like Disco Gary and Rojo?
Do you want to talk about adaptation instead? I only ask because adaptation has been proven to exist.