Nike Free?

try it -- see how it feels, have someone who knows what to look for ensure that it's not causing over pronation -- be sure to distinguish between natural motion and excessive

thanks trackhead. how much mileage could one run in the free's? Could I do all my training in them (~100 mpw at full wolume)?

sure -- you'd probably have at least a modest adjustment to them. I've got a friend of mine who I train with a few times per week -- he's been running between 100 and now 150 mpw since June, and he's doing most of his running in the H Streets, which is essentially a track spike. Mind you, he's had other shoes a long the way, but I'd venture to guess that he has ~1200mi on those H Streets.

You'll know when it's time to retire the shoes. His clue was the upper tearing off the midsole.

I should add, please feel free to ask anything else. I'm switching internet providers right now, so I don't have service at home for at least a week, so if I odn't get back to you right away, you know why.

trackhead, I know efficiency plays a large role in how fast a shoe wears. What I am essentially trying to do is get down to a lower heel. I have a somewhat high arch, but normal when flexed. I used to wear orthos with asics 2000 series, then went to adidas taper, then the elite, all with orthos though. I have found that I pronate much less in a shoe that has a lower heel height, but I hear the FREE really isn't that low? Eventually I would love to do all my training in a pair of H-streets, but my feet are not ready yet. I completely believe in all the logic behind the entire minimal paradigm, so are the FREE's sans orthos a step in the right direction? the only injury problems I have had in the past have been shins, and arch problems, most recent PF (which slightly tore during a recent race), but I don't want it to come back. So is going minimal the best way to strengthen my PF?

The Free is lower than avg. The women's is not as low, but still OK.

If you liked the Elite, try working yourself into the NB 900 w/o orthodics. I truly beleive that, once under control, PF is best delt with by strengthening the foot. People battle PF for decades because they just treat the symptomes instead of solving the problem. Their feet are weak and esaily irritated.

Give either the Free or NB 900 a shot -- it's hard for me to say which would be better without watching you run, and I know availabilty isn't the same as with a 2090, but if possible, try the two and see which you like best. Make sure you've got a good set of eyes on you looking for exaggerated motion.

Also, start incorporating 10-15min of barefoot running on grass 2-3 times per week. If it's uncomfortable to run ,then do walking first, and just build very gradually. It took me about 8 mos. before I was doing 60min runs without shoes. This is huge in terms of strengthening the foot

I do have the means of getting the FREE. I did look into the 900, but I want to give the FREE a shot. I have been videotaped running in the elites (without orthos) with no exaggerated motion. It is getting cold outside, but I will still try to get in some barefoot runs after I heal. I really tweaked an already tight plantar in an xc race this past weekend, so am taking time off to heal :(.

I've come around to running in flats, i ran a couple miles in the elites today and my legs just have too much motion going on, so i am converted to flats. I bought the Frees a couple of days ago but have yet to run in them really, I also bought the cross training ones and am considering using them as my trainers because they have more upper stability and are stronger, plus the fron strap should help, what do you think?

I will probably go with the running ones. How do they compare to flats for you as far as motion goes? More/less?

Do any of the people on this thread train in the Nike Waffles? I am curious if I could train on pavement while wearing them. (if so how many miles could I expect out of them)

The 900 is good advice.

I like the Free a lot, I think they could be helpful for PF (though have seen no evidence of this), I would just be concerned with doing that much mileage in them.

But I'm a slow fat white guy that hasn't seen that kind of weekly mileage in a looong time.

Good luck.

definitely don't train in nike waffles on pavement...very bad idea. you'll almost definitely get yourself in trouble there. if you want to train in light-weight shoes try out a pair of asics gel ds trainers. they're light trainers and have some motion control in there for pronation. my last pair was good for about 500 miles...probably could have pushed another 50 - 100 out of them, but the safe bet is 500 on them.

Ds trainers are not flexible enough. NB 900!Waffles(though not on the road).

Does anyone on this thread train in the FREE? I have done a search on this board and read virtually everything about them. Everything I have read has been positive regarding thier feel and ride. The only negatives I have heard are that they are not a true minimal shoe, like say the H Street. I know this is true, but I see the FREE as a stepping stone into the H Street for myself. How does the fit of the FREE compare to other nike trainers? How do they do on roads vs. trails?

Is a minimalsit approach suitable for a flat fotted runner.?

or should orthos be used as well?

thanks

bad idea wrote:

definitely don't train in nike waffles on pavement...very bad idea. you'll almost definitely get yourself in trouble there. if you want to train in light-weight shoes try out a pair of asics gel ds trainers. they're light trainers and have some motion control in there for pronation. my last pair was good for about 500 miles...probably could have pushed another 50 - 100 out of them, but the safe bet is 500 on them.

Pronation is what you are supposed to do. It should not be controlled. You shouldn't run in a shoe that causes excess motion, nor prevents natural motion.

I only do 1-2 runs a week in them and I'm not doing heavy mileage right now. I recall some earlier threads where people were claiming higher mileage, but lots of cautions too in doing that.

Yes, they will be a good transition shoe. I like them a lot. I have 150 miles on my pair with almost no wear. The very flexible forefoot tires my foot more than any lack of support. Relative to the forefoot, the heel is lower than trainers and some flats. The Hs are about 12/7; the Tiger Paws are 20/10, but feel more like 19/10 because the forefoot is firm; and the Frees are about 21/13 (not sure on this). The Frees do kind of guide your foot more than a shoe like the Hs or Tiger Paws because the Frees are designed to put the foot in the position it usually is when running barefoot. Bottom line -- good transition shoe, but you'll still probably have to build your mileage in them gradually.

most people I've spoken with have experience some minor soreness in the soleus and forefoot, but soreness that passes relatively quickly.

Just work in to it. It's more shoe than the H Street and I know guys that have 150mi weeks on those.