Master struggling with recovery

Are you dealing with fatigue or are you beat up? If you are beat up try a pair of Hoka's on your in between days. If you are tired make sure you're getting vitamins and eating enough good foods. Also run/walk on those between/recovery days is not a bad thing. My background; age 61 running since 1967. Not fast but still going.

very similar situation - have had similar issues - my advice

start with diet - look at what and when you eat in the several hours prior - maybe just blood sugar issues

next look at pounding - softer surfaces or shoes - elliptical or bike on non-running days

next look at muscle fitness - yoga and squats - i found the in the few years since age 45, i've had to spend much more time on weakening legs

Thanks for the reply. It is fatigue, not beat up legs. I feel like I eat pretty well. I might start walking/jogging to keep the weight off.

check your blood sugar for diabetes issues with the bonking (low blood sugar in the middle of your runs). or just eat a piece of bread or something before your runs.

Thanks for the response. I am running in the morning around 6 on an empty stomach, which is how I have done it for years. Maybe blood sugar is the issue. I hadn't thought of that. The problem is get up at 5 and I usually have to wait 3 hours after I eat to run or I get an upset stomach. How could you deal with this issue if you are running in the morning?

I also agree leg strength is lacking.

I did the same thing for years. Now I have to put something in my belly. Try just a piece of toast with jam. Start with that during your easy runs to see how it works. Even some honey in your coffee could help. I definitely agree on the strength training.

How long before your run do you eat?

i run in the morning, but i'm also still getting by without eating beforehand. maybe you need something in there before you go. toast or a bagel with something sweet like fruit preserves or apple jelly might be worth trying. and with something simple like this, i don't think you'd need to wait long - 45 minutes maybe? NO DAIRY!

and you need to work on the weak legs, so that running slower isn't tiring.

pick hillier routes on the days you feel flat, reverse psychology for the legs.

I'll eat 10-15 minutes before I run. The first 15-30 minutes of my runs are always easy. I figure it's 30-45 minutes before I do anything resembling a workout.

not from here anymore wrote:

...toast or a bagel with ... apple jelly

i meant apple butter. yummy stuff from the PA dutch.

I am 65 and I still get up at 4:30-5:00am have 2 cups of coffee and get out the door at 5:30-6:00 for 8-10 miles, and really don't have any blood sugar/fuel issues. I regret to inform you that a large part of the issue probably is being older and having your recovery rate slow down. I had younger children and a high energy job in my mid-40s so I understand your challenge. You probably need to find both a recovery pace and workout intensity levels that work better for your current physiology. I would suggest trying to reduce the intensity of your hard days slightly, and be reconciled to either try walking on your recovery days or walk a mile/easy run a mile alternating on your recovery days. I know the kind of fatigue you are talking about and now I recognize that sometimes I just need to put in some walking recovery days to get past it. I can still run a high 18s 5K, but a lot of my recovery runs will be in the mid-10 to 11:00 pace range. If I find myself going over 11:00 pace on a recovery run, I switch to walking 4 miles the next day and then see how I feel the following day. So far it has been my experience since about age 55 that more running volume and less intensity produces better fitness for the 5k-10k range I do most of my racing in.

I second this. Slow volume is the key, in contrast to the common refrain that older runners need speed. I once bought into that, and found myself on a cycle of fast-wrecked-lousy-ok-fast-wrecked.... Lotta older guys light up when I describe this cycle, ("yeah, me too!").

I'm 55, and am feeling better now than in my 40s. Slower, obviously, eg 9:23 3k today vs 8:5x in 40s, but I'm ok with that. Age happens. In any case, I never get near that pace in training, ever. The past two years I've worked on volume, posture and core strength, in that order of priority.

No slow is too slow, although as I've gotten healthier my daily paces have increased. But I always start at a crawl, and hope nobody I know sees me.

I occasionally hit the track or tm for tempo, once a week at most, and never much under 6:00 pace, or I'm asking for trouble. After 40+ years of running, and several years where injuries made me think the end was near, I'm grateful for this "rebirth", however long it lasts.

zatopek3210 wrote:

One solution I have come up with is two days hard in a row, with the next two days totally off. This works pretty well and I feel recovered when it is time to run hard again. I can run good quality two days in a row but the third I always feel like crap whether the two days are easy or hard.

You appear to be trying to run hard every day. You're getting tired from running too hard, too many days in a row, and not recovering. Try running hard just one day a week, and running easy or steady how you feel on the other days. See what works best for you, then keep doing the same thing.

Here's a sample week:

hard day / very easy or walking 2 days

easy or easy steady 2 days / easy 2 days / repeat

I usually just drink plenty of water before running in the mornings, but it helps to get a few calories when recovering or depleted. Examples are diluted orange juice (1/2 or 1/4 orange juice in water), a banana, a banana and a piece of bread.

Make sure you're going slow enough and recovering on recovery days.

Hey Mark...my apologies if that's not your name...

If you would be so kind...what kind of mileage are you doing now? Are you doing doubles?

Very nice run today. You certainly have endured for many years.

All the best...

The (now) masters runner who has run the most sub 3-hour marathons (forget his name) was profiled earlier this year in RT or RW and said his "secret" is running easy most days a week, with only one harder run per week.

Don't know if this will directly help your lack of energy, but may be worth a try (along with the basics like as much sleep/rest as possible, good nutrition and seeing doc for any underlying cause).

Thank you for all the great replies. I can identify with most of the responses. The idea of volume over speed is new to me though that is how I found success many years ago.

I had been trying to regain some speed because I have lost the ability to run any kind of decent pace over 200 meters.

I also like the idea of just one hard day a week.

Also the post about fast....crash is very much my experience. I feel I am getting in good shape..good tempo pace etc. Then I get sick and have to start at the beginning again. I have been through that cycle so many times

As a Masters runner it is easy to forget that we struggled to run on some days after a series of hard workouts when we were younger. Early in the spring in college there were often days were I could barely climb stairs because I was so tired.

I enjoy the intensity of workouts. I've totally eliminated the longer recovery runs. Easy days are 4 pretty slow miles and some cross training (this is the training I hate). I go hard every other day. Your body will adapt to what you train it to do. In reality your hard days might start with a lower amount of reps. Instead of running 6 X 1000m you might go with 4 x 1000. increase to 5 X when you adapt. Easy days have got to be easy. No running is better than over doing it.

12 years of pretty much injury free running as a master. sub 18 5K and sub 4:45 mile at over 50

If you want to race fast, I don't see how you can train slow.

Got me. Thanks for the kind words.

By this age, everyone has a different method.

Mine is to run by time, and aim to do more or less the same thing every day, not always with success. This past summer I was around 90-100 min /per day, nearly always doubles. This busy fall it was just once a day, from 40-120 min, usually 60-80min, depending on schedule. Everything on a flat 1.5 mile dirt loop. Starting from a crawl to just the right borderline effort, so that I'm working and having fun, but won't be trashed the next day. Concentrating on form, not speed.

@2x Around: That's a pretty fast mile for 50+. I can see why you'd need some speedwork for that. And I love intervals too, but my body doesn't. Anyway my current race paces are not that fast. My 5k race pace now is my tempo pace of yore. So after a few races my legs remember what to do, provided I can deliver the oxygen. And that's where the volume is essential.