York fails yet again at the Illinois state meet. Is Joe Newton washed up?

Sheesh... It's high school man. You coach who shows up. Talent cycles through. Other teams have good coaching now, talent, etc.

Did I say this is HS?

ovoregime wrote:

The Dukes' reign of dominance in Illinois XC appears to be OVER. Will Joe Newton go out with some dignity, or will the administration be forced to fire him for someone who can actually coach NOW and isn't resting on laurels?

Sad but true. York is done and Newton must go.

He just coached a freshman to a 14:36. Even if he is kern's son, there's never been a faster freshman in Illinois.

Man, at my HS they had to beg someone to coach XC. Everyone who held the position during my time there (three coaches in four years) had no XC coaching experience prior to that job and none had even run XC. Two of the guys had never even run 1 consecutive mile when hired (and that didn't change during their tenures). So the idea of a HS XC coach being fired for not winning the state title is completely foreign to me.

Appreciate what you have, Illinois high schoolers.

14:11 for the winner, pretty fine time for that course, considering that the top two of all time are virgin and verzbicas, not far ahead, and the 1A winner was particularly impressive, a junior running 14:20 well ahead of any others in the race, second fastest on the day all divisions:

1. Jon Davis Fithian (Oakwood) [Coop] Jr 14:20 4:47

jjjjjjjjj wrote:

14:11 for the winner, pretty fine time for that course, considering that the top two of all time are virgin and verzbicas, not far ahead, and the 1A winner was particularly impressive, a junior running 14:20 well ahead of any others in the race, second fastest on the day all divisions:

1. Jon Davis Fithian (Oakwood) [Coop] Jr 14:20 4:47

I hate to pick nits, but the top 2 of all time are virgin and derrick, with verzbicas close behind

Virgin: 13:50

Derrick: 13:52

Verzbicas: 13:54

This is from memory, so someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

rusder wrote:

Man, at my HS they had to beg someone to coach XC. Everyone who held the position during my time there (three coaches in four years) had no XC coaching experience prior to that job and none had even run XC. Two of the guys had never even run 1 consecutive mile when hired (and that didn't change during their tenures). So the idea of a HS XC coach being fired for not winning the state title is completely foreign to me.

Appreciate what you have, Illinois high schoolers.

THIS!

The Animal Within wrote:

Sheesh... It's high school man. You coach who shows up. Talent cycles through. Other teams have good coaching now, talent, etc.

Did I say this is HS?

exactly this. Too many other factors effect how the team does. If the football or soccer team is good last year, maybe some top athletes go there. Maybe the top kids got burnt studying like crazy for an AP class test the day before state. York is still a good team.

lol Illinois still won't run 5k...they think they're still in the 70s...idiots

So if failing to win the State meet constitutes "failure," that's a pretty high bar you're setting, my friend.

And didn't they win States in 2010 and 2012 . . . .

Not too shabby, my friend.

And maybe the other teams were just stronger? . . . Ever think on that, my friend?

I'm impressed not wrote:

So if failing to win the State meet constitutes "failure," that's a pretty high bar you're setting, my friend.

And didn't they win States in 2010 and 2012 . . . .

Not too shabby, my friend.

And maybe the other teams were just stronger? . . . Ever think on that, my friend?

While by no means York is finished... 6th place really they should be upset over that? maybe from the perspective of other years at York but by no means is the team finished.

Although they do seem to be in a bit of a dry spell team talent wise (although the new freshman could start the next wave of dominance)

First off in 2012 they won.

in 2013 they finished 5th (1 place higher than this year) but went in being ranked #1 even after losing their sectional meet and getting 2nd... then they became the first York team to not qualify for NXN since its start.

in 2014 they finished 6th this year though they got 5th in their sectional (last qualifying spot) by tyng with another team and having to go to 6th runners barely scraping by and into state.

The last 2 years havent been pretty for the once really dominant team, but they still did outstanding things that are only really bad from the perspective of their previous dominance. but again with HS talent ebbs and flows and with the arrival of Kern it looks like it may again start flowing for York.

Is the course even 3 miles? Every year they have crazy fast time even if you add the 30-35 seconds for a full 5k

York can't win the big one ... that's been known for a while.

Yeah.. when you realize Kern, a freshman is their best runner and Plowman is 2nd.. you can see why. 4:09 miler but can barely break 15.. what the heck.

9.2/10 funny and got several serious responses

Town Hall wrote:

Is the course even 3 miles? Every year they have crazy fast time even if you add the 30-35 seconds for a full 5k

I recall that there was some discrepancy based on the IHSA Measurement parameters change not too long ago.

Basically, a up until few years ago, the rule for Detweiller was that it had its length measured from 5 ft. out, which produced a perfect 3 mile or something like that since a group of civil engineers from a nearby University either measured or confirmed it.

However, a rule change set in that made it so HS XC courses would be measured from the shortest possible route, so presently, it's like 2.975 miles or something like that.

Overall, to get the perfect 3 mile (assuming that a runner is hugging the edge while running), just add like 6 seconds or so.

Seyta wrote:

Town Hall wrote:

Is the course even 3 miles? Every year they have crazy fast time even if you add the 30-35 seconds for a full 5k

I recall that there was some discrepancy based on the IHSA Measurement parameters change not too long ago.

Basically, a up until few years ago, the rule for Detweiller was that it had its length measured from 5 ft. out, which produced a perfect 3 mile or something like that since a group of civil engineers from a nearby University either measured or confirmed it.

However, a rule change set in that made it so HS XC courses would be measured from the shortest possible route, so presently, it's like 2.975 miles or something like that.

Overall, to get the perfect 3 mile (assuming that a runner is hugging the edge while running), just add like 6 seconds or so.

It's not 3 miles, but it's close enough (and who cares about exact distances, it's XC). This was the findings of the group of civil engineers you are talking about (in an article titled "The Detweiller Report" on Dyestat back in '08): Measured via Steel Tape and USATF (and current NFHS) SRP method it is ~4789 meters (~2.976 miles). Using the old NFHS 20' Center Path rule it was indeed ~4864 meters (~3.022 miles). They didn't use Steel Tape to measure the 12' Center Path rule, but they did Garmin that with a bike and found it to be 4820m (essentially 3 miles on the dot).

Also keep in mind that is incredibly difficult to run the tangents on that course in traffic especially during the first mile with unless you are in the lead. Even then not everybody does it.

They can't handle 5k. Too busy farming