People who think all the best runners are doping - why do you even watch?

Because people like to dream, and even though they know they're possibly watching cheaters, it's amazing to watch someone run really fast.

I got this question last year, and I realized I *don't* watch. I used to be an obsessive follower of The Sport, and now I generally can't be bothered. I'll watch my alma mater's conference meet, and that's about it.

I don't think it's the drugs per se; it's just not knowing whether the "winner" of a major competition will, in fact, still be the winner after the next few years of drug tests (and retests, with improved technology).

When I could see a dominating performance BITD, I took it at face value:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhkjIrzTiEA

Now, when I see a fine race like this one I simply can't appreciate it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ry8GWJMpIVQ

..."Will the winner keep his medal?"

cbenson4, this isn't about people who think they're "possibly" watching cheaters (probably always true), this is for the people who are convinced that almost all top runners are on drugs, who exist on this site.

Personally, I don't get any entertainment from watching someone run fast just for the sake of running fast. 2:02 and 2:09 are both far faster than I can imagine running for a marathon, I can't fathom the difference between those times anyways. I'd prefer to watch a competition with clean competitors to root for, even if the winning time was only 2:09. I think kibitzor gets the point I am making, it is much more fun when you can enjoy the competition without doubting everything.

"I'd prefer to watch a competition with clean competitors to root for, even if the winning time was only 2:09."How would you know if someone was doping, just by their time? It's not possible.You are assuming the fastest times are indicative of dopers while the 2:10 guys and 2:30 girls are the pure ones.Not true. Most of the Kenyans busted for doping were decent but hardly spectacular runners.

know-it-all joe wrote:

cbenson4, this isn't about people who think they're "possibly" watching cheaters (probably always true), this is for the people who are convinced that almost all top runners are on drugs, who exist on this site.

Personally, I don't get any entertainment from watching someone run fast just for the sake of running fast. 2:02 and 2:09 are both far faster than I can imagine running for a marathon, I can't fathom the difference between those times anyways. I'd prefer to watch a competition with clean competitors to root for, even if the winning time was only 2:09. I think kibitzor gets the point I am making, it is much more fun when you can enjoy the competition without doubting everything.

I am pretty sure that the top ten in the world in just about every event are on something that is either illegal or will be illegal in the future.

I watch to see the competition. It is a battle no matter what. I love to watch great battles. When Lance destroyed Jan Ullrich they were both doped to the gills. Anyone that really follows the sport knew that they were but it was still great to watch. 96 Olympic 10K, Geb vs Tergat, great battle. I would comfortably bet 100 dollars that they were both on the juice. It was still a great race.

I do not condone doping but I am realistic and see that since the 60's there have been drugs in sports. Enjoy the competition for what it is.

I no longer watch any distance-running events on TV. I do log onto to LetsRun every so often just to see which high-profile distance runner has tested positive for PEDs. Following this news is now more entertaining than watching who wins whatever race.

Shrugs wrote:

How would you know if someone was doping, just by their time? It's not possible.

I don't. I'm just saying, if I had the choice between watching honest runners or dishonest/cheating runners I would watch the clean ones even if they were only running 2:09. I don't care how fast the world record is, it is amazingly fast to me regardless.

Are You Stupid wrote:

I am pretty sure that the top ten in the world in just about every event are on something that is either illegal or will be illegal in the future.

I watch to see the competition. It is a battle no matter what. I love to watch great battles. When Lance destroyed Jan Ullrich they were both doped to the gills. Anyone that really follows the sport knew that they were but it was still great to watch. 96 Olympic 10K, Geb vs Tergat, great battle. I would comfortably bet 100 dollars that they were both on the juice. It was still a great race.

I do not condone doping but I am realistic and see that since the 60's there have been drugs in sports. Enjoy the competition for what it is.

Nothing is enjoyable about watching Lance destroy Ullrich -all it really does is prove that Lance's drug regime was a lot better htan Ullrich's drug regime. Wooo, give the doctors a trophy. At the time, I did not realize how bad drugs in cycling were, but knowing what I know now, I could not enjoy that competition.

You have no idea if Lance had a better drug plan. When it happened you thought it was a great competition. They all are on drugs. That does not make the competition any less compelling. Ullrich was the best the East Germans could build. For me, it is just man vs man, I like seeing the competition.

Are you stupid wrote:

You have no idea if Lance had a better drug plan. When it happened you thought it was a great competition. They all are on drugs. That does not make the competition any less compelling. Ullrich was the best the East Germans could build. For me, it is just man vs man, I like seeing the competition.

But sports are/were still advertised as a clean competition. Lance was still denying that he was using drugs. If you're a "fan" of Lance then it has to be insulting that he was lying to your and everyone's face (even if you didn't believe him), it's hard to root for anyone like that and hard to watch a sport if you don't have anyone to root for.

As long as runners are paid according to whether they win, runners will cheat. If drugs were legalized, drugs would be be viewed as just another part of an athlete's preparation. Good coaching, good nutrition, good pharmacist. I fear that PEDs will be legalised for the good of the sport, despite their adverse health effects.

I believe all top athletes in every sport "dope" to some degree. I actually buy Lance's explanation that "it's still a level playing field."

The items banned for "doping" are in some manners completely arbitrary. Why can one use ibuprofen and ice baths for recovery but not HGH? Things that were legal in the past (or at least, not illegal), are not illegal.

If I recall, didn't Rupp and Company use altitude tents and various forms of oxygen displacing gas to stimulate high altitude? Those things are now illegal, so does that mean Rupp had an unfair advantage (of course I know most LRCers already think that).

Then there is the argument about whether or not an athlete is a "better responder" to doping. This is also stupid reasoning. Athletes eat, sleep, rest, and train differently from each other so they can find what they "respond the best too." Even the concoction of "legal" stimulants and drugs are tailor-made.

At the end of the day, the runner still has to propel himself from point A to point B. The ideal of "natural" competition is a dead end street and not logical.

"Oh Please," that is completely off-topic for this thread. I don't care what your opinions on doping are, the issue is why would anyone be a fan of a sport that advertises itself as clean, and why would anyone root for athletes who are lying to the fans as Lance did when he competed.

For the record, if I were a pro athlete, I would much rather agree with my competitors that none of us would blood dope, so we could all avoid that dangerous and energy-consuming practice altogether while still having a fair competition. Ibuprofen on the other hand is nearly impossible to control so I don't care. It's not arbitrary. But that's just my opinion, I know others disagree.

But that is BESIDES the point. If you think all PED's should be legal, that's another story, good for you, that's not the world we're currently living in.

My post is the reason I like to follow professional running. I think the current view on doping is incorrect.

I'm not watching anymore. I think everyone will stop watching track and running because of the cheats.

I'm going to only watch professional wrestling. There's an honest competition - I can't remember a wrestler ever being suspended for PEDs. And I'll also watch strongman competitions.

I barely do. I'm more interested in high school and college running these days. At least it seems like there is some purity left at those levels.