Sub 3 marathon: wondering where to start

Well, I think everyone is different, so we can't exactly tell you for sure if it's possible. I think you'll know relatively soon after beginning running again whether or not you are capable of building up to 40-63 mpw, which is actually pretty low for a sub-3 marathoner. Given your abilities as a high schooler, it looks as if you were at least capable of sub-3 around that time. I have PRs of 5:06 1600 and 17:30 5k, both slower than your PRs, and I am more than capable of it (although I have not yet done it).

My advice would be just to start out with some easy running. If you have 8 months to build up, you don't have to run every day to start out, although if you feel like it, you probably could - you just have to make sure you don't overdo it. I'd say for the first month or so it's not necessary at all to do anything other than just easy running, because if you haven't run in 7 years, it'll take awhile to get back into it and speedwork or anything other than easy running might just get you injured.

So maybe start up your running and after a month or two see how it is going. Again, we can't tell you exactly how running again is going to go for you, so you kind of have to just see how it goes.

My mile PR was the same as yours, 4:44. I didn't run in college either. It took me a few tries (aka years) to finally break 3. I never liked the taper and always felt flat and heavy-legged on race day. My PR was 3:02 and then I switched to the Hal Higdon advanced training plan. I followed it to the letter. There seemed to be more emphasis on speedwork and less on hard and excessive long runs. That did the trick for me - my next race was a 17-minute PR when I ran 2:45 at Boston.

Sounds like you have time. I would recommend building your mileage gradually, no more than 5 percent per week. Get to 40 or 50 mpw. You need also to be doing some speedwork, even it is just some fartlek. If you just start 12 X 400s out of the blue you're bound to get injured.

Do some racing to track your progress and test yourself about every month or two. Realistically, you need to be racing 6 minutes per mile in 5Ks to break 3 hours.

Setbacks are going to happen. Don't push or train through an injury. It never works.

mattyb11 wrote:

My question is, what should I do to get in shape for this program and is it possible to build up to it over the next 8 months without risking injury?

You should run 4 or 5 times a week and be at about 40-45 mpw when the program starts. I don't see why you couldn't build up to 40-45 mpw in 8 months.

I will also say that my times are similar to yours and it took me several times to break 3 hours. Quite frankly, I would not shoot for sub 3 the first time. While you are ultimately capable, I think it may take more than a year to get where you need to be in terms of aerobic development. You have the speed and you have the talent. What you don't have is the endurance. I think it may take more than a year to get there. Also, it took me more than 63 mpw to get there. Good luck.

You can absolutely break 3 at Chicago 2015. I went from being out of shape to breaking 3 in a year, and I was 10 years older than you.

Don't overthink it. I would focus on easy runs for now, and I would try to run 7 days a week for as long as you can keep that streak up. Even if it means 2-3 miles a day. Your focus right now should be rebuilding your running habit. Once you get used to lacing up your running shoes every day, things get a lot easier. You stop looking for excuses not to run. I think many people get tripped up by bailing out of runs with poor excuses, and the next thing they know they're back on the couch.

Once running became habitual again, I steadily increased mileage, mostly focusing on easy miles and long runs for a while. Speed didn't come until I'd reached a mileage base I thought sufficient and my easy run pace got faster.

Hansons is a good program, but I'd remain open to what else is out there. I went with Pfitz 18/70.

Good luck.

You should not have a problem breaking 3 as long as you stay healthy. You first need to prepare yourself for the 18 week program. Just start out with easy steady running. Consistency is key. You have a lot of time to build up so take your time and don't rush it. I would try to get to a point where you can do 60mpw a week comfortably. Add in some tempo runs as your fitness starts building. As you get closer to starting the program add in some good hill work to prepare the body for the 400s.

Getting your body used to the pounding is going to be the biggest issue. If you have not been playing any sports that involve a lot of running (basketball, soccer, flag football, etc.), your body is not going to be happy about going from 15 mpw to 40-60 with hard marathon workouts. I went from very little running (20-30 mpw off and on) to training for a marathon and had piles of injuries and aches and pains the first few years. It took me four years to get a sub 3 marathon even though my third marathon was 3:08.

To answer your question, you should be running lots and lots of hills before you start your marathon program (and keep running hill workouts during your marathon program). You get more cardio bang for your buck doing hill workouts and minimize the pounding on your legs because the pace is slower compared to the effort level on flat ground. Hills are also great for your form and to make sure you are not developing muscle imbalances.

Otherwise, get up to 40 mpw as soon as you can. Do not worry about pace at all when you are not doing a workout. Always start out your runs jogging super easy and pick up the pace only after at least 5 min of easy running. Be very careful doing any stretching. Tendons and muscles that are adjusting to the new demands of distance running are very, very, very easily injured by over stretching.

bump. Chicago 2015 is this weekend. OP around by chance? Post results?

Why'd I bump this thread? Well, I was searching advice on breaking three hours. There really aren't many threads on it.

All of the above was good advice. I do training plans for runners and my plans have been based around Hal Higdons advanced plan. Training plans are great but you need to adapt them around your own life. Rest is important after tough sessions although Higdon does have the long run after a tempo believing there is a value in doing the long run on tired legs.

I play around with the long run, sometimes just doing it slow, other times doing a few miles at marathon pace at the end. Before the training started I would aim to be doing a 15 mile long run every week so you have a good base to work from.

There are lots of little things that can help you. Try to run, at least in races, in the lightest trainers that you can. Have regular physio, I go every 4 weeks, you'll know your own body and how much you need or can afford. Do a little bit of core / strength work. Runners are terrible for missing this out. Think about what you eat and if you're doing 60 miles plus then get used to using recovery drinks.

Get involved with a club with a good coach if you can.

I've never truly followed a plan, although I based my training on Pfitz 18/55. My trick was running roughly 40 miles a week with about half of them at marathon pace and the other half a bit slower. A mid week Tempo and a weekend long run, with a few short marathon paced runs in between seems to get me comfortable at the pace. I realize this is not a typical method, but it worked for me.

For the first time, I'm trying a higher mileage (60 miles), slower pace with tougher workouts once per week. I'm about 5 weeks out and I feel less prepared than my prior workout plans. Granted, I've missed some important workouts due to work or just laziness. I think I'll still break 3.

I know people that have had success with Higdon and Pfitz. I think the key is picking a plan and sticking to it. Can't beat consistency. Just make sure you do the tough days. You have an uphill battle but based on your old PRs, you easily have the ability.

Breaking 3 is a worthy goal, lots of decent advice on this thread. Here is my advice for what it's worth:

-pick a marathon that's held in cool weather. Regardless of how well you train the weather will affect your marathon more than any other race you will run. If it's hot or even warm at the start, you will be toast.

- pick a race with a favorable course. Hand in hand with the weather is the course. Find a race that's "honest", doesn't have to be pancake flat, but don't find one that really hilly and then wonder why you missed your goal. Set yourself up for success.

- run more miles. I went from the typical "just finish" marathon prep where I ran dinky mileage then did a long run on Sat. to adding a mid-week longer run and just over all more mileage per week.

-Run smart. Don't "bank time" go for the negative split.

Good luck.

I'll go out on a limb here and say that he either isn't doing the race, or he is but he hasn't trained for it and won't get near 3h.

Lots of people post once with some lofty goal, then are never heard of again. You can be sure that if he was in sub3 form, he would have dug out this thread himself!

I usually start with the left foot because I prefer to push off my right foot. I'm a righty.

chicago 2015 marathon wrote:

bump. Chicago 2015 is this weekend. OP around by chance? Post results?

Why'd I bump this thread? Well, I was searching advice on breaking three hours. There really aren't many threads on it.

It is next weekend, not this weekend. It would be interesting if OP reports.

I'm at 23 BMI. Clearly the easiest route seems to go to a still healthy 20 BMI. That would immediately put my 10ks under 36 and hopefully make 2:59 a cake piece.