Botched a marathon - try again 4 weeks later?

I have turned around in 8 weeks before when I crashed and burned. I raced about 16 miles and jogged it in after multiple problems from the weather to stomach to cramping hip flexors. I was able to go out the next week and do a 18 mile long run with decent pace. The next race was pretty close to my target (2:48 for the good one, 2:59 for the bad one).

The main problem with running just 4 weeks apart is losing fitness in the taper and recovery. If you recover very quickly (no soreness, can run well the week after), I think you can take a shot at it. If you are sore and it takes more than a two or three days to get back to normal, 4 weeks may be pushing it.

How many marathons have you run before, and over what period? What did you or didn't you do that you blew up in the race? At what point in the race did you die? Why is the spring too far away?

How old are you? You have your whole life to run 2:59.

No kidding. 3:17 and 2:59 are, like, the same.

Now a Coach wrote:

How old are you? You have your whole life to run 2:59.

Ran 5 marathons now. 3.42, 3.47, 3.32, 3.08, 3.17. Since April 2013.

My excuses and reasons are all self inflicted. I trained hard then let myself down in the days leading up to it. Basically turned at the start line, late, exhausted and feeling like crap. Knew it was going to be a bad day when I started having DNF thoughts at 10k.

I've had some breakthroughs this year (by jogger standards) so would like to see the effect on my marathon time. Hoping to improve by spring but would like to do something before then.

30 years old.

3 hrs has been a personal goal for the last 6-8 months. I'd like to tick the box then perhaps, switch to 5k/10k for a while just to see the effects of Daniels training on those times.

That happened to the guy who won the Denver marathon a few years ago. He went to Chicago and ran when the year it was 75 and humid and bombed, so he came back to Colorado and WON (I believe) the Denver marathon. The two races were only 3 or 4 weeks apart if I recall.

How hard an effort did you put into the 3:17? I'd be careful about putting too much strain on your body

I ran Chicago in 11 and bonked in the heat but soldiered on the last 5 miles chasing a time goal. Missed by 20 minutes. Ran Philly 5 weeks later; beat my Chicago time by 3 mins, but began really laboring at mile 17.

Basically 2 full effort marathons 5 weeks apart, and I've never been the same since. Easily fatigued, no pop in legs. Been this way for three years now.

My advice would be take a break, start anew and go for it in the spring

Sounds like you're overtrained. Running another marathon in 4 weeks sounds like the exact opposite of the right next step.

I ran Boston in 2013, cramped badly coming down Heartbreak Hill and ended up jogging the last five miles. I never got to the running on fumes feeling I get at the end of a marathon, it was more like a hard 20 mile training run with a long cool down. I figured I could run another one as soon as my quads recovered so 20 days later I did - on essentially no additional training - and it was fine, about what I expected to do at Boston in the first place.

ordersofmagnitude wrote:

Sounds like you're overtrained. Running another marathon in 4 weeks sounds like the exact opposite of the right next step.

I can see how you got to that but the part that I left out was that I was last man at the bar on the Friday night (best man at a friend's wedding). Due to writing the speech last minute and travelling to the race, I basically slept 16 hours over three days. The travel and wedding meant my carb loading was utter crap. No sympathy sought here, btw - all of my own doing. Still felt hungover on the start line!

Had a great time at the wedding, though!

My average pace was 7:29/mi. Not far off Daniels 'Easy' pace.

I was hoping that I could just consider the botched marathon as a long run.

three weeks later wrote:

I ran Boston in 2013, cramped badly coming down Heartbreak Hill and ended up jogging the last five miles. I never got to the running on fumes feeling I get at the end of a marathon, it was more like a hard 20 mile training run with a long cool down. I figured I could run another one as soon as my quads recovered so 20 days later I did - on essentially no additional training - and it was fine, about what I expected to do at Boston in the first place.

That's almost exactly how my race went. Didn't have cramp, though, just chucked it mentally and decided I would run whatever pace I could muster. Stopped looking at my watch etc.

Depends on how fast you can recover and your prior long runs

I had been training to run 2:29 for Boston this year. Went out in 1:14 and crashed at 16 -- jogged in the final 10 for a 2:50.

I made the mistake of trying to get back too quickly and didn't take care of myself by getting massages and all.

Ran the Green Bay marathon in 2:47. Faster, yes, but not near what the shape I was would say I could do.

That being said, I had 22, 24 and 27 mile training runs leading up to Boston. And my fall marathon this year, I'll have had 18, 18, 23, 26, 26, 24 leading up to it. The 2nd 26 may actually end up being the Twin Cities marathon if I decide to do it with the first half racing (at HM pace) then jogging the 2nd half.

I think wrote:

How hard an effort did you put into the 3:17? I'd be careful about putting too much strain on your body

I ran Chicago in 11 and bonked in the heat but soldiered on the last 5 miles chasing a time goal. Missed by 20 minutes. Ran Philly 5 weeks later; beat my Chicago time by 3 mins, but began really laboring at mile 17.

Basically 2 full effort marathons 5 weeks apart, and I've never been the same since. Easily fatigued, no pop in legs. Been this way for three years now.

My advice would be take a break, start anew and go for it in the spring

I was surprised to finish in 3.17 (due to giving up so early). Think I ran the last 12 miles at 7:30 pace or slower. That's what has given me a little hope.

illinoisphotographer wrote:

Depends on how fast you can recover and your prior long runs

I had been training to run 2:29 for Boston this year. Went out in 1:14 and crashed at 16 -- jogged in the final 10 for a 2:50.

Wow. What was your stand-alone half time, prior to Boston?

I botched the NYC marathon badly last year, wanted to break 3, went out in 1:28 cramped badly mile 16 and tanked to a 3:09. Was in 1hr 20 min half shape, came back and ran Philly just 2 weeks later in 3:08. 4 weeks is plenty of time to run another marathon, maybe try to break 3:05 this time since you won't be on full rest. Chip away at that sub 3.

Reg fields wrote:

I botched the NYC marathon badly last year, wanted to break 3, went out in 1:28 cramped badly mile 16 and tanked to a 3:09. Was in 1hr 20 min half shape, came back and ran Philly just 2 weeks later in 3:08. 4 weeks is plenty of time to run another marathon, maybe try to break 3:05 this time since you won't be on full rest. Chip away at that sub 3.

Seems like good advice. I'm less hopeful of sub three than before but a PB would be nice!

No. You should have dropped out of your crappy marathon by mile 18 or so (or did the wheels come off after that?)

kipisfast wrote:

No. You should have dropped out of your crappy marathon by mile 18 or so (or did the wheels come off after that?)

Wheels came off much earlier.... Can't say if it was just before or just after halfway.

Dropping out would have made the next attempt much easier but it would also have meant dropping out.