Best D1 school for medical or physics that's not an ivy

SUNY Harlem is a great school.

I’d say University of Colorado.

3 Nobel laureates in the last decade in physics, very well known in the physics community as one of the top places to study physics. NOAA and NCAR are also there, which brings tons of world-class physicists to the area. You want to be around this if you’re interested in physics. Caltech, MIT, Berkely, U.chicago, Harvey Mudd, UCSB are also excellent, but not great d1 xc/track like CU.

I think I read once Ben Sareel is a physics major there.

As far as pre-med goes, who cares. I would go with an easier school (Oregon for example, CU is very rigorous science wise). In terms of education, they’re all more or less the same. You take bio, chem, ochem, calc, and maybe one or two others, so really you want to go where grade inflation is the highest because getting into med school is more about your GPA, MCAT, and shadowing/volunteering. I would look at largest grade inflation for science majors (typically expensive small private schools) and cross match this with running stats.

Nothing you do undergrad will really help you for a career in medicine, except maybe working at a hospital as an employed tech. even volunteer work won’t really get you the experience you need.

The caliber of the faculty is completely irrelevant to undergrad studies in physics. I don't understand how you understand this for pre-med but you somehow think it is different for other physical sciences. Physics is physics.

For academics, CU > UofO

University of North Carolin, University of Wisconsin, University of Minnesota

Michigan, CAL, UVA, Georgetown, Duke, Wake Forest

I disagree - there are still generally research opportunities and the chance to take some graduate courses for undergraduates in physics who are especially high performing. You can get a basic physics education anywhere but schools with programs encouraging undergraduate research or who have a breadth of research laboratories will provide a better overall experience to the very top students.

That said, the presence of Nobel laureates on the faculty is not necessarily a strong indicator that there will be research opportunities for undergrads or that there will be upper level courses that are accessible.

mech eng grad student wrote:

I disagree - there are still generally research opportunities and the chance to take some graduate courses for undergraduates in physics who are especially high performing. You can get a basic physics education anywhere but schools with programs encouraging undergraduate research or who have a breadth of research laboratories will provide a better overall experience to the very top students.

That said, the presence of Nobel laureates on the faculty is not necessarily a strong indicator that there will be research opportunities for undergrads or that there will be upper level courses that are accessible.

So you disagree with me but then agree with me

Medical schools often take a disproportionate number of their own undergraduates. Look into the states with large public medical schools, eg Texas or Ohio.

pleaaaaze wrote:

As far as pre-med goes, who cares. I would go with an easier school (Oregon for example, CU is very rigorous science wise). In terms of education, they’re all more or less the same. You take bio, chem, ochem, calc, and maybe one or two others, so really you want to go where grade inflation is the highest because getting into med school is more about your GPA, MCAT, and shadowing/volunteering. I would look at largest grade inflation for science majors (typically expensive small private schools) and cross match this with running stats.

Nothing you do undergrad will really help you for a career in medicine, except maybe working at a hospital as an employed tech. even volunteer work won’t really get you the experience you need.

I disagree with this also. There's a very strong chance that you'll go to college thinking you want to become a physician (or even graduate having already taken the MCATs and finished your pre-med requirements) and change your mind. In the event that you decide not to pursue medical school (or are unable to because of grades/MCAT scores) it would be helpful to have a strong degree to fall back on.

As examples, I have two former teammates from college who majored in Chem-E and Community Health/Latin American Studies, respectively, but both completed all of the necessary pre-med requirements. The former is now in logistics at a major brewery and the latter works for in economic development for a major US city. Similarly, my brother graduated from college with a degree in economics but having done all of his pre-med requirements, having taken the MCAT, and having trained and worked as an EMT. He worked in consulting for two years before going to med school and ultimately realized he never really wanted to be a physician, it just seemed like a cool thing to do (and then dropped out).

I have another college teammate who majored in Chem-E too, but went to work in a research lab after graduating. He ultimately decided to take pre-med courses in night school and just started med school this fall four years after graduating from college.

TL;DR

Even if you think you want to go to med school you could change your mind. It's better to hedge your bets and get a degree you can fall back on if necessary.

staller wrote:

mech eng grad student wrote:

I disagree - there are still generally research opportunities and the chance to take some graduate courses for undergraduates in physics who are especially high performing. You can get a basic physics education anywhere but schools with programs encouraging undergraduate research or who have a breadth of research laboratories will provide a better overall experience to the very top students.

That said, the presence of Nobel laureates on the faculty is not necessarily a strong indicator that there will be research opportunities for undergrads or that there will be upper level courses that are accessible.

So you disagree with me but then agree with me

"Physics is physics" seems to imply that any school's physics departments will have similar opportunities for undergraduates. I disagree with that sentiment.

NOAA and NCAR are nothing compared to NIST

2001 - CU-Boulder's Distinguished Professor Carl Wieman and CU-Boulder and NIST's Eric Cornell won the physics prize for creating a new form of matter called Bose-Einstein condensate, which could lead to the creation of precise measuring devices and lasers that could dispense beams of atoms for micro-assembly purposes.

2005 - CU-Boulder and NIST's John (Jan) Hall won the physics prize for his contributions to the development of laser-based precision spectroscopy, including the optical frequency comb technique.

2012 - CU-Boulder and NIST physicist David Wineland won the Nobel for his discovery of the ability to trap electrically charged atoms, or ions, and control and measure them with light, or photons, without destroying them. Wineland shared the prize with French researcher Serge Haroche.

staller wrote:

The caliber of the faculty is completely irrelevant to undergrad studies in physics. I don't understand how you understand this for pre-med but you somehow think it is different for other physical sciences. Physics is physics.

It really helps getting into grad school if you've done undergrad research and your letters of recommendation come from respected people in your field.

stanford for physics, duke for pre-med

oh, just saw you don't want stanford. berkeley then

these are the best in terms of academics while remaining D1. if you want the best D1 while also having decent academics, then I dunno

Rice.

UVA

Well yeah, of course. But the kid is asking for the best place to go for pre-med with good running, not how to set himself up if he decides not to go to med school. so while you give great overall life advice which is true in many ways, you’re not really answering his question which is pretty direct. A simple acknowledgment of this and I would agree with you completely.

Most people who actually go to medical school know early on, and then it becomes about getting in. You’re competing against people whose only goal in life is med school. They take easy courses and start on the path freshmen year. They volunteer tons, get letters, are part of pre-med committees, and plan extremely well. Many have parents who are physicians to guide them through the process. It gets harder and harder every year, you absolutely need to give yourself every chance to succeed and avoid getting any mediocre grades at all costs. You cannot predict how the MCAT will go, but if you can score a 29 even and have great everything else, you’ll get in somewhere. 29 with a 3.7 GPA you’re not looking so good anymore.

I was a Biochem major, and took through calc 3 and P.Chem. While I did fantastic in these and all other science courses, it came at the expense of BS subjective requisite courses like “ancient rome” and “Scandinavian folklore” which were very labor intensive, but as a D1 runner working in a lab, I didn’t have time to pour effort into this nonsense. And I would absolutely recommend that the OP not get B’s if they don’t have to. Learn as much as you want, put in effort, but after you’ve secured your A’s in all of your courses. Could the OP be one of those cool people like your friends who can take an alternative route to med school? sure, but you will be the exception and fight an uphill battle if you don’t have above a 3.6 GPA and above a 32 MCAT, thats just how it is.

For the record, my education in hard sciences is more valuable to me now than my medical school education, which was pure memorization, and even now just experience. Learning how to methodically solve difficult problems as well as learning how to think is the best thing college gave me, and I’m exceedingly grateful for it. Most people (especially doctors) could not solve a tricky math problem on the fly, but they likely memorized their way through undergrad, an other reason exceptional teachers are so valuable.

Regarding the other poster about physics grad programs: I think you’re very wrong about this. Being surrounded by a culture of excellence absolutely trickles down to your education. Many of the exceptional faculty researchers (especially in physics) make education a top priority, and often will teach introductory courses. Even at large institutions, you will interact with these people if you put in effort. I got my strongest letter of recommendation for medical school from a nobel laureate in physics, so I can imagine what that would do for physics related grad school and job opportunities. I also became friends with multiple physicists in the community over the years I was in my college town, and still have strong connections with them. If I ever wanted, this could be extremely valuable toward a career in that area. You’ll get randomly connected with esteemed researchers who will become friends and tell you about their research, what is new in the field, the undercurrents of what is happening, etc. Sure the books are the same at every institution, but how it is taught and what is made of it between classes is what matters.

Chowan College is known in academic circles "the school of doctors".

Check it out.

Sorry for the very late reply, but as far as grades go I have a 3.97 unweighted and have only had 1 B due to transportation to school circumstances and have scored a 32 act. I prefer not to pot my athletic accomplishments due to fear of being called a troll. Are these the type of grades expected by a pre-med scholar or do I need more credentials.