Malmo high school advice

I don't think you should start adding doubles now that your season has started. You should have done them throughout the summer if at all. Now is the time to listen to your HS coach. There has to be trust between the athlete and the coach, don't go into your season with doubt in your program.

samscasino wrote:I want to improve and from what I've heard I should get up early 3-4 days a week and do an easy couple miles before my actual run after school at practice.

That's about right. 3-4 days a week, 2-3 miles at first. Get into a routine. Once into a routine try 3-4 miles. Live like a clock.

malmo wrote:

samscasino wrote:I want to improve and from what I've heard I should get up early 3-4 days a week and do an easy couple miles before my actual run after school at practice.

That's about right. 3-4 days a week, 2-3 miles at first. Get into a routine. Once into a routine try 3-4 miles. Live like a clock.

Ok Bruce Denton. You stole that from one of John L. Parkers novels.

Positive Contribution wrote:

malmo wrote:

That's about right. 3-4 days a week, 2-3 miles at first. Get into a routine. Once into a routine try 3-4 miles. Live like a clock.

Ok Bruce Denton. You stole that from one of John L. Parkers novels.

If I had said those words, you might say I stold them from a novel. But in Malmo's case, he knows what he's talking about and they could just as well be his words. Look up George Malley and see his accomplishments.

Positive Contribution wrote:

Ok Bruce Denton. You stole that from one of John L. Parkers novels.

wasn't "live like a clock" attributed to old-school villanova coach jumbo elliott in again to carthage?

running is better wrote:

Positive Contribution wrote:

Ok Bruce Denton. You stole that from one of John L. Parkers novels.

wasn't "live like a clock" attributed to old-school villanova coach jumbo elliott in again to carthage?

it was from jumbo elliott

Exactly! There are very few people on these boards who lived it and accomplished great things. I guess the notion of respecting those who have been there flies out the window with some. In any case, Malmo has been there, done it, and been extremely helpful with advice. That is something to pay attention to.

But he probably HEARD IT from Jumbo Elliott.

Positive Contribution wrote:

Ok Bruce Denton. You stole that from one of John L. Parkers novels.

Once a Runner was published in 1978. I've never read it. Once a Runner is fiction. I was living like a clock 8 years before anyone ever heard of John L. Parker.

jjjjjjjjj wrote:

But he probably HEARD IT from Jumbo Elliott.

Yes. But 3-4 years AFTER I lived it.

Here is my own version: The day that getting up and running in the dark, cold, rain becomes completely ordinary to you, that's the day that you can call yourself a runner.

coach wrote:

I don't think you should start adding doubles now that your season has started. You should have done them throughout the summer if at all. Now is the time to listen to your HS coach. There has to be trust between the athlete and the coach, don't go into your season with doubt in your program.

This is the right answer for right now, outside of adding extra mileage to the end of practice each day. OP will continue to improve doing what he's doing, along with racing. It's a little late in the game for an 18:00 guy to make huge changes for this season.

However, there's nothing stopping him from adding those doubles this winter and doing SoM next summer.

As a junior running 30-40 mpw, yes, adding a few morning runs is likely to help you improve. As a HS runner you probably are not in a position to alter your regular afternoon workouts... otherwise I would suggest making your tempos a little longer (15 min is pretty short for a tempo, but paired with a 20-25 min tempo its fine). You also mention no intervals or race-pace work but I am guessing you just haven't begun that stuff yet in August.

You have little to lose by putting more into it... adding some morning runs works for most people who try it. Be gradual. If you added 4 morning at 2 miles each, that is a 20% increase over your current mileage.

This week: 2 days of 2-3 miles am.

Next week: 3 days of 2-3 am.

Following week 2-3 days.

Then see how you're feeling.

And Malmo's opinion on this is worth more than mine.

Johnny Rotten wrote:

coach wrote:

I don't think you should start adding doubles now that your season has started. You should have done them throughout the summer if at all. Now is the time to listen to your HS coach. There has to be trust between the athlete and the coach, don't go into your season with doubt in your program.

This is the right answer for right now, outside of adding extra mileage to the end of practice each day. OP will continue to improve doing what he's doing, along with racing. It's a little late in the game for an 18:00 guy to make huge changes for this season.

However, there's nothing stopping him from adding those doubles this winter and doing SoM next summer.

Both of you are wrong. Doing doubles in the winter or next Summer does absolutely nothing for the immediate 2 months.

malmo wrote:

Johnny Rotten wrote:

This is the right answer for right now, outside of adding extra mileage to the end of practice each day. OP will continue to improve doing what he's doing, along with racing. It's a little late in the game for an 18:00 guy to make huge changes for this season.

However, there's nothing stopping him from adding those doubles this winter and doing SoM next summer.

Both of you are wrong. Doing doubles in the winter or next Summer does absolutely nothing for the immediate 2 months.

No, you are wrong. Adding mileage while he's already begun workouts--to the tune of a pair of tempos per week--and while he's about to begin racing season makes him risk massive overtraining and injury, all the while he's trying to be a student. The better option for him clearly involves gaining as much as he can out of the workouts and races that are on his plate for the next two months.

You've got a massive case of hyperbole and exxagge r ation. Mourning runs are by default low impact and low stress. They do not add any risk of injury. In fact, they will reduce the risk of injury.

Hundreds of thousands of runners in the previoys decades have proven you are incorrect.

Johnny Rotten wrote:

malmo wrote:

Both of you are wrong. Doing doubles in the winter or next Summer does absolutely nothing for the immediate 2 months.

No, you are wrong. Adding mileage while he's already begun workouts--to the tune of a pair of tempos per week--and while he's about to begin racing season makes him risk massive overtraining and injury, all the while he's trying to be a student. The better option for him clearly involves gaining as much as he can out of the workouts and races that are on his plate for the next two months.

im getting good laugh out of this comment. You are talking to a 2:12 marathoner. He's wrong? I think YOU are wrong. Malmo knows what he's doing bro

Show me the hyperbole, and show me the evidence that you're right that a few weeks of doubles are going to have an impact on this season--do that, and I will be the first in line to say that you are, indeed, correct. I don't see it.

The scores of kids who have run doubles over the decades and been champion runners do, in fact, exist. A number of them run on my team or have run on my teams over the past decade plus. I'm not arguing the excellence of doubles. I'm arguing that the payoff versus the risk for about six weeks worth of added mileage during a season that's already begun while running his coach's workout plan and races plus school isn't worth it this late in the game. If this were July 30 rather than August 30 I'd be the first on board, but it's not.

gottobekiddingme wrote:

im getting good laugh out of this comment. You are talking to a 2:12 marathoner. He's wrong? I think YOU are wrong. Malmo knows what he's doing bro

Malmo was an excellent runner. No doubt about that. That has very little to do with the quality of his advice in is instance. He told me I was wrong, I told him he was wrong. Then, if things work out, we get to argue our points of view as rational people.

Johnny Rotten wrote:

gottobekiddingme wrote:

im getting good laugh out of this comment. You are talking to a 2:12 marathoner. He's wrong? I think YOU are wrong. Malmo knows what he's doing bro

Malmo was an excellent runner. No doubt about that. That has very little to do with the quality of his advice in is instance. He told me I was wrong, I told him he was wrong. Then, if things work out, we get to argue our points of view as rational people.

FWIW, I am a senior in high school. I was doubling from mid April-Late June when I was in a bike accident of a driver texting and hit me. Put me out for 7 weeks. I am back now and finally my fitness is back. I started doubles 3 times a week in addition to my cross country team's workouts (2 hard workouts a week with a Saturday race every week). Doubling has only been helping me so far, no injuries or signs of anything.