STEM fields are great, but don't expect a career that will make you rich.

Yep, it is true that many STEM fields (including medicine) offer a reasonable guarantee of a good paying job but the ceiling is somewhat limited. This is true even in your example of surgery where there is no such thing as a promotion per se (although it is possible to accrue a lot of wealth via passive income streams extraneous to the actual clinical practice of medicine or to simply leave clinical medicine for administration).

Make That Money wrote:

I went back to work in marketing for a chemical company and love what I do.

Many people, including myself, could not IMAGINE loving a job in marketing. I am not sure how I could force myself out of bed and into the office everyday. Unless you're really passionate about what you are marketing. So chemicals for you?

I work for a semiconductor company. Looking out into the parking lot from my sweet corner office, I see the following: 2013 Ford F150, 2013 Toyota Highlander, BMW X3, BMW sedan ?, Lexus something or other, Mini Cooper, Cadillac Escalade, GMC Yukon XLT, Mercedes SLK350, Harley, Harley, Harley, ... the engineers here are not rich, but they live very comfortably. 95% couldn't market ice water in the desert, and most couldn't manage anything other than their design tools.

Southporter wrote:

Many people, including myself, could not IMAGINE loving a job in marketing. I am not sure how I could force myself out of bed and into the office everyday. Unless you're really passionate about what you are marketing. So chemicals for you?

No, I understand. I work for a group that makes lubricants for large manufacturing equipment, so I get to work around engineers and still mess around with the engineering side. It's not like I am writing copy for tampons or something ;) The work I do is b2b. I am not in advertising.

I like problem solving, and one of the big things I get to do is better the process of articulating why our products are better than competitors.

I have no issue with engineers. I just noticed that a lot of my co-workers - particularly the older ones - seemed really frustrated with their lot and it resonated early with me, which was why I went back to school.

how old were you. Unfortunately, I never made the change. Is it too late over 40?

You can become rich in engineering; I know many who have. Start your own company or get lucky at a startup.

I teach at a large engineering school, and the number of students that are Computer Science graduates and starting at 80-100k/year is staggering.

There are very few super or ultra high paying jobs in engineering (the $200k+ per year type jobs). However, there are virtually infinite well paying (even at the entry level) secure jobs with good annual progression. Making 50-70k out of college and getting an annual bonus greater than inflation, coupled with halfway decent investing, means a very reasonable lifestyle and early retirement. Further, if you enjoy the work, it can be very fulfilling (problem solving on a daily basis, contributing in a meaningful way to products you and others come to depend on, etc).

There are probably more multi-millionaires and billionaires in business, but there are also probably a whole lot more flops who struggle for a lifetime. It's all about risk-reward...

Make That Money wrote:

...

If you want to make a lot of money and retire young, go for a business degree outside of counting beans

...

I was a chemical engineer and went back for an MBA after working for three years and watching the marketing and management guys shoot up the ladder. I went back to work in marketing for a chemical company and love what I do.

So what you are saying is:

1) STEM degrees don't get you jobs that pay a lot of money.

2) Your position-- which is marketing chemicals-- pays a lot of money.

Is it possible that you get paid a lot of money to market chemicals because you have that STEM degree?

Engineering undergrads comprise the highest percentage of Fortune 500 CEOs. Being able to solve complex problems (or at least understanding how to get to the root cause of problems) is paramount in managing projects/companies/etc. Add some business/finance training, a good personality, and some drive, and you will be in demand.

A large majority of engineers though don't want to deal with the business aspect of the company and are perfectly happy making $100K+.

I have to disagree. I lot of my engineering buddies are filthy rich too.

the richest guy I know personally (net worth ~30-40m) has a BS in Psychology from a sh*tty public university

they may start that high, but they won't make much more than that. that's the whole point OP was making and he is right. You top out in earnings fast.

another eng. wrote:

they may start that high, but they won't make much more than that. that's the whole point OP was making and he is right. You top out in earnings fast.

That strongly depends on what you do and whether you're willing to change jobs a few times throughout your career. You can also get around that plateau by getting an advanced degree (MS or MBA, PhD if you really love the subject).

To each his own. I work in a field that's known for being one of the least lucrative engineering fields, and I made more money fresh out of college than any of my non-engineering friends. There's still a ladder to climb, and I'll likely make six figures eventually. Maybe it's because I grew up in a family that always lived paycheck to paycheck, but that seems like good money to me, especially when you consider the fact that engineering makes for a pretty stable career.

This is so incorrect. No major is a direct path to 500k+ wealth, but literally every one of these majors has common opportunities for climbing that high. Engineering seems to be the focus of your post, and while it's probably the most limiting, you OFTEN hear about engineers promoted to extremely well-paying administrative roles.

OP Here.

It looks like some of you misunderstood my original point (probably my fault).

I am assuming - all things equal - that we are all engineers (or aspiring engineers). I am not advising people to skip an engineering degree.

I just wanted to note that in my experience, it was not the engineers (by profession) who climbed the ladder. Of course you can make six figures shortly after school, but that is not much in today's world. You'll be working until you're 80 and forget private schools or paying for college.

My STEM education DEFINITELY helped me secure my current role - no question - but my point was that if you want to make real money, you'll have to go another route. That route could be entrepreneurial, no doubt.

Honestly, I just wanted kids in school to know that while $75k sounds like the moon out of school, it isn't much once you're paying a mortgage and tuition. We can have the argument that private school are terrible another day; my point is that you will not be able to afford these types of things if you simply pursue engineering. This irritated a lot of my former co-workers who felt like they deserved more than the business guys. I saw it too, and now I can work in my chosen field while also managing to make a lot of money. Just food for thought.

dumb wrote:

This is true even in your example of surgery where there is no such thing as a promotion per se

Medicine/surgery might have the most formalized system of promotions of any non-military career.

I understand your point completely and as a someone stuck in this field at a mediocre salary, I 100% agree with you. I also agree 100% that 75k-150k is not much with mortgages and cost of housing these days. Private school? Forget about it..

The problem is most of us don't have the charisma to make the shift to marketing or business type roles.